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Speculation Saturday #3: The Fallen (Destiny)

by Ragashingo ⌂, Official DBO Cryptarch, Saturday, September 07, 2013, 11:38 (3917 days ago)
edited by Ragashingo, Saturday, September 07, 2013, 12:06

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Last Saturday we puzzled about the what might have beens of Humanity’s fall. Why did it happen? Who was involved? Did The Traveler really save us or did it cause it all? This week we’re going to take a look at The Fallen. We’ve seen more of this enemy race than any other, heck we’ve even very nearly translated their alphabet, but who are they, and why are they here battling with us? Due to continuing technical difficulties we'll once again split up The Facts, Informed Suppositions, and Rampant Speculation.

The Facts:

The Fallen are a scourge, tirelessly engaged in war against us and scavenging all that remains. They say their Houses have claimed every planet and moon we ever touched. If you see one in the wild, know there are many more nearby, and don't hesitate to send their souls screaming into the black.

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These relentless thieves seem driven by desperation and rage. They are crafty, but they usually give up their cover with their clattering and hissing. Most seem outfitted with some kind of shock dagger and pistol, and as far as we can gather, they seem to only have two arms, while other Fallen have four.

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The truths about the Fallen chain-of-command are still making themselves known, but Vandals appear to hold a higher ranking than the Dregs, and deadlier weapons, too. They often have long range capability, but, lucky for us, their weapons take time to charge.

Fallen run in packs, led by an individual Captain. There is no denying a Captain's might; they are the fiercest of the Fallen. There is this sense of tattered nobility to them. You can see it in the way they carry themselves. They think they're better than us. They believe that Earth belongs to them.

I fell in love with the Fallen all the way back in 2009. Partly because there’s just something wonderful about the idea of a nomadic race of once noble houses now scattered to the solar winds. Partly because there’s something primordial and instantly terrifying about squaring off against an unpredictable Fallen Captain, his tattered crimson cape draped over a set of four splayed and angular arms that bristle with sleek firepower.

-Urk
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Once, when I was brave enough to leave the protection of the Tower and venture into the wild alone, I found myself pinned down by a crew of scavenging Fallen raiders.

-DeeJ

The Guardians won’t be the only fighting force in Destiny teeming with unique warriors. Take the Fallen, for example. When people saw them at E3, they were all too quick to compare them to the Elites you fought in Halo. In truth, the Fallen are as varied and diverse as the Covenant as a whole.

We’ll show you how incredible it feels to see a Fallen Captain’s ethereal soul rip from its body after you’ve dusted his crew with your Gravesend Mk. 28 Heavy Machinegun, shattered his absorption shield with a perfectly-placed pulse grenade, and delivered a final, thundering shot with your beloved hand cannon.

Continue on to Informed Suppositions

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Informed Suppositions

by Ragashingo ⌂, Official DBO Cryptarch, Saturday, September 07, 2013, 11:38 (3917 days ago) @ Ragashingo
edited by Ragashingo, Saturday, September 07, 2013, 11:47

- The Fallen came to our system grouped as Houses. I believe Bungie has even said that these houses sometimes fight among each other. [image]What kind of race travels to another solar system and gets involved in infighting while that are far from home, surrounded by powerful enemy factions, and facing a race with an unassailable stronghold that is getting dangerously close to rediscovering the power of its Golden Age?

- Could The Fallen be less of a military and more of a group of outcasts? In Halo Humanity gave their enemies nicknames (,Splitchins, Jackals, Eggheads) but the names and descriptions of the Fallen Dreg, Vandal and Captain don’t feel as made up to me. Could the Fallen’s forces really be made up of criminals and troublemakers? Perhaps under the supervision or guard of Captains? More on this later…

- Why are The Fallen scavenging for things of ours? They are more advanced than we ever were. We had a Golden Age spanning a single system, they apparently had the ability to travel between systems. Maybe it’s less about improving their technology and more about resources and spare parts?

[image]- Fallen come in a variety of shapes and sizes from the Dreg to Rixis the Archon Slayer. Is that just their normal diversity (Humans come in various sizes too) or is there some sort of genetic engineering / space magic-ing going on there?

- Speaking of diversity, why do Vandals and Captains have four arms while Dreges only have two? As others have noted, Dreges seem to have sealed off stubs where their other two arms would be. Are they young / underdeveloped and thus confined to the lower ranks, or are they perhaps worse criminals who had their extra arms removed as a form of punishment?

[image][image][image]- The House of Devils have their spider tanks known as Devil Walkers but I wonder if other houses have other types of armored vehicles? For instance this walker (on right) shows up twice in Destiny’s concept art. If the different houses do have different weapons and vehicles what does that mean in regards to their politics? Could the different houses be as distinct as our different countries here on Earth?

- This question will come up for every race, but how many ships, and vehicles, and individuals do the Fallen even have? Presumably we’ll be killing and destroying bunches of them, do they have a way to make more? We have a incredibly well defended city capable of producing everything from guns to spaceships to new Guardians. Might we beat the Fallen through simple attrition?

Back to The Facts
Continue on to Rampant Speculation

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Suppositious Response

by Xenos @, Shores of Time, Saturday, September 07, 2013, 12:08 (3917 days ago) @ Ragashingo

What kind of race travels to another solar system and gets involved in infighting while that are far from home, surrounded by powerful enemy factions, and facing a race with an unassailable stronghold that is getting dangerously close to rediscovering the power of its Golden Age?

I could see humanity doing that. Imagine if China and the US both figured out how to travel to other solar systems, and then we found a solar system inhabited by a relatively advanced alien race. We would both probably go there, and far from our own planet we would probably take a few shots at each other while our respective governments can't see.

My personal opinion on the Fallen is they have something to do with humanity more than we know since they seem to think they own Earth. I think we talked about it before but my running theory is they may even be altered humans, but I even admit that's somewhat farfetched.

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Suppositious Response

by Ragashingo ⌂, Official DBO Cryptarch, Saturday, September 07, 2013, 13:47 (3917 days ago) @ Xenos

What kind of race travels to another solar system and gets involved in infighting while that are far from home, surrounded by powerful enemy factions, and facing a race with an unassailable stronghold that is getting dangerously close to rediscovering the power of its Golden Age?


I could see humanity doing that. Imagine if China and the US both figured out how to travel to other solar systems, and then we found a solar system inhabited by a relatively advanced alien race. We would both probably go there, and far from our own planet we would probably take a few shots at each other while our respective governments can't see.

Doubly so if the US and China had been nuked to oblivion before hand.


My personal opinion on the Fallen is they have something to do with humanity more than we know since they seem to think they own Earth. I think we talked about it before but my running theory is they may even be altered humans, but I even admit that's somewhat farfetched.

When they say they've claimed all of our planets and moons I think of it more in the "we planed our flag so this planet you call Saturn now belongs to us" sense.

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Suppositious Response

by MrPadraig08 ⌂ @, Steel City, Monday, September 09, 2013, 09:29 (3915 days ago) @ Xenos

I know this is going out on a limb... or 4, but I wouldn't mind going the Halo 2 elite route with the Fallen. We fight, find out we are bonded much closer than we previously thought and now have a buddy cop movie between Guardians and Fallen Angels... defenders?... maybe shepherds?

At any rate, I want to play a Fallen in expansion, sequel, whatever.

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Suppositious Response

by Xenos @, Shores of Time, Monday, September 09, 2013, 09:32 (3915 days ago) @ MrPadraig08

I know this is going out on a limb... or 4, but I wouldn't mind going the Halo 2 elite route with the Fallen. We fight, find out we are bonded much closer than we previously thought and now have a buddy cop movie between Guardians and Fallen Angels... defenders?... maybe shepherds?

A fallen captain wearing sunglasses and chewing on a toothpick just popped into my head.

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Sorry, couldn't resist...

by ZackDark @, Not behind you. NO! Don't look., Monday, September 09, 2013, 09:45 (3915 days ago) @ MrPadraig08

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Sorry, couldn't resist...

by MrPadraig08 ⌂ @, Steel City, Monday, September 09, 2013, 12:05 (3915 days ago) @ ZackDark

I swear if the giant boss and leader of the House of Devils isn't King Crimson, It will be a missed opportunity.

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Night Watch is a must as soundtrack

by ZackDark @, Not behind you. NO! Don't look., Tuesday, September 10, 2013, 17:36 (3914 days ago) @ MrPadraig08

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Rampant Speculation

by Ragashingo ⌂, Official DBO Cryptarch, Saturday, September 07, 2013, 11:38 (3917 days ago) @ Ragashingo
edited by Ragashingo, Saturday, September 07, 2013, 12:02

- Fallen? Fallen from what? I have a theory! I submit that the Fallen are a second race that was first helped by The Traveler and was then destroyed by whatever destroyed Humanity. In fact, I submit that The Fallen were in the middle of a Golden Age bigger and longer and even more fantastical than Humanity’s. [image]They didn’t just span their system, they had made it out to the stars. When the enemy came and began destroying them they, like Humanity, tried to flee. Most didn’t make it. Something powerful to crush two Golden Age civilizations and damage The Traveler probably had no trouble picking off those that fled… Except for the ones already far away.

- In my mind the entirety of the Fallen, at lease as we know them in the Sol system, are in fact what’s left of one or more prison colonies on the far edge of Fallen space. Or being somewhat nomadic in the first place they may have had an advantage that the firmly rooted Humanity didn’t. They saw what was happening to their civilization during their Fall and ran for it in the direction of the only thing they thought could save them, The Traveler. Maybe they did so under orders, maybe they did so out of fear, but we’re not talking about a few convicts, we’re talking about one or more planets worth of undesirables and their guards / overseers. It would have been a massive undertaking. Perhaps they had the help of whatever resources the Golden Age Fallen had left. When your civilization is being destroyed and the only ones you think you can save are the criminals you still save them right?

[image]- So these bunches of criminals along with their guards and perhaps even some military units arrive in the Sol system hoping to enlist the help of The Traveler only to find it dead above Earth. Maybe the civilized Golden Age Fallen would have offered Humanity a hand, tried to join force with them to defeat the evil that destroyed both their civilizations, but these Fallen aren’t them. They have some honorable guards and soldiers, yes, but they have many times the number of criminals. And besides, their race is all but destroyed. There is no government to be loyal to anymore. Survival is the most important thing now.

-And double besides, upon arriving in the Sol system they are attacked on all sides! Cabal, Vex, and Hive each tear into them, and the remnants of the nearly destroyed race who have their singular City beneath The Traveler are pushing out with technology and Space Magic that rivals even that of the Fallen's Golden Age. So, in part desperation, part survival instinct, and part criminal fueled greed, the houses of the Fallen dig in and try and win the war against the other races clustered in the Sol system. Their prize will be The Traveler, and perhaps, the power to avenge the deaths of their people.

That's my theory, but what do you think? Is there some evidence I missed? Is there something that's obvious to you that I didn't touch on? I'd love to hear what you think!

Next Saturday: The City
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We have a city built up over several hundred years able to hold out against alien forces. But how's that going for us really? I hope you'll join me next week as we again look at The Facts, make some Informed Suppositions, and engage in some reckless Rampant Speculation. Until then:
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Back to The Facts
Back to Informed Suppositions

All Speculation Saturdays:
Speculation Saturday #1: The Golden Age
Speculation Saturday #2: The Fall
Speculation Saturday #3: The Fallen
Speculation Saturday #4: The City
Speculation Saturday #5: The Gameplay
Speculation Saturday #6: What's New?
Speculation Saturday #7: The Hive
Speculation Saturday #8: The Vex
Speculation Saturday #9: The Cabal

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Rampant Speculation

by TTL Demag0gue ⌂ @, Within the shadow of the Traveler, Saturday, September 07, 2013, 13:14 (3917 days ago) @ Ragashingo

I have to wonder if the Fallen are, in fact, effectively highly evolved insects. All but the lowest caste have six limbs, and their heads do seem to be at least vaguely insectoid (the mantis comes immediately to mind). It could be that each house is itself a kind of hive with its own royal hierarchy and caste system. Many insect species (e.g. honeybees) use hormones to determine the type of adult into which the larva ultimately pupates. Perhaps the Fallen use a similar system to shape their houses. The Dregs could essentially be the 'worker' class, and the nubs of the vestigial arms could be a result of the Fallen's young that are forced into that class.

Just something that occurred to me the other day that's probably way off the actual mark. :)

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Rampant Speculation

by Ragashingo ⌂, Official DBO Cryptarch, Saturday, September 07, 2013, 13:42 (3917 days ago) @ TTL Demag0gue

It's not a bad theory. Here, let me help it a bit:
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vs.
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The Hive seem like vaguely insectoid space zombies… and they (can) die in a very similar way to the Fallen… at least according to the early concept art. Perhaps they're related?

Eh, maybe I didn't so much help as branch off in a completely different direction. At least I had good intentions! :p

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Rampant Speculation

by Kalvin, Saturday, September 07, 2013, 16:19 (3917 days ago) @ Ragashingo

Maybe the Sol System was the originally the Fallen's but when they advanced they moved onto a bigger and better system. Then when they were knocked down off their Golden Age they retreated to their original home (the Sol System) only to find it overrun with many different species. So they tried to reclaim it from the the people that now inhabit it but since they aren't as powerful as they were before this proves difficult but The Fallen being former owners of the system feel entitled to it so they don't give it up without a fight. This is where we (The Guardians) come in and fight the Fallen and fend them off from our beloved newly rebuilt City that they claim as theirs.

Or something along those lines

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Rampant Speculation

by Malagate @, Sea of Tranquility, Sunday, September 08, 2013, 07:09 (3916 days ago) @ Ragashingo

I like the idea of the Fallen as a race that previously was bestowed gifts by the Traveler, and then were nearly wiped out. It puts them in an almost-sympathetic light, not so different from the humanity's Guardians.

However, the feeling I just can't shake is that they're more related to humanity than we currently have any reason to suspect. And this may just be residual Forerunner-were-Humans stuff kicking around in my brain, but my favorite thought relating to their origins is that perhaps during the Golden Age, humanity split into different factions that adhered to (or eschewed) genetic engineering. The Fallen obviously would have taken this to extremes, making themselves literally inhuman, and possibly gone their own way in the galaxy. This theory would at least explain claiming every world humanity has touched. Because, y'know. They would already have been there, reclaiming whatever they could of their lost humanity.

~M

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Humans = Fallen??

by Ragashingo ⌂, Official DBO Cryptarch, Sunday, September 08, 2013, 09:44 (3916 days ago) @ Malagate

It's interesting. My default assumption is that Bungie has done Halo for the last decade, and that if given a choice will explore concepts other than a Covenant of races or super powerful ancient Humans that we didn't know we're connected to.

In their place I'm seeing themes of a diverse set of enemies, each with different goals. And instead of mysterious, ancient Humans who ran the galaxy, I'm seeing much stronger, much more familiar links to our traditional Humanity. We'll still be exploring our past, but this time it will a past we can actually relate to.

I'm probably overcorrecting against Halo, but there it is.

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Humans = Fallen??

by Malagate @, Sea of Tranquility, Sunday, September 08, 2013, 14:44 (3916 days ago) @ Ragashingo

I don't entirely disagree. And huge swaths of my theories and others', I'm sure; are wildly wrong, but this part of the game is the most fun for me. Once we get our hands on it and are really able to sink our teeth in, it will be a wholly different kind of love. (eww.)

I had thought that bipedal, symmetrical physiology was a little boring when we got introduced to all the races we've seen so far, so I figured that some, if maybe not all of them could have started out as human (the Cabal could have, easily). Freaky alien locomotion has been one thing I've really wanted to see lots of, and we get that with the Fallen and their walkers. I'm hoping there's more to come.

But speaking of Golden Ages got me thinking of this little gem I read a couple years ago:

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Which, as it turns out, deals with humanity's empire across our own system. While Wright isn't the greatest author, he's got some incredibly imaginative ideas that are largely rooted in hard science. And there are a couple that resonate (to me) with things we've seen out of Destiny thus far.

I kind of want to ask DeeJ for a reading list (if this kind of thing hasn't been discussed already) of the inspirational reading that had factored heavily into Destiny's development, in the same way that Starhammer and the Vang books, Ringworld, as well as The Mote series (among others) factored into Halo's story.


~M

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Just wanted to say that I'm enjoying these threads. :)

by ncsuDuncan @, Saturday, September 07, 2013, 21:42 (3916 days ago) @ Ragashingo

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:)

by Ragashingo ⌂, Official DBO Cryptarch, Saturday, September 07, 2013, 21:45 (3916 days ago) @ ncsuDuncan

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