DBO Forums - wtf is asking? https://destiny.bungie.org/forum/ Bungie.Org talks Destiny en wtf is asking? (reply) https://destiny.bungie.org/forum/index.php?id=178483 https://destiny.bungie.org/forum/index.php?id=178483 Thu, 05 May 2022 01:11:55 +0000 DestinyINSANEdrive LOL! (reply) https://destiny.bungie.org/forum/index.php?id=178478 https://destiny.bungie.org/forum/index.php?id=178478 Wed, 04 May 2022 14:58:45 +0000 DestinyKermit wtf am I reading? (reply) https://destiny.bungie.org/forum/index.php?id=178474 https://destiny.bungie.org/forum/index.php?id=178474 Wed, 04 May 2022 04:09:15 +0000 DestinySchooly D Keith's Voice Is Just Heaven... (reply) https://destiny.bungie.org/forum/index.php?id=178462 https://destiny.bungie.org/forum/index.php?id=178462 Sun, 01 May 2022 00:59:38 +0000 DestinyMorpheus Sure thing! Bot of Definitely Spam. (reply) https://destiny.bungie.org/forum/index.php?id=178434 https://destiny.bungie.org/forum/index.php?id=178434 Mon, 25 Apr 2022 21:21:38 +0000 DestinyINSANEdrive Worst Halo line since "were it so easy" (reply) thanks a bunch.

]]>
https://destiny.bungie.org/forum/index.php?id=178433 https://destiny.bungie.org/forum/index.php?id=178433 Mon, 25 Apr 2022 19:21:13 +0000 DestinyHasan3434
Sure thing! Bot of Probably Spam. (reply) https://destiny.bungie.org/forum/index.php?id=178432 https://destiny.bungie.org/forum/index.php?id=178432 Mon, 25 Apr 2022 18:13:46 +0000 DestinyINSANEdrive TWAB - 31st of March, 2022 | VOTE! Mechs vs Monsters. (reply) thanks for kind information.

]]>
https://destiny.bungie.org/forum/index.php?id=178429 https://destiny.bungie.org/forum/index.php?id=178429 Mon, 25 Apr 2022 13:36:46 +0000 DestinyHasan3434
+1 (reply) https://destiny.bungie.org/forum/index.php?id=178380 https://destiny.bungie.org/forum/index.php?id=178380 Wed, 13 Apr 2022 19:27:10 +0000 DestinyCyberKN Nope. "To War" from the same game (reply) I was never confused by this line.

It seemed pretty clear to me even the first time that the Arbiter was saying he didn't believe anyone could kill the Chief easily, and so he's still alive.

]]>
https://destiny.bungie.org/forum/index.php?id=178374 https://destiny.bungie.org/forum/index.php?id=178374 Wed, 13 Apr 2022 16:34:48 +0000 DestinyCody Miller
Defeat? (reply) I quite enjoyed this thread so thank you. Felt like the good ol' days.

]]>
https://destiny.bungie.org/forum/index.php?id=178373 https://destiny.bungie.org/forum/index.php?id=178373 Wed, 13 Apr 2022 12:10:24 +0000 DestinyJoe Duplessie (SNIPE 316)
Defeat? (reply)

Again, such a take makes me scratch my head. I was unaware I was committing to some battle. How is gaining a new appreciation for something a defeat? Why speak at all if not to grow wiser from what makes us weary?

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Well, congratulations on your "defeat", I guess. May it bring you fresh horizons.

I'm an English geek, friend. It's been way over 20 years since I've been in grad school or taught, but I enjoy a good debate about language and the arts. This one made me think. Maybe I made someone else think. You said I was playing king of the hill, ready to die on it and so forth. I followed your lead. That's where "defeat" comes in. I'm off the hill. Thanks to all who participated.

]]>
https://destiny.bungie.org/forum/index.php?id=178372 https://destiny.bungie.org/forum/index.php?id=178372 Wed, 13 Apr 2022 03:11:03 +0000 DestinyKermit
I feel you, but I still love both deliveries of the line (reply) https://destiny.bungie.org/forum/index.php?id=178371 https://destiny.bungie.org/forum/index.php?id=178371 Wed, 13 Apr 2022 02:35:00 +0000 Destinykidtsunami Defeat? (reply) Again, such a take makes me scratch my head. I was unaware I was committing to some battle. How is gaining a new appreciation for something a defeat? Why speak at all if not to grow wiser from what makes us weary?

¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Well, congratulations on your "defeat", I guess. May it bring you fresh horizons.

]]>
https://destiny.bungie.org/forum/index.php?id=178369 https://destiny.bungie.org/forum/index.php?id=178369 Tue, 12 Apr 2022 21:38:43 +0000 DestinyINSANEdrive
You and uberfoop have defeated me. (reply) I no longer dismiss it as a bad line. I now say it's s a good line, badly set up (twice). That's progress. Even tried to fix it without touching the beloved line or negatively affecting your interpretations.

I have a greater appreciation for it, but I can't love it, because I've always heard it as a non sequitur. It's an honest criticism. This isn't math. Our answers don't have to match.

]]>
https://destiny.bungie.org/forum/index.php?id=178368 https://destiny.bungie.org/forum/index.php?id=178368 Tue, 12 Apr 2022 21:12:36 +0000 DestinyKermit
2¢ (reply) (Alternative title - "Language Rigidity".)

[ALL OF WHATEVER ALL THIS IS.]

Geez, are we Halo fans or what! What a stupid conversation. What a STUPID hill to die on.

...sO aNyWaY hErE iS mY tWo cEnTs. :P

Let me just throw this out here right now; "Were it so easy" is my favorite line of the entire series. Yes, even more than "Tank beats everything" or "Don't make a girl a promise...", which while very wise, is not as usefully quotable in the everyday quite like "Were it so easy". Something where I can bring both meaning and a little joy from my fandom heart.

By the time I finish, it should be clear why, so let's just start this off in ernest by saying with the warmest heart; Kermit, brother, what am I reading here?

You mind if I guess? OH YOU DON'T MIND! Fantastic! What a fan-tastic conversation. ;D

This WHOLE thing is "Old man yells at cloud". It's not about age, but all about being frustrated that this idiom can't be crammed into some sort of self(?) defined box that, as far as I can tell, is just irrational. Which, hey, again, not a hit on you... just on the take. I've been sitting here reading this and every counter you bring is either more convoluted or so nit-picky that the meat of whatever argument that is trying to be made is no longer recognizable to what it was ever before.

... Which I KNOW, FANDOM, but ... ... ...DANG. LOL.

"Were it so easy" WORKS BECAUSE it's so simple. And, for WHATEVER reason Kerm, that simplicity seems to gnaw on ya. Which, I gotta say, is odd as ALL THE CONTEXT needed for the message is right there on the screen. Nothing more needs to be said but those four words, but it seems you're bent on interjecting SOMETHING more into the line, that... simply isn't.

Let just, look. Plain and simple, bone and stone (shut-up bluerunner) simplicity of what we have on screen.

Chief has a GUN in ARBYS mandibled clamshell. WHAT MORE IS NEEDED?! You brought up Johnson having some line, but IT literally DOESN'T MATTER! That may bother you, and you're gonna have to deal with it, but its an easy math; GUN IN FACE > Paraphrased "Why can't we all be friends!"

It would be true in real life, and it's true here. And it's so true, in fact, that in or out, there or not, Johnson doesn't matter. What Johnson says is of pure irrelevance, no "wishing" required. The meaning of Arbys first words are the same either way, there or not. Arby isn't talking to Johnson, Arby is talking to Chief. The guy with the FREEK'n gun in his four way pie hole. (Shut-up bluerunner.)

"Were it so easy".

What is it? REALLY?! Is that REALLY a question that needed to be ASKED?! Did I mention the GUN in his face? But hey, fine, lets just boil it down.

In short, it's a "as if you'd get so close otherwise". OH! BUT YOU SAID OTHERWISE! That means Johnson IS relevant and-NO! Not done. It's saying, not only "as if you'd get so close otherwise", but also calls into question; As if Chief could spring into some bravado action and just press a weapon to a head of an Elite. Which, as you may remember, are QUITE spry for 7.5-8.6 feet/2.2m-2.6m tall bipeds. If the relationship was different, the line could also have been something along the same idea as "you can't be serious right now".

"Were it so easy", to kill an Elite. His action in abstaining, short of his line, means he is a friendly or at least, not a foe. Because, again,"Were it so easy".

Johnson isn't needed. ALL the context is right there IN THE MOMENT.

In so many words "Were it so easy" says EVERYTHING. It's a keystone moment that sets the tone. Which is of course WHY I like it as it does this and more with such simplicity, as I in turn can be so... much... but anyway...

With "Were it so easy" here, well... as if it was so easy to kill Master Chief John-117. And since it's an elite, I think it also fair to say such line is out of respect for John, which in turn speaks about Arbys character, and... ALL FROM FOUR WORDS! Plus it's a call back to the start of the game for some cheap "art! "oh-muh-gerd-he-said-that-at-the-beginning" easy cheese, but... it's good! It WORKS!

And again, it says EVERYTHING, with but the same four words. It's beautiful.

Now, you don't have to agree, that's fine. You may still SOMEHOW find it "sloppy and confusing". Fine. But please at least understand WHY so many of us are (if I may be so bold to speak) scratching our heads as you defend this hill as if you were the king of it.

]]>
https://destiny.bungie.org/forum/index.php?id=178362 https://destiny.bungie.org/forum/index.php?id=178362 Tue, 12 Apr 2022 02:47:38 +0000 DestinyINSANEdrive
You can't write a better line to precede it... (reply)

We can't wish Johnson's line away with talk of conversation flow and act like it doesn't affect the interpretation of what the Arbiter says.


I'm not wishing it away or arguing that it doesn't create context for Arby's line. I think it exists primarily to do that: it breaks up the Chief's action so that Arby gets a natural window to respond, and sets the stage by acknowledging the pre-existing beef between the two characters. Otherwise it would be a confusing scene, especially to new players.

I think it's sloppy and confusing as is, but reasonable people can disagree. I was reading another forum where someone was saying how great "were it so easy" is, and another person said, "I never understood that line." I've said all I can think of to say about the scene. Regardless, the last scene is the most egregiously nonsensical. There's probably other parts of the script I could nit pick but its the repetition that kills me. It indicates the writers thought this was a gem, and it's disappointing that they poorly handled their gems.

]]>
https://destiny.bungie.org/forum/index.php?id=178359 https://destiny.bungie.org/forum/index.php?id=178359 Mon, 11 Apr 2022 23:36:21 +0000 DestinyKermit
You can't write a better line to precede it... (reply)

We can't wish Johnson's line away with talk of conversation flow and act like it doesn't affect the interpretation of what the Arbiter says.

I'm not wishing it away or arguing that it doesn't create context for Arby's line. I think it exists primarily to do that: it breaks up the Chief's action so that Arby gets a natural window to respond, and sets the stage by acknowledging the pre-existing beef between the two characters. Otherwise it would be a confusing scene, especially to new players.

]]>
https://destiny.bungie.org/forum/index.php?id=178353 https://destiny.bungie.org/forum/index.php?id=178353 Mon, 11 Apr 2022 19:24:26 +0000 Destinyuberfoop
You can't write a better line to precede it... (reply)

Too bad it's fan fiction, because there is a line preceding it, and that is part of the context in which the line is delivered


Visually the camera frames it as directed at the Chief. Contextually it makes more sense as a response to the Chief. It being trash talk is also more coherent in like of the subsequent part of the interaction, where the Chief continues to physically impede Arby before untangling.

Johnson's line is part of the context in which it's delivered, but transcript position does not imply primary conversation flow; a second party responding to a first party's actions without directly addressing a third party's interjection is not exotic.

You can call it "fan fiction", but I think your position that the line is directed at Johnson is much more tenuous. It's very difficult for me to watch the scene as having that conversation flow, it just doesn't fit the rhythm and geometry, and obviously the dialogue doesn't make sense. I guess we just read it very differently.

We can't wish Johnson's line away with talk of conversation flow and act like it doesn't affect the interpretation of what the Arbiter says. You've said it doesn't make sense, and I agree, but that hasn't stopped many people trying to explain to me how what Arbiter says makes sense in response to Johnson.

A second attempt at a rewrite that serves your narrative.

Johnson: Come on, Chief. For our sake, don't kill an ally.

Arbiter: Were it so easy.


That's a different meaning, and I don't see how it clears up your problem with the scene.

Not so different and not non-sensical as before. We get your interpretation of the cinematic--that the focus is on Arbiter and the Chief, and the Arbiter is trash talking, but we don't, on another level, get our brain tied up over the clumsy dialogue sequence we have just heard.

The "it" is now explicitly "killing arbiter" but the "it" on a visceral level is the Chief sticking a gun in Arbiter's face, which as you insightfully pointed out, the Arbiter has allowed. "It" can be multiple things, and that's the kind of ambiguity I suspect Robot and I like.

]]>
https://destiny.bungie.org/forum/index.php?id=178352 https://destiny.bungie.org/forum/index.php?id=178352 Mon, 11 Apr 2022 18:58:46 +0000 DestinyKermit
You can't write a better line to precede it... (reply)

...because there isn't a line preceding it. Arby is responding to the Chief having charged forth and stuck a pistol into his mouth. He gave himself up to avoid escalating the moment, and the "it" is the Chief getting the better of him.

Arby is not primarily making a response to Johnson. The camera even cuts Johnson out of the frame with the appropriate timing to make it look like Arby is slamming the line straight at the Chief's face. There's some ambiguous potential for secondary meaning with respect to Johnson's line, but it's not where the main energy of the scene is going.


This is the best, most compelling interpretation of the line I've ever read. Too bad it's fan fiction, because there is a line preceding it, and that is part of the context in which the line is delivered, and the poor set up detracts from your thesis.

A second attempt at a rewrite that serves your narrative.

Johnson: Come on, Chief. For our sake, don't kill an ally.

Arbiter: Were it so easy.


I just watched the scene again to make sure my mind wasn't playing tricks on me. I see what you are saying in that Johnson's line immediately precedes it. On the other hand, it feels like he's a spectator in the drama happening with Arby and the Chief. While Johnson's line is there, the Arbiter is responding to the Chief's actions. I've always interpreted it this way so I don't think it's a super niche way of reading the scene.

With good writing he could be responding to both. Giving uberfoop credit that the Arbiter's primarily talking to the Chief, Johnson's line doesn't have to make the Arbiter's line into a non sequitur.

]]>
https://destiny.bungie.org/forum/index.php?id=178351 https://destiny.bungie.org/forum/index.php?id=178351 Mon, 11 Apr 2022 18:37:48 +0000 DestinyKermit