Useless Exotics: How could Bungie fix them?

We all know there are a few exotics out there that suck (Super Good Advice, No Land Beyond, Universal Remote, etc.). I realize that some people think the exotics I listed previously may be some of your favorites, but let's think rationally here:

You have a choice between using SGA or Thunderlord, 10/10 times I'd go with Thunderlord. How about between using Bad Juju and Red Death...it depends. That's the key. When deciding between exotics we should always think "it depends".

Universal Remote:
Pro: You have a shotty as your main gun
Con: Almost every other shotty is better than it

The problem with this exotic is that other LEGENDARY shotguns perform better than it almost always. An exotic shouldn't be outclassed by a legendary even if you change it's equip slot to primary. The Mythoclast wasn't nerfed because it was a primary, infact it performs better than most primary weapons. I think the Universal Remote gets trumped by any warlock meleeing you to death.

How to fix?: Make it a slug firing shotgun and increase its range to fusion rifle range. This makes it a "Universal" weapon, while still not making it OP due to low clip size, very little room for aiming error, and slower than normal pump-action.

No Land Beyond:
Pro: You have a sniper as your main gun
Con: (Don't get me started...)

The gun is a novelty, an artifact of a bygone era, but it is still a gun! A tool made for killing! But it can barely do that for some reason. Our guardian is too slow to slide the action. The gun was nerfed because it is moving a sniper to the primary slot which is a dumb reason. I'm still expecting it to function at the very least like a Mosin Nagant or an Intervention. In other games when the gun is bolt action, we're slowed down between firing rounds with the reward of doing higher damage per shot when compared to semi/fully auto rifles. Unfortunately the perks don't even aid you. I'd only allow this kind of gun to exist if it didn't have a lens flare when zooming in.

How to fix?: 1.) Leave it the same but remove the scope's lens flare. 2.) leave the lens flare, but let the bolt action animation speed up per headshot to a capped speed multiplier of x6. The max speed should be something like [this](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gbRGGtqGXN8). The speed multiplier drops 1 per missed shot and is completely nullified on death.

Super Good Advice:
Pro: When you miss you'll probably get your bullet back, and it's killer during Oracles.
Con: The only reason you're missing is because the recoil is absurd

I really, REALLY wanted to use this gun since the first few gameplay videos were released by Bungie but alas it sucks. The only super good advice it gives you is to not use the SGA. The gun should reward you for using the gun well, not for missing shots! The thing is the perk is useless to players who can master it's recoil! How about a perk for being able to "following it's advice"? How about getting your bullet back when you land a critical hit? How about getting 20 bullets back after a kill? How about bottomless clip? I could keep coming up with "advice" on how to fix this let down of a gun. And the gun looks almost like the New Monarchy Prestige IV, don't they?. Make something actually distinguish the gun from eachother, something glowing? lights? make it sound different?

How to fix?: Give it an additional perk or change it's SGA perk to something else. Call it "Don't Stop Talking", "SGA", "Blabbermouth", "White Lies" doesn't matter. And make it so that when a crit is landed you get that bullet back. That way we can tolerate the recoil, or at least have a reason for the ludicrous recoil in the first place.
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I think Exotics should honestly be treated like a Sub-Subclass. An exotic should change the way you play and reward each playstyle. The Armamentarium + Gjallarhorn combo makes you the "Heavy Weapons Guy". The Don't Touch Me + Patience & Time makes you a Stealth Ninja. I can list plenty of exotic combos that really cater to a playstyle and rewards you for it. But I can tell you that the SGA, UR, and NLB don't reward you for your playstyle at all; they only hinder your would be killing rampage by handicapping you and not rewarding you for overcoming the gun's handicaps. If Bungie doesn't apply rewards to overcoming the gun's handicap, then you're just penalizing yourself by using the gun.

In fact every good exotic either is just a top tier version of it's subclass (e.g.:MIDA, Suros, Red Death), completely changes your playstyle (e.g.:Icebreaker, The Last Word, Bad Juju), or it has a synergy with another exotic armor (e.g.:Skullfort + Red Death = Vampire Titan , Juju + Obsidian = Spellcaster), or you'd become OP if you could carry the weapon and another Exotic (pocket infinity, Mythoclast, invective). If the gun is exotic but doesn't fit the previously listed criterion, then it doesn't deserve the "Exotic" title.

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As for Universal Remote, just make it into the Halo: CE shotgun, bam its good now.

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As for Universal Remote, just make it into the Halo: CE shotgun, bam its good now.

I definitely agree that NLB is much more useful in PVP, but it does need a little bit of a buff. Nothing really big, but even if it was when you got a precision kill the next body shot would kill would be awesome. The firing rate is so slow that it wouldn't be terribly devastating, no more so then the guns where the last round in a clip kills with one body shot.

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Praedith's Revenge smokes it. So does LDR. So does pretty much anything with the Ambush 25 scope.

The scope is not accurate (headshot spot is about 1/3 of the way down the pointer), it blocks a huge amount of your view, and the reload speed is atrocious. Even if you reload-cancel (the possibility of which is also absurd), the firing rate is garbage. Because you have to drop zoom for every reload, you can't reliably stay on target over range.

Even more absurd is that the stats show it has maximum reload. Too bad it doesn't have maximum speed on a shot per shot basis.

God that gun sucks.

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Oh yeah, Super Good Advice is actually much more accurate now that it was originally, putting it still a tad behind every legendary MG ever.

Dragon's Breath is also bad.

4 horsemen is worse than universal remote, because when you're using it, you can't also have a good shotgun equipped.

And Necrochasm is the worst thing to happen to Exotic Auto-rifles since Bungie metrics that decided they need a blanket 9.7% nerf.

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Praedith's Revenge smokes it. So does LDR. So does pretty much anything with the Ambush 25 scope.

The scope is not accurate (headshot spot is about 1/3 of the way down the pointer), it blocks a huge amount of your view, and the reload speed is atrocious. Even if you reload-cancel (the possibility of which is also absurd), the firing rate is garbage. Because you have to drop zoom for every reload, you can't reliably stay on target over range.

Even more absurd is that the stats show it has maximum reload. Too bad it doesn't have maximum speed on a shot per shot basis.

God that gun sucks.

See while I agree it needs some buffs, you are comparing it to other sniper rifles, and it's obvious the ability to keep it in the primary slot is taken into consideration when they balanced it. It's not supposed to compete with the best sniper rifles in the game, because part of the perk of the gun is that I can have a sniper rifle AND another special weapon, all of which have the potential to one shot kill. If No Land Beyond was at all comparable to other sniper rifles it would be the most overpowered gun in the game, because I can pick up primary ammo for it AND still have a shotgun or fusion rifle. I already have had a few matches with the current No Land Beyond where I counter-snipe with the NLB and then use a good range/fast charge fusion rifle basically as my main gun. Now imagine if the gun was as good as Praedyth's Revenge.

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So what you're saying is, that while NLB goes in the primary slot, your preference is to play with it as a secondary weapon, and to use a fusion rifle as your "primary" weapon?

Which means the weapon is garbage. I mean, you're now in a situation where you are using the exotic slot for a situational weapon rather than one you plan on using a lot.

Speaking of this issue, NLB holds a grand total of... 18 rounds? 6 in the mag and 12 in reserve? And you get 2-6 rounds from ammo pickups in PvE? So even though it goes in the primary slot, it's actually got less ammo in reserve than virtually any other sniper rifle, and you get fewer rounds for it on a per-pickup basis.

Okay, back to using it in the primary slot: You can use ANY primary in the primary slot and still favor a fusion rifle in crucible. So why would you choose NLB? If you're on a map where you know you're going to do a lot of sniping, you're going to use a real sniper rifle instead of a fusion rifle, and have a more close-quarters weapon as your primary. If you're on a map where you're going to be doing lots of close quarters combat and will use your fusion rifle most often, then you want your primary to be a backup plan - something you can draw quickly if your fusion rifle runs out of ammo, or a weapon for mid-long ranges if the situation arises. You could use MIDA, Thorn, The Last Word, SUROS... Or any number of very excellent legendaries like TDYK or Timur's Lash.

All of those weapons give the same opportunity to use a fusion rifle, without the handicap of having a terrible weapon in the primary slot. Sure, NLB has the "potential" for a one shot kill, but it also has the much more likely result of getting you killed.

In fact, the only situation I can think of where I'd choose to equip it is if I was doing so much sniping that I wanted a backup sniper rifle to my real sniper rifle, so that if I ran out of ammo on Praedith's Revenge, I could switch to NLB and keep sniping without having to go look for ammo. That's it. And you know what.... I'd still rather use MIDA in that case, or even The Stranger's Rifle.

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Okay, back to using it in the primary slot: You can use ANY primary in the primary slot and still favor a fusion rifle in crucible. So why would you choose NLB?

Name a single primary weapon that can kill in a one headshot and your point is true. Otherwise it can be quite desirable to have even a bad sniper in addition to a different special as I've already said. As long as your aim is good for the most part you don't need more than a single shot which doesn't make the NLB that much worse than any other sniper rifle, of which you wouldn't be able to use in this situation anyway.

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Okay, back to using it in the primary slot: You can use ANY primary in the primary slot and still favor a fusion rifle in crucible. So why would you choose NLB?

Name a single primary weapon that can kill in a one headshot and your point is true.

Hawkmoon.

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Okay, back to using it in the primary slot: You can use ANY primary in the primary slot and still favor a fusion rifle in crucible. So why would you choose NLB?

Name a single primary weapon that can kill in a one headshot and your point is true.

Hawkmoon.

1. I'm on Xbox
2. I meant reliably :-P

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Okay, back to using it in the primary slot: You can use ANY primary in the primary slot and still favor a fusion rifle in crucible. So why would you choose NLB?

Name a single primary weapon that can kill in a one headshot and your point is true.

Hawkmoon.

1. I'm on Xbox
2. I meant reliably :-P

Well, it can two shot pretty frequently and is much easier to aim and shoot than NLB.

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Okay, back to using it in the primary slot: You can use ANY primary in the primary slot and still favor a fusion rifle in crucible. So why would you choose NLB?

Name a single primary weapon that can kill in a one headshot and your point is true.

Hawkmoon.

1. I'm on Xbox
2. I meant reliably :-P

Well, it can two shot pretty frequently and is much easier to aim and shoot than NLB.

Fair enough, which is why I think the buff I mentioned in my first post would make NLB feel powerful and unique, without becoming overly powerful since it has such a low rate of fire.

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Okay, back to using it in the primary slot: You can use ANY primary in the primary slot and still favor a fusion rifle in crucible. So why would you choose NLB?

Name a single primary weapon that can kill in a one headshot and your point is true. Otherwise it can be quite desirable to have even a bad sniper in addition to a different special as I've already said. As long as your aim is good for the most part you don't need more than a single shot which doesn't make the NLB that much worse than any other sniper rifle, of which you wouldn't be able to use in this situation anyway.

It's not about having a primary that can kill in one headshot. It's about having a primary that is an effective backup to your other sniper rifle that can kill in one headshot. I'd take a sniper secondary with almost any primary weapon over NLB + any secondary, all day every day. Praedith's Revenge + The Last Word, Hawkmoon, or Thorn is amazeballs. Icebreaker or Patience and TIme + Timur's Lash. SUROS + LDR. The Stranger's Rifle + any of the aforementioned snipers. All of these weapon combos are way more deadly than NLB + anything.

Likewise, let's say you're using NLB. You're secondary weapon then would be either a legendary shotgun or a legendary fusion rifle. So would you rather have Secret Handshake + NLB or Secret Handshake + MIDA, Thorn, Hawkmoon, SUROS, The Stranger's Rifle, Timur's Lash, etc..? The *possibility* of a 1-shot kill with NLB is not the same as a guarantee of it, and if you don't hit the head with the initial shot, your time to kill goes from instant to 2 or 3 seconds, which is the same as never, since every other primary weapon has a time to kill of less than 2 (if they're close enough to shoot back) or because it gives them plenty of time to run and hide (if they're too far away to engage you). Even in situations where you do get that first 1-shot kill, you're then defenseless as other players swarm you because of the round chambering animation.

Think of it another way: If you're imagining your perfect two weapon combo, regardless of limitations, what is it? Mine is Sniper Rifle + Hand Cannon or Sniper Rifle + Auto Rifle. So I wouldn't want NLB blocking out my hand cannon or AR choices. But let's say yours in Sniper Rifle + Shotgun... Wouldn't you rather have Universal Remote + any other decent sniper than have NLB + a different shotty? I would. So the only situation where NLB is preferred would be if you absolutely insist of playing sniper + fusion rifle. Or if you prefer a better shotty with your worse sniper rifle.

And I ask... Is it worth having a terrible sniper just for the opportunity to use a fusion rifle at the same time? I don't think it is.

Then again, I use my sniper rifle early and often. In reality, it's my preference to sniper first and use other weapons later. Maybe that's why I hate NLB so much. For a sniper that goes in the primary slot, it's far from a weapon you would primarily use. It's a backup to your primary use shotgun or fusion rifle (two weapons I almost never use).

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Then again, I use my sniper rifle early and often. In reality, it's my preference to sniper first and use other weapons later. Maybe that's why I hate NLB so much. For a sniper that goes in the primary slot, it's far from a weapon you would primarily use. It's a backup to your primary use shotgun or fusion rifle (two weapons I almost never use).

And I would say that's the main reason you're so adamant that it never has any use. I always struggle choosing between all three special weapons since they all have great uses in PvP. I'm also a more careful sniper anyway. Even with a much faster firing sniper rifle if I miss with my first shot I often run, which makes the NLB just as useful as any other sniper rifle, only now when I run I have a one-shot weapon for a shorter range on me. The NLB will never be for everyone (even when they DO buff it) but it definitely has its place in the Crucible if it fits your play style.

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See while I agree it needs some buffs, you are comparing it to other sniper rifles, and it's obvious the ability to keep it in the primary slot is taken into consideration when they balanced it. It's not supposed to compete with the best sniper rifles in the game, because part of the perk of the gun is that I can have a sniper rifle AND another special weapon, all of which have the potential to one shot kill. If No Land Beyond was at all comparable to other sniper rifles it would be the most overpowered gun in the game, because I can pick up primary ammo for it AND still have a shotgun or fusion rifle. I already have had a few matches with the current No Land Beyond where I counter-snipe with the NLB and then use a good range/fast charge fusion rifle basically as my main gun. Now imagine if the gun was as good as Praedyth's Revenge.

Clearly the shotty sniper combo is just too good in the crucible. You can have it two ways: NLB + Shotgun or Universal Remote + Sniper. Being able to have said combo is the only advantage to NLB and UR's being in the primary slot, so the fact that they need to be held back should tell you something about the idea of putting specials in the primary. Both weapons are notoriously bad, however universal remote is better received because it's a decent shotgun, whereas NLB is a bad sniper.

Someday when there are more types of guns, maybe such an idea would be better suited.

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Now, see, I really like this gun. And my favorite part of the perk? I can fire it so much. If something's coming I can fire the gun before they get there and not really lose anything. I find it helpful in niches, and I'm pretty okay at dealing with the recoil, I'd say.

Maybe it doesn't reward your playstyle, but it sure as hell rewards mine.

Suros Regime wouldn't reward my playstyle, but hey, it's just not the gun for me. Doesn't make it crap. If you can't find some way to cleverly leverage SGA than I would say that's your fault, not that of the gun. Which is fine, not every gun is for everyone, but SGA really isn't bad.

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SGA is a short range gun. It's perk is to allow you to sort of use it mid range without too much ammo loss. I like it, but gjallarhorn is almost always better in that slot so I don't use it much. And on my alts, I am usually using an exotic in the secondary slot so it doesn't get used much. The weapon is good, but more situational than I'd like. I think if it's impact were a little higher it would be a beast.

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With gunslingers trance, chain of woe, and hand loaded it turns into a really good weapon on mobs at a distance. As with any full auto weapon I try to keep the bursts as short as possible and walk the crosshairs from the sternum to the head. I rock it during crotas end as the sword bearer to deal with the thralls and oversoul.

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Orb generation!

It's fun with Ward of Dawn, Blessing of Light, Iron Harvest, Helm of Saint-14, Hive mooks rushing you, and your Force Barrier is on cooldown. Hitting the Dawn counts as a miss. I like moving between the Dawn barrier spraying fire everywhere.

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1) To fix Universal Remote, it should be a No Land Beyond

and

2) To fix No Land Beyond, it should be a Mythoclast

On a serious note, I honestly think NLB should be a one-hit bodyshot kill in PvP (with slightly slower RoF and absolutely no chance of no-scope, of course). We had that in Halo 4 and it didn't implode the experience like it sounds it should.

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Heh, I absolutely love No Land Beyond in PvP. If it went to a one shot body shot... man... Would I decimate! It's almost unfair enough as it is!

No Land Beyond with Angel of Light and it's like you become The Reaper incarnate! >:)

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No Land Beyond with Angel of Light and it's like you become The Reaper incarnate! >:)

You magnificent bastard. Whenever I'm bored now, I'll roll with a NLB and Angel of Light in the Crucible.

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I'm not doubting your sincerity here, but I fail to see why NLB would be preferable to literally any other sniper rifle. Would you mind explaining to me how to use it successfully? I'm at a total loss.

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He could honestly do that with any sniper, yes, but I guess NLB has a higher troll factor

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I'm not doubting your sincerity here, but I fail to see why NLB would be preferable to literally any other sniper rifle. Would you mind explaining to me how to use it successfully? I'm at a total loss.

For me there's a couple reasons. Though the round-chambering is indeed slower than I think it should be, the actual reload speed is pretty decent. I think somebody mentioned that they thought the targeting-reticle occluded much of your view, but I disagree. Not having to completely "scope in" while using a sniper rifle has been a godsend for me because it leaves my peripherals almost completely unobstructed. The impact is the same as Icebreaker, and the range is almost at max level.

I use Snapshot on mine, and in conjunction with the open "scope" design allows for incredibly fast target-acquisition, something that makes those Angel of Light flying headshots a lot easier to accomplish.

Something I feel is often overlooked is also the simple fact that it's a Primary. Granted, in Crucible it's not exactly difficult to procure Special ammo. But as a Primary I never have to worry about running out of bullets. Plus as a Primary, it frees up my Special slot for a shotgun. A tactic I'm sure we're all familiar with from our Sniper/Shottys Halo days.

Is it the best sniper in the game? Certainly not!

Is it pretty much the only sniper I use in Crucible? Most assuredly.

Truth be told, it's actually probably my favourite gun in the game currently, even though I've yet to try it out in PvE...

PS. Zacks not wrong when he mentions there's a certain perverse satisfaction with the troll factor too...

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I'm not doubting your sincerity here, but I fail to see why NLB would be preferable to literally any other sniper rifle. Would you mind explaining to me how to use it successfully? I'm at a total loss.

For me there's a couple reasons. Though the round-chambering is indeed slower than I think it should be, the actual reload speed is pretty decent. I think somebody mentioned that they thought the targeting-reticle occluded much of your view, but I disagree. Not having to completely "scope in" while using a sniper rifle has been a godsend for me because it leaves my peripherals almost completely unobstructed. The impact is the same as Icebreaker, and the range is almost at max level.

I use Snapshot on mine, and in conjunction with the open "scope" design allows for incredibly fast target-acquisition, something that makes those Angel of Light flying headshots a lot easier to accomplish.

Something I feel is often overlooked is also the simple fact that it's a Primary. Granted, in Crucible it's not exactly difficult to procure Special ammo. But as a Primary I never have to worry about running out of bullets. Plus as a Primary, it frees up my Special slot for a shotgun. A tactic I'm sure we're all familiar with from our Sniper/Shottys Halo days.

Is it the best sniper in the game? Certainly not!

Is it pretty much the only sniper I use in Crucible? Most assuredly.

Truth be told, it's actually probably my favourite gun in the game currently, even though I've yet to try it out in PvE...

I've only tried it a few times in PVE and didn't enjoy it much (though I was still fine with the purchase just because it looks so damn cool on my back, like a katana or something), but you guys have got me all excited to go try it in Crucible. I love killing folks with unconventional weapons...

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I've only tried it a few times in PVE and didn't enjoy it much (though I was still fine with the purchase just because it looks so damn cool on my back, like a katana or something), but you guys have got me all excited to go try it in Crucible. I love killing folks with unconventional weapons...

Try it out if you must, just to get an idea of how it performs, but be ready to be disappointed because it is truly rubbish in PvE.

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I've only tried it a few times in PVE and didn't enjoy it much (though I was still fine with the purchase just because it looks so damn cool on my back, like a katana or something), but you guys have got me all excited to go try it in Crucible. I love killing folks with unconventional weapons...

Try it out if you must, just to get an idea of how it performs, but be ready to be disappointed because it is truly rubbish in PvE.

...Which is why I was excited to try it in PvP. :)

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Whoops. I apparently read that whole paragraph backwards.

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Yeah, I haven't tried it in PvE yet, and I'm none too anxious to try. But in PvP it is a very satisfying weapon for me to use.

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Hmm... I'll have to switch to snapshot and see if I like it any better. My biggest problem is that if I don't one-hit kill with it on the first shot, I'm probably dead before I ever get that second shot off.

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Right. I'm not that great a sniper, but I make a pretty good counter sniper. The way I see it if I can go up against regular snipers with a scout rifle and win a good deal more than I lose then what chance does a low zoom, slow firing No Land Beyond user have?

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I can't speak for you, but it's been my experience that scout-wielding counter snipers tend to be overconfident. Their rate of fire is so much higher that they feel they can ignore their shields being stripped. I've gotten a lot of kills with people not taking cover after hitting them once.

I fire, take cover to rechamber, pop out an fire again for the kill. While they wait to reacquire target once I've broken line of sight.

Also people don't know how big their bodies are, heh. Often if they DO take cover, it's not good enough, they still leave a toe, or elbow out in the open, and I can still get the kill.

Also, almost NOBODY looks for flying snipers! That's solution three for getting the two-shot kill. Aware players get hit and take full cover. I quick glide straight up and Angel of Light ABOVE their cover, then rain down fire from on high.

To be fair, years of FPSing has kinda trained us to not look up, so when threats come from way up high in PvP a lot of people are slow to adjust.

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For me, it's so much being in the moment and knowing when I have an advantage and pushing it to the end... even if I do take a body shot mid engagement. But it's also knowing when I have the disadvantage and breaking off... even if the sniper hasn't actually fired a shot yet. My flinch reaction for breaking line of sight when seeing nothing more than the sniper scope light has saved me plenty of times! So has ducking for cover if I take a hit too early. Then there's also just breaking the engagement completely and going somewhere else if the sniper is entrenched or got off a particularly quick first shot.

At the same time I think snipers can also get overconfident. Too many times I'll ping them once or twice with a four shot kill gun and they'll step back out before their shields are recharged. Or they take one too many shots and flee way too late. It's especially silly when they do kill me... and then stay in the exact same spot. I don't care if I have the best line of sight in the world, if I kill you from somewhere you will not find me there next time. Maybe I'll just move one field of view to the left or maybe I'll be at a completely different angle, but sniping from the same spot is a death sentence no matter how good your location is.

You are right, of course, a high sniper is extra dangerous. I know I've been embarrassed a few times to die to someone who seemed to keep hitting me no matter what I hid behind only to see that they were up on something. It happens a lot more with people using normal guns though since its easier to see and track a sniper by the contrail and by the scope light. Do you have any favorite locations where you can hover and it from above cover? (I'd like to know so I can avoid them! :p)

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At the same time I think snipers can also get overconfident. Too many times I'll ping them once or twice with a four shot kill gun and they'll step back out before their shields are recharged. Or they take one too many shots and flee way too late. It's especially silly when they do kill me... and then stay in the exact same spot. I don't care if I have the best line of sight in the world, if I kill you from somewhere you will not find me there next time. Maybe I'll just move one field of view to the left or maybe I'll be at a completely different angle, but sniping from the same spot is a death sentence no matter how good your location is.

I know I'm especially guilty of peaking, but what I always kick myself for is not changing my engagement point after I've broken cover to fire my sniper. Just moving twenty feet to the left can make a huge difference when sniping. I actually like that about NLB; you have to spend a few seconds chambering a round, so it's a nice reminder to move and take your next shot from anywhere else.

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I find on the shores of time I can often snipe B from over by C for a long time without having to move. There is a very thin line of sight there which I think helps. People who want to snipe me back have to expose themselves pretty much exactly where I know they are going to be and that usually means I can react faster than they can. Of course, I do try to move around left and right slightly and I do move over to snipe C occasionally too so I'm not completely stationary.

I also found a nice spot only accessible to Titans outside of A that has decent sight lines down on B. You jump on a short pillar by the edge of the map, then double jump up to a railing along the tall pillar at the back corner. You can also get some nice kills on people as they run out of A and falling off of that spot gets me out of trouble very quickly in most cases. I can usually get at least 3 kills before I have to abandon that spot for a while. It seems like it takes people a long time to realize where they are getting shot from.

That map is the one map where I snipe instead of using a Fusion rifle consistently.

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I find on the shores of time I can often snipe B from over by C for a long time without having to move. There is a very thin line of sight there which I think helps. People who want to snipe me back have to expose themselves pretty much exactly where I know they are going to be and that usually means I can react faster than they can. Of course, I do try to move around left and right slightly and I do move over to snipe C occasionally too so I'm not completely stationary.

Yep. It's extremely hard to snipe from B to C down that line because they don't so much need to aim as to pull the trigger when you move into the only viable firing lane. You pretty much need to come at them from B's heavy ammo if you want a real shot at removing them...

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Clear the point C snipers by passing through the rotunda between B and C. You have two possible exits, depending on if you want to kill the sniper looking at point B or point C/A first.

For me, I tend to be an area denial type of sniper. I usually hand cannon until I get a good lane, and then I switch to my sniper (Praedith's Revenge or Icebreaker most of the time) and hold the line until they (eventually) kill me. It's fish in a barrel, and I usually don't die at all unless I get flanked or my teammates run in front of me and block my shots (happens more than you might think).

If you're playing with me, and you see me lurking near a control zone, you don't have to worry about the path I'm shooting down. Counter-snipers don't do well against me, either. I'm already zoomed in, so my shot is going to hit them first.

Of note: Chain of Woe and Gunslinger's Trance mean I'm a headshot machine, and it takes only a split second to reload my weapons. This is another drawback of NLB for me as a Gunslinger... I gain a much higher benefit from a high rate of fire sniper than a slow one.

But yes, obviously you need to take cover if your shields are down! And not like, duck to the side cover. You have to move far enough away that a grenade won't kill you while you face a wall for 3 seconds.

Interesting how the tactics of sniping are so modified by class.

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You are right, of course, a high sniper is extra dangerous. I know I've been embarrassed a few times to die to someone who seemed to keep hitting me no matter what I hid behind only to see that they were up on something. It happens a lot more with people using normal guns though since its easier to see and track a sniper by the contrail and by the scope light. Do you have any favorite locations where you can hover and it from above cover? (I'd like to know so I can avoid them! :p)

Heh, unfortunately no. I consider myself an "aggressive sniper." In that I like to move all around the map and I don't mind getting up close for kills. I play mostly Control, and I love getting the Hat Trick and Objectively Correct medals. So in constantly running around from point to point.

I'll tell you though, my playstyle emphasizes height... above all else... (hue hue hue) and so rarely is it that I'm running along the ground. More likely to be gliding around or jumping from tall thing to tall thing.

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Hmm... I'll have to switch to snapshot and see if I like it any better. My biggest problem is that if I don't one-hit kill with it on the first shot, I'm probably dead before I ever get that second shot off.

Aye, that was part of the learning curve for me. Now when I engage targets, I have to gauge whether they've spotted me or not. If not, I can take more shots. If they have, however, I IMMEDIATELY break line of sight after my missed shot. Now, you could do this by strafing behind a wall, but I prefer to fast-glide straight up and hide behind low ceilings and the like.

I employ a similar method when tossing fusion grenades. Toss and break line of sight. With NLB it's all about map knowledge and ambush tactics.

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I play a hunter, so fast gliding isn't an option for me, but point taken on the duck and run tactics. Are you essentially quick-scoping the whole time like a classic CoD player?

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I'm not sure? I never really played any of the CoD multiplayer as it was too fast for me.

I CAN say that I don't spend a lot of time zoomed in. I zoom for shots and sometimes to use it as binoculars to see the other side of he map. As an aggressive dedicated sniper, I probably spend about one third of a match zoomed, and the majority of that is when I'm Angel of Lighting above the battlefield.

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I have no problem with Super Good Advice. Now, I just had the melancholia of upgrading it, which meant getting rid of my original--the first Exotic I ever earned--which means I have to start over, but I always stagger my shots and because of that, I never miss! Super Good Advice is actually very good to me, and the instant shot recall is the perfect Creme Fraiche on a Kobe Beef Double Pounder. If something gets too close, just unload and watch it go bye-bye.

No Land Beyond, I understand people's frustration at that. I got it for Nightfall, I believe. And in a raid group, when I said I got it, one of them said "Oh man, I'm sorry." and everyone else started laughing. I found out why on a trial run at The Divide. I personally can't make any suggestions on it, as--admittedly--something more interesting came along. That probably solidifies your point, but there's nothing that I can weigh in on this subject.

When I read your assessment of the Universal Remote, I had to do a triple take. "Almost every shotgun is better than the Universal Remote?" I don't mean to offend, but are you out of your freaking mind? The Universal Remote is INSANELY overpowered, and the range is 'Report to Microsoft' ridiculous. At least with the Invective, you have to fire it up close! My god, the Remote has the range of literally any damn Fusion Rifle! If I'm not killed with a Thorn or Last Word (or LDR), it's a Universal Remote--every time. Not even Invective anymore--Invective is only for people who don't have a Remote. And it's a friggin' Primary, too? Now THAT is a weapon that needs to be toned down!

Which reminds me, I need to unleash my fully upgraded Plan C on the Crucible world--maybe even bring it back.

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I have no problem with Super Good Advice.

I think it's good in one very specific PvP circumstance. The problem is that everywhere else any other HMG beats it hands down. The situation in which it shines is in PvP you can use it as area denial. So for example, if your relic is capturing, and you see enemies coming your way on your radar, you can nearly infinitely spray the entry routes to keep them from coming in. Just keep firing until the relic is capped, or until they are dumb enough to step into your hail of bullets.

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SGA: I like this gun, but I envisioned it more like the FWC heavy with ammo return rather then a mid level hybrid. I think it would be most excellent if it had the stats of The Culling with built in field scout and the ammo return. Flack away!

NLB: This gun confuses me. Ice Breaker and LDR both have better basic stats. The advantage of NLB, being in the primary is you could pair it with a shotgun or fusion rifle, but that is pretty much it. There doesn't seem to be a reason to take it over the aforementioned two or Efreet's spear.

I'd like to see it be a one hit kill, with massive PVE damage. Keep the extremely slow firing and slow reloads. Dump that into one huge damage shot with no aim assist that staggers and stuns mobs.

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Useless Exotics: How could Bungie fix them? (Destiny)

NLB is fine as it is, its a PVP gun

NLB is fine as it is, its a PVP gun

NLB is garbage as a PVP gun

NLB is garbage as a PVP gun

NLB is garbage as a PVP gun

NLB is garbage as a PVP gun

NLB is garbage as a PVP gun

NLB is garbage as a PVP gun

NLB is garbage as a PVP gun

NLB is garbage as a PVP gun

NLB is garbage as a PVP gun

NLB is garbage as a PVP gun

NLB is garbage as a PVP gun

Super Good Advice

Super Good Advice - range matters

Super Good Advice - range matters

Another good SGA situational use

Heh. I'll have to try that.

So, basically, you're saying that...

I love NLB

I love NLB

I love NLB

He hovers a lot and is a good shot

I love NLB

I love NLB

I love NLB

I love NLB

I love NLB

I love NLB

I love NLB

I love NLB

I love NLB

I love NLB

Nobody seems to stick and move in Crucible

Shores of Time

Shores of Time

Shores of Time

I love NLB

I love NLB

I love NLB

I love NLB

Useless Exotics: How could Bungie fix them?

Useless Exotics: How could Bungie fix them?

Minor tweaks