Responding to Cody is not the problem. Responding about Cody, or because it is Cody is a problem. (This is not narrowly tailored to you. It tends to be a problem and of no value to the community whenever it happens. Any writer. Any target. )

I think what you're saying is it's not okay to make it personal, and if that's what you're saying, I completely agree.

I think it's perfectly okay to criticize what someone writes, and that includes their ideas, their tone, and their behavior on the forum.

Making it personal could be attacking them as a whole person, labeling or name-calling, making "you" statements, or ascribing thoughts or intent to them that we can't possibly know.

An ex-girlfriend of mine had a habit of doing the latter--what I said I meant or thought did not matter next to what she said I meant or thought. I know that issue when I see it.

I don't say all this from a pedestal of communication mastery. I've posted much that I regret here. To Cody's credit, although I often find his posts overly provocative and arrogant in tone, he is usually civil to his critics.

TL;DR

Be nice, damn it!

And once you've set a bar, there's no going backwards. An epic gun cannot be rolled back or taken back; it can be nerfed but that causes issues of its own. So how can you keep upping the stakes to keep people playing? It makes me wonder if Cody isn't right about RNG loot: bad in principle.

Exactly. I don't see how hard this is to understand. If you design your game with specific guns that are acquired in specific ways, then all the challenges can actually be designed knowing what players will have access to. With RNG loot, challenges can't require a wide variety of gun types or things like that because you might not have it yet. But when the gear acquisition itself is well integrated into your game, then you can balance out all the guns with each other, and with each activity.

This is even demonstrated in the PvE end game activities: they are becoming more and more difficult and bullet spongy. PoE is way worse than Crota's end with bullet sponge enemies, and people complained a lot about them back in TDB! The key is not to make the end game stuff difficult, but to make it challenging. That means having a wide variety of unique unusual scenarios, and giving players access to a variety of different tools by which to solve those scenarios. It doesn't mean making bosses with 2 million hit points.

And to further support you, and also completely destroy that notion of his that someone wouldn't completely write off a company based on just one game, I'd like to point out that I (and many others I know) wrote off 343 over Halo 4 alone. I only got my hands on Master Chief Collection because it was largely rehashed Bungie Halo games, and I didn't pay anything close to full price. There are no future 343 games for purchase in my future, and MCC's failure didn't decide that one.

That's a good point. Instead of looking forward to Halo 5, I currently have it as a "buy someday" type purchase entirely because 343 so badly screwed up the Didact in Halo 4. But to me that was more of an active screw up, where Destiny does have good writing talent associated with the project (like you said below, the Grimoire is really really good!) and does have a long history of telling good stories within FPS games.

As for Destiny's narrative and your overall point of writing them off (and disregarding the fact that you're replying to someone with an outright grudge against all the things you say at all times ever), I don't think it's fair to view Bungie's storytelling abilities as a failure if Comet doesn't turn it around.

The question then becomes, would you be willing to give them that shot? The question after that would be, what if Destiny 2 brings the story in all of its glory, living up to or surpassing all of what you could have hoped for? And then, would it still be disregarded or abandoned by you, or would you potentially love it and run with it into the remainder of Bungie's 10 year plan (or whatever it is now)?

Indeed. That's basically what I was asking as well.

P.S. Drop the insults. They are completely uncalled for. Thanks. :)

Read. I said I would write them off narratively. I specifically said I would not abandon Destiny just because of the narrative.

Eh, like I said earlier, don't mind him. The reading and hypocrisy thing and such. And to further support you, and also completely destroy that notion of his that someone wouldn't completely write off a company based on just one game, I'd like to point out that I (and many others I know) wrote off 343 over Halo 4 alone. I only got my hands on Master Chief Collection because it was largely rehashed Bungie Halo games, and I didn't pay anything close to full price. There are no future 343 games for purchase in my future, and MCC's failure didn't decide that one.

As for Destiny's narrative and your overall point of writing them off (and disregarding the fact that you're replying to someone with an outright grudge against all the things you say at all times ever), I don't think it's fair to view Bungie's storytelling abilities as a failure if Comet doesn't turn it around.

The Grimoire, as unfortunate as it is that it's stuck on Bungie.net and not in the best type of UI, is really spectacular. Please note that I'm in full agreement with you generally about the "story" in the game, because I don't feel there is a story within the game world. At all. But what I'm getting at is, Comet may have also been planned out ahead, or may be using assets that somehow got cut previously. I'm wondering if you may have to wait for Destiny 2 to wow you. The question then becomes, would you be willing to give them that shot? The question after that would be, what if Destiny 2 brings the story in all of its glory, living up to or surpassing all of what you could have hoped for? And then, would it still be disregarded or abandoned by you, or would you potentially love it and run with it into the remainder of Bungie's 10 year plan (or whatever it is now)?

Really, I think all your talk of losing respect and having your expectations forever colored is just that: Talk. To actually write off a company based on one game is just not something I think you or anyone else would realistically do.

Read. I said I would write them off narratively. I specifically said I would not abandon Destiny just because of the narrative.

To write off a company narratively, even. That's what I was going for... talking about story and all... Sorry if it wasn't clear. :)

Really, I think all your talk of losing respect and having your expectations forever colored is just that: Talk. To actually write off a company based on one game is just not something I think you or anyone else would realistically do.

Read. I said I would write them off narratively. I specifically said I would not abandon Destiny just because of the narrative.

In what possible way could the cliché "do or die" apply to the Comet expansion?

In the sense that in my eyes, this is the first opportunity to actually turn the storytelling around. If they can't here, it will demonstrate their overall narrative ineptitude. These 2 expansions were probably set long enough ago that not much could happen. If they don't, I'm not going to quit Destiny or anything, but I will lose respect for them in the storytelling department and that will forever color my experiences and expectations from here on out.

Past that point I'm just going to stop treating them like they are capable of a good story, and basically no longer get on them if it sucks since it'd be expected.

This seems like a bad policy. For instance, Remember Me (by DONTNOD) was almost good, but ultimately the entire game was a big meh. Especially in the storytelling department where they had a lot of neat story concepts and ideas and... just kinda dropped the ball... down a deep dark sewer. And yet, Life is Strange (the very next game by DONTNOD) is one of my favorite story based games of all time. Same company, two very different outcomes!

Really, I think all your talk of losing respect and having your expectations forever colored is just that: Talk. To actually write off a company based on one game is just not something I think you or anyone else would realistically do.

Do you know how many times Shanks with solar shields have FUCKED me on an Arc nightfall?

Do you!?

LOL just had a thought about a boss that is a jumbo super-shank; this needs to be a thing. Comically big.

I'm telling you, man, next Raid Boss. Shankosaurus!

In what possible way could the cliché "do or die" apply to the Comet expansion?

In the sense that in my eyes, this is the first opportunity to actually turn the storytelling around. If they can't here, it will demonstrate their overall narrative ineptitude. These 2 expansions were probably set long enough ago that not much could happen. If they don't, I'm not going to quit Destiny or anything, but I will lose respect for them in the storytelling department and that will forever color my experiences and expectations from here on out.

Past that point I'm just going to stop treating them like they are capable of a good story, and basically no longer get on them if it sucks since it'd be expected.

Do you!?

LOL just had a thought about a boss that is a jumbo super-shank; this needs to be a thing. Comically big.

Why is Shank burn on a rocket launcher a thing, Bungie?

Perhaps, in the future we'll encounter some mission or round of PoE where it'll be shanks everywhere.

EVERYWHERE, everywhere.

. We all should give everyone a fresh benefit of a doubt everyday, but we know each other well--some conversations have been going on for years!

You know, as nice as that sounds, I disagree.

I don't really disagree with anything else you said, so I'll clarify my point above. I meant that in the old fashioned sense (think: love thy neighbor), and I think we're on the same page. These long-term relationships make this an interesting place! Friendships develop, sometimes people rub us the wrong way--it's all part of the mix and wouldn't happen if we weren't here for something other than using the Fireteam builder. We have our passions. We're different, and we learn from each other. I've seen people grow up here. I've grown up myself, and I was 30 the first time I saw a bungie.org site.

Maybe I've noticed patterns and I've picked on Pete and Cody the last few days (I know once with Cody it was unprovoked), but I hope those guys know I have no ill will toward them. I've been trying to meet those two guys for years! (Still don't know how I've managed not to meet Pete!)

Confession: it's been a rough week. I've come here just to take breaks--very little Destiny or free time the last several days. If I've blown off steam too vigorously in someone's direction, all apologies.

House of Wolves is largely better than Dark Below, except possibly for the end game.

Once again, Bungie has used my ideas by eliminating damage and defense upgrade nodes. This is a great decision, and everything is better now. No downsides. Slowly the tedium of upgrading gear is going away, and perhaps one day will be eliminated altogether (as well as RNG loot).

Have to disagree on both counts. Weapon leveling is now so effortless I don't notice it happening, so it feels like I'm not doing it at all. I've accumulated huge stacks of resources I'll now apparently never need, and yet the game is giving me more than ever for reasons I can't fathom. Not sure why the things spawn in the wild now at all.

Honestly I was afraid of something like this happening to weapon leveling because I couldn't imagine what Bungie meant when they said that the Dark Below mechanic where Xur replaces your exotic with a new one you need to re-level but with higher base stats was a "mistake". I didn't understand that because I couldn't imagine how they could both respect the input of time into upgrading the weapon and also up the base stats without either making the change so easy it would seem meaningless or causing repetition. So they've decided to make it perfunctory; weapon damage jumps straight from the base, which was the old max, to the new max after unlocking a couple perks.

It also means there's less variation in the amount of damage being done across the PvE portions of the game because Guardian weapons vary less, and I think that's a shame.

The story missions are getting better all the time, but still have plenty of room to grow. Especially with a more story heavy expansion, the missions should be even more involved, long, and complex. They should blow Halo missions out of the water, but don't. I understand why, yet given the terrible constraints Bungie has placed on themselves these missions were the best yet, at least in my opinion. Yet, there could have been even more creativity. The VoG platforms make an appearance in the final mission, but are not utilized at all except for a set piece. I was sure that leaping across them was a reminder of how they work, and following they'd play a role in the fight. Maybe cover appears and disappears. Maybe the ground vanishes occasionally and you have to rotate around the arena fighting. But no, that would have been too cool.

I'm guessing that Bungie knows that only a small portion of players raid, and perhaps this functions as a missing tutorial to get people to go into the Vault who haven't been; or, given the surprise involvement of the Vex in the HoW storyline, it's prep not for what comes at the end of that mission, but for what comes in the next expansion, which might be a surprise to people who have not played the Vault.

Why do the story missions top out at 32? Why can't I select them all at level 35 for more difficulty? Again Halo had it right: selectable difficulty. Story missions should have level 30 enemies but have 4 difficulty levels. Simple as that. Even though they were decently fun, they were also rather easy, and I selected 32. I'm not so keen on handicapping myself just to have a challenge.

If you can simulate that by delevelling yourself, why should Bungie put effort into creating the same scenario just to re-juggle the numbers "32" and "35" instead of "28" and "32"?

If Bungie already has variations on those for the daily heroic, why do you want to play them faster than Bungie wants to offer them up? Half the time you're complaining that there's not enough stuff to do, and the other half you're complaining about not having the options to burn through the content even faster.

Bungie needs to up their storytelling yesterday. Here, we have a decent idea for a story, but it's not really given the proper care it deserves. It's baffling. Bungie has done it with Halo, and they should be able to do it with Destiny. Comet is do or die. If they don't get their act together and give us a decent story that is also told well, then they've lost.

Lost... what, exactly?

Let's be nice and friendly again mmk?

Why don't we toss them in with the HBO lot? They could use the meat...

I don't get why some folks get hostile towards one another. We all share a common interest, so even if we disagree on some points, there's no reason we can't respect each other and find common ground. Negativity towards one another doesn't get us anywhere, so just let it go and move on as a community...

Korny, the voice of reason.

Also, you all suck.

After all, you've complained about Destiny for longer than it has existed, yet you are still playing!

Must we go through this again?

1. It is getting better and better but is not where it should be just yet.
2. Yes there are stupid aspects to the game.
3. There are tons of wonderful aspects to the game.

Hence, I can complain yet still enjoy a lot of it.

You dodged the real response there.

In what possible way could the cliché "do or die" apply to the Comet expansion?

Sales have apparently been good. Player engagement is so good that even the game's vocal critics are still playing it.

What evidence can you possibly supply to suggest that the quality or performance of the main game and the two expansions so far released have been so poor that the entire product will live or die based on the release of the next expansion?

The only thing I can think of is that you're saying that Destiny will be dead to you if Comet doesn't use all your ideas instead of just some of them, and that sounds a lot like an addict claiming he can quit anytime he wants.

Let's be nice and friendly again mmk?

Why don't we toss them in with the HBO lot? They could use the meat...

I don't get why some folks get hostile towards one another. We all share a common interest, so even if we disagree on some points, there's no reason we can't respect each other and find common ground. Negativity towards one another doesn't get us anywhere, so just let it go and move on as a community...