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THAB 05/31/18 - Year 2 Reveal Event Details (Destiny)

by CyberKN ⌂ @, Oh no, Destiny 2 is bad, Thursday, May 31, 2018, 15:03 (2155 days ago)

https://www.bungie.net/en/Explore/Detail/News/46917

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Also Included:

-Changes to Faction Rallies
-Changes to Escalation Protocol

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Faction Rallies!

by cheapLEY @, Thursday, May 31, 2018, 15:10 (2155 days ago) @ CyberKN
edited by cheapLEY, Thursday, May 31, 2018, 15:15

Big changes, that I think are great.

Pledging to a faction should be a meaningful choice.

  • Players may now only pledge to one faction per account during a Faction Rallies event
  • Reputation progress is retained through multiple events, and it will not be reset during the season, even if a player changes allegiance
  • Each faction offers unique rewards, such as Exotic armor ornaments or Masterwork Catalysts for Exotic weapons

We are planning to host three Faction Rallies events over the course of Season 3

  • Dead Orbit will offer the Eye of Another World ornament and the Graviton Lance Catalyst
  • New Monarchy will offer the Crest of Alpha Lupi ornament and the Sweet Business Catalyst
  • Future War Cult will offer the Knucklehead Radar ornament and the Sunshot Catalyst


I'm glad that pledging a Faction will actually mean something now, rather than just running three characters through on different factions. Really going to be a tough choice between Dead Orbit and Future War Cult for me.

And a new Renown system, that acts a sort of modifier. Get Renown by killing High Value Targets or doing Public Events. It stacks (no mention of what the cap is). The higher the Renown, the more tokens you'll get in Lost Sectors. It also lowers damage resistance, increases enemy damage output, and lowers health regen. Renown is lost upon death. With Renown active, you can see what Faction other players have pledged.

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I think it's another example of Bungie's flawed "fixes".

by Korny @, Dalton, Ga. US. Earth, Sol System, Thursday, May 31, 2018, 20:06 (2155 days ago) @ cheapLEY
edited by Korny, Thursday, May 31, 2018, 20:45

Big changes, that I think are great.

Pledging to a faction should be a meaningful choice.

Yes, they should have an impact on players, and on the effect that it has from a social perspective, and from a lore/gameplay standpoint.
When people demanded this, they meant that it shouldn't just be focused on grinding for tokens.

So what is Bungie's solution? Limitation... and Tokens. All focused around our favorite activity: Grinding Lost Sectors (or rather, the single easiest and fastest Lost Sector).

  • Players may now only pledge to one faction per account during a Faction Rallies event

This is terrible. I want Dead Orbit armor and ornaments for my Titan. I want New Monarchy shaders and weapons for my Warlock/Hunter. But now I'll have to lock into a single stream of rewards. What this means is that If I want to hit max rank with any faction, I'll more than likely have to forego any of the other two for the entire Season. And no matter which faction you want to support, the non-faction-related rewards are the only effective motivator now.

[*] Reputation progress is retained through multiple events, and it will not be reset during the season, even if a player changes allegiance

Which would be great if Faction Rally wasn't a once-a-month deal, which is made worse by the points above.

[*] Each faction offers unique rewards, such as Exotic armor ornaments or Masterwork Catalysts for Exotic weapons

Right, but these rewards have nothing to do with the factions themselves, and railroad you towards joining a faction you might not otherwise like. If there were faction-themed exclusive rewards, it would be a whole 'nother thing, but it's Stabbim's MIDA problem on a grander scale instead. I don't want to have to fully commit to Dead Orbit just because I want a Catalyst for my Lance. You know why other games can get a pass for a similar system? Because there is always a trade/market system where we can pay a premium to get things from factions that we aren't a part of. There are alternatives.

We are planning to host three Faction Rallies events over the course of Season 3

So you have one shot at loot from all three factions. That will just put more pressure on the grind, and people will have more incentive to finding the cheapest, fastest way to get the rewards. That doesn't lead to engaging interactions with the factions. That doesn't make them more interesting or "meaningful" in the sense that players have been asking for. It's not player-friendly.

  • Dead Orbit will offer the Eye of Another World ornament and the Graviton Lance Catalyst
  • New Monarchy will offer the Crest of Alpha Lupi ornament and the Sweet Business Catalyst
  • Future War Cult will offer the Knucklehead Radar ornament and the Sunshot Catalyst

I'm glad that pledging a Faction will actually mean something now, rather than just running three characters through on different factions. Really going to be a tough choice between Dead Orbit and Future War Cult for me.

I'm calling it right now:

Dead Orbit wins the faction Rally, solely because of the Graviton Lance catalyst. It won't even be close.
New Monarchy ends up in second place. Some folks out there want the Sweet Business catalyst more than the Lance's. That's cool.
And Future War Cult will, as always, be dead last. If Benedict was a faction, he'd be above FWC.

GG Bungie, you "fixed" Faction rallies alright.

And a new Renown system, that acts a sort of modifier. Get Renown by killing High Value Targets or doing Public Events. It stacks (no mention of what the cap is). The higher the Renown, the more tokens you'll get in Lost Sectors. It also lowers damage resistance, increases enemy damage output, and lowers health regen. Renown is lost upon death. With Renown active, you can see what Faction other players have pledged.

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Other than the stupid (IMO) armor effects (Can I please have an option to disable those, Bungie?), the Renown system is pretty great. That's good challenge design, though it sounds like building stacks can be a bit time consuming. Still, it's a good change that I'd love to see built upon moving forward.


But yeah. Factions should be more meaningful in the sense that we should be able to build our characters through interacting with them, and it should give us a better understanding of the faction's lore, characters, mission, and impact.

Saying "They're more meaningful, because you're locked into a single faction account-wide, content is locked to each one, and you can only interact with them on three specific weeks until our September DLC drops" is not what we've been asking for.

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I think it's another example of Bungie's flawed "fixes".

by cheapLEY @, Thursday, May 31, 2018, 20:33 (2155 days ago) @ Korny

You make good points.

I still like it, although I admit for purely selfish reasons. I now no longer have to feel bad when I only run one character.

I think it's a huge improvement from what Faction Rallies have been in the past. I still do think making Lost Sectors the sole focus is a mistake. At least the Renown adds something to the mix, and, at least on paper, will encourage more people to be out in the patrol zones to get those stacks.

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Question

by Cody Miller @, Music of the Spheres - Never Forgot, Friday, June 01, 2018, 00:26 (2155 days ago) @ Korny

I've never done a faction rally before so I don't know how it works.

If I pledge to FWC to get the Sunshot catalyst, but they don't win, do I get nothing?

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Question

by Harmanimus @, Friday, June 01, 2018, 01:34 (2155 days ago) @ Cody Miller

You get everything you earned via packages.

There are 3 weapons and the winning faction’s weapon is available for purchase with glimmer. The next rally those weapons are in the regular Faction loot tables.

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Question

by Cody Miller @, Music of the Spheres - Never Forgot, Friday, June 01, 2018, 08:12 (2154 days ago) @ Harmanimus

You get everything you earned via packages.

There are 3 weapons and the winning faction’s weapon is available for purchase with glimmer. The next rally those weapons are in the regular Faction loot tables.

So I will definitely be able to get the sunshot catalyst? Since you can only pledge to one faction now, does it mean I will never be able to get the graviton lance catalyst?

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Question

by cheapLEY @, Friday, June 01, 2018, 08:54 (2154 days ago) @ Cody Miller

You get everything you earned via packages.

There are 3 weapons and the winning faction’s weapon is available for purchase with glimmer. The next rally those weapons are in the regular Faction loot tables.


So I will definitely be able to get the sunshot catalyst? Since you can only pledge to one faction now, does it mean I will never be able to get the graviton lance catalyst?

No. You can only pledge one faction per Faction Rally. The next time Faction Rally comes around, you can pledge a different faction.

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Question

by Cody Miller @, Music of the Spheres - Never Forgot, Friday, June 01, 2018, 09:43 (2154 days ago) @ cheapLEY

You get everything you earned via packages.

There are 3 weapons and the winning faction’s weapon is available for purchase with glimmer. The next rally those weapons are in the regular Faction loot tables.


So I will definitely be able to get the sunshot catalyst? Since you can only pledge to one faction now, does it mean I will never be able to get the graviton lance catalyst?


No. You can only pledge one faction per Faction Rally. The next time Faction Rally comes around, you can pledge a different faction.

I see. But if next time there is a cool fusion rifle from FWC I’d have to choose between the lance catalyst and that if I pledge FWC this time?

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Of course not

by ZackDark @, Not behind you. NO! Don't look., Friday, June 01, 2018, 09:54 (2154 days ago) @ Cody Miller

I see. But if next time there is a cool fusion rifle from FWC I’d have to choose between the lance catalyst and that if I pledge FWC this time?

There's no 'choice'. You go for the catalyst. ;p

An Addendum

by EffortlessFury @, Friday, June 01, 2018, 16:10 (2154 days ago) @ Harmanimus

You get everything you earned via packages.

There are 3 weapons and the winning faction’s weapon is available for purchase with glimmer. The next rally those weapons are in the regular Faction loot tables.

All players the week following the rally can buy the winning team's weapon for glimmer. It is provided at a discount to anyone who had pledge to that team during the rally.

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Another question

by Cody Miller @, Music of the Spheres - Never Forgot, Tuesday, June 05, 2018, 11:39 (2150 days ago) @ EffortlessFury

So I pledged to FWC because they are boss and because I want the sunshot catalyst. But it says that I need to reach rank 50 to get it. How long do faction rallies last? How long can you earn tokens for? What do you earn tokens for doing? This looks like yet another stupid grind.

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Another question

by Harmanimus @, Tuesday, June 05, 2018, 12:53 (2150 days ago) @ Cody Miller

You can earn tokens for one week. They have changed up how it works since Season 2. But essentially collect Renown and run Lost Sectors seems to be the implied play route.

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Another question

by Cody Miller @, Music of the Spheres - Never Forgot, Tuesday, June 05, 2018, 13:44 (2150 days ago) @ Harmanimus

You can earn tokens for one week. They have changed up how it works since Season 2. But essentially collect Renown and run Lost Sectors seems to be the implied play route.

So I have a week to earn enough tokens to get to 50? That mastwrworks better be fucking sweet.

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Another question

by breitzen @, Kansas, Tuesday, June 05, 2018, 14:30 (2150 days ago) @ Cody Miller

You can earn tokens for one week. They have changed up how it works since Season 2. But essentially collect Renown and run Lost Sectors seems to be the implied play route.


So I have a week to earn enough tokens to get to 50? That mastwrworks better be fucking sweet.

Not necessarily, there will be three Faction Rallies this season. So you can work towards the same faction multiple Rallies (ranks don't reset until the new season in Sept.) or try to hit 50 during each Rally with the different factions.

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I think it's another example of Bungie's flawed "fixes".

by Malagate @, Sea of Tranquility, Friday, June 01, 2018, 07:49 (2154 days ago) @ Korny

So... why wouldn't you just pledge to one faction, grind Renown like nobody's business; and then pledge to a different faction on the next rally, rinse and repeat?

I agree that aspects of the changes feel like railroading, I have different classes that always pledge to their respective factions and I'm pretty bummed that I almost certainly won't cop all the gear I want from here on out.

HOWEVER, I imagine that this is a "gentler" way to differentiate loot among the player base, while strengthening the significance of faction gear. In the same way a full set of Prestige Raid armor says something, so too will faction kit. It means something now; but the opportunity to collect had to be reduced to get us there. Would be nice if gear (or gear sets) had unique traits like Raid stuff.

I'm gonna wait until after the rally to decide how I really feel. Seeing Dead Orbit win one will be nice, even if the game is thrown before it even starts. But at least those durn Space Republicans won't win again!!! Nyeh!

~M

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I think it's another example of Bungie's flawed "fixes".

by cheapLEY @, Friday, June 01, 2018, 09:02 (2154 days ago) @ Malagate

I think they’re try to get folks to accept that you’ll never have every piece of gear. I can understand why some hate that, but I personally like that. I know that’s sort of hypocritical given the stances I normally take on gating content.

In a way, this sort of caters to casual players too. Now I don’t feel like I’m missing out by running three characters with three different factions. It’s not really that different, as I assume most will still run three characters and completely knock out one faction per rally.

I totally understand why folks wouldn’t like this, and logically I agree. But in my gut, I like this change.

I wouldn’t want to be locked into a faction forever, but I’d like to see it get to a point where I feel okay really actually pledging to a faction and never deviating from that faction, rather than just treating it as a checklist full of gear. I don’t know how to accomplish that. Some sort of actual community goals for factions that have real game/story affects that we can see would be nice. (Cue Korny talking about Warframe or something).

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I think it's another example of Bungie's flawed "fixes".

by Korny @, Dalton, Ga. US. Earth, Sol System, Friday, June 01, 2018, 10:09 (2154 days ago) @ cheapLEY


I wouldn’t want to be locked into a faction forever, but I’d like to see it get to a point where I feel okay really actually pledging to a faction and never deviating from that faction, rather than just treating it as a checklist full of gear. I don’t know how to accomplish that. Some sort of actual community goals for factions that have real game/story affects that we can see would be nice. (Cue Korny talking about Warframe or something).

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-Factions have unique questlines, all dealing with different aspects of the game's lore, and giving you access to unique loot (usually a Warframe that's tied to their quest's story).
-Your allegiance to a faction causes your reputation with opposing factions to diminish, almost irrevocably so.
-Allied Factions also level up, but at a reduced rate, and they offer missions as well that can boost your leveling with them to give you access to their reward pools.
-Every player gets their own daily set of daily faction missions. If you play with someone in the same Faction (or an ally of your faction), you can double the number of missions available to you. Faction missions all contain hidden collectables that you use to gain more standing with that faction. There is no cap to how many of these collectibles you can get per day, which encourages you to play with various people in your faction.
-Enemy factions will occasionally send distinct enemy groups to sabotage your missions.
-Every faction has a tiered reward pool that opens up as you level them up, including exotic variants of the game's weapons (with faction-exclusive perks), faction-themed cosmetics, and even scenes for the game's 8-player Photo/Theater mode.
-You can trade with players allied to enemy factions, as you are each other's only way to acquire a number of the rewards.

Also, despite the fact that Warframe's tone is that of a Rankin-Bass era cartoon, the game's writers aren't afraid to go places. One faction's questline deals with a character that has Asperger's, another deals with a child whose people infect with a fatal brain disease (for the greater good). It's good stuff.

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Faction-specific questlines, strikes, & pursuits plz.

by Malagate @, Sea of Tranquility, Friday, June 01, 2018, 10:47 (2154 days ago) @ Korny

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I think it's another example of Bungie's flawed "fixes".

by Malagate @, Sea of Tranquility, Friday, June 01, 2018, 10:28 (2154 days ago) @ cheapLEY

I think they’re try to get folks to accept that you’ll never have every piece of gear. I can understand why some hate that, but I personally like that. I know that’s sort of hypocritical given the stances I normally take on gating content.

Hypocrite, shmypocrite. I hate saying this because of how people tend to use it; but you're entitled to your opinion/perspective.


In a way, this sort of caters to casual players too. Now I don’t feel like I’m missing out by running three characters with three different factions. It’s not really that different, as I assume most will still run three characters and completely knock out one faction per rally.

Bingle might be well served to just come out and say "the intent here is to create a more organic effect on the equipment of the player base; previously collect-them-all provided a flattening/endgame aspect to loot collection" or something. I think it's a subtle touch, and I absolutely believe that players shouldn't always get what they want. I appreciate it for what it is, even if its going to affect my experience in a way I'm not super excited about. The risk here though, is that there's an assumption that the game will stay popular. But I guess that's always the risk regardless.

I totally understand why folks wouldn’t like this, and logically I agree. But in my gut, I like this change.

Me too.


I wouldn’t want to be locked into a faction forever, but I’d like to see it get to a point where I feel okay really actually pledging to a faction and never deviating from that faction, rather than just treating it as a checklist full of gear. I don’t know how to accomplish that. Some sort of actual community goals for factions that have real game/story affects that we can see would be nice. (Cue Korny talking about Warframe or something).

Well, ostensibly that's their goal here. I'm excited to see how they'll continue to approach it. My only real beef is being forced out of my own headcanon regarding my Guardians' stories, which has become a much bigger deal to me than I expected.

My Hunter is a human FWC lifer; attempting to play the longest game there is.
My Titan is an Awoken Dead Orbit goth betch to the bone.
My Warlock is an Exo with a bit of an identity crisis; trying to (re?)learn humanity and seeking the boundaries of knowledge.

Their narratives that I've been building; telling my own story as intended since the birth of the IP are being forced by the structure of the Faction investment game. It seems all of my characters will need to pledge to the same faction for me to make the headway I want, in a way that sort of screws over the most delicate parts of my investment in the game.

It's pretty nit-picky, to be sure.

C'est la vie.

~M

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I think it's another example of Bungie's flawed "fixes".

by Kermit @, Raleigh, NC, Friday, June 01, 2018, 10:53 (2154 days ago) @ Malagate


I'm gonna wait until after the rally to decide how I really feel. Seeing Dead Orbit win one will be nice, even if the game is thrown before it even starts. But at least those durn Space Republicans won't win again!!! Nyeh!

Dude, they're Space Tories.

The factions are the tories, the militarists, and the Cure fans.

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I think it's another example of Bungie's flawed "fixes".

by Malagate @, Sea of Tranquility, Friday, June 01, 2018, 11:09 (2154 days ago) @ Kermit


I'm gonna wait until after the rally to decide how I really feel. Seeing Dead Orbit win one will be nice, even if the game is thrown before it even starts. But at least those durn Space Republicans won't win again!!! Nyeh!


Dude, they're Space Tories.

The factions are the tories, the militarists, and the Cure fans.

Hey, motivated DIY-ers need not be reduced to their taste in music!! Also thank you for canonically legitimizing my Titan's hairstyle.

~M

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I think it's another example of Bungie's flawed "fixes".

by Kermit @, Raleigh, NC, Friday, June 01, 2018, 11:29 (2154 days ago) @ Malagate


I'm gonna wait until after the rally to decide how I really feel. Seeing Dead Orbit win one will be nice, even if the game is thrown before it even starts. But at least those durn Space Republicans won't win again!!! Nyeh!


Dude, they're Space Tories.

The factions are the tories, the militarists, and the Cure fans.


Hey, motivated DIY-ers need not be reduced to their taste in music!! Also thank you for canonically legitimizing my Titan's hairstyle.

~M

Hey, I'm a Cure fan myself, although I never adopted Robert Smith's style.

I just realized that only one of my guardians has hair. Acclimating myself to hairlessness I guess.

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Fascists have the best fashion.

by Robot Chickens, Friday, June 01, 2018, 12:13 (2154 days ago) @ Malagate
edited by Robot Chickens, Friday, June 01, 2018, 12:17

But at least those durn Space Republicans won't win again!!! Nyeh!

[image]

[image]

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If you’re a clown selling hamburgers that is.

by Harmanimus @, Friday, June 01, 2018, 12:22 (2154 days ago) @ Robot Chickens

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Ronald McDonald's bold new direction

by Robot Chickens, Friday, June 01, 2018, 12:37 (2154 days ago) @ Harmanimus

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The hamburgers are cooked in the abdomen.

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Ronald McDonald's bold new direction

by Kermit @, Raleigh, NC, Tuesday, June 05, 2018, 13:37 (2150 days ago) @ Robot Chickens

[image]

The hamburgers are cooked in the abdomen.

Words never before spoken in that order.

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Needs more black.

by INSANEdrive, ಥ_ಥ | f(ಠ‿↼)z | ᕕ( ᐛ )ᕗ| ¯\_(ツ)_/¯, Friday, June 01, 2018, 16:19 (2154 days ago) @ Robot Chickens

- No text -

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Background Image

by squidnh3, Thursday, May 31, 2018, 15:14 (2155 days ago) @ CyberKN

Sure looks like Reef stuff.

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THAB 05/31/18 - Year 2 Reveal Event Details

by Cody Miller @, Music of the Spheres - Never Forgot, Thursday, May 31, 2018, 16:55 (2155 days ago) @ CyberKN
edited by Cody Miller, Thursday, May 31, 2018, 17:07

Renown is lost when players are defeated by enemies, so be careful when you're attempting to loot a Lost Sector with high Renown!

So uh, does that mean they are going to actually make lost sectors hard? :-p

Reading these stats, not as many players are attempting Escalation Protocol with a fireteam of three as our designs intended, mostly because of how difficult waves 6 and 7 are.

Maybe the rather punishing light level requirement has something to do with that too…

It seems to me the best thing to do would be to scale the difficulty with the number of players in the event. They said it themselves: they have the ability to 'switch' the enemy levels to different values. So why not set the difficulty based on the number of current players? Why not spawn extra enemies for additional players? It should be such that more players is always advantageous, but not overwhelmingly so. I remember while playing Diablo 2, if a player joined the game "Diablo's minions grow stronger". It was the same type of system designed so that large groups don't completely steamroll, yet single players aren't hopelessly overpowered by the enemies.

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THAB 05/31/18 - Year 2 Reveal Event Details

by Korny @, Dalton, Ga. US. Earth, Sol System, Thursday, May 31, 2018, 20:28 (2155 days ago) @ Cody Miller

Renown is lost when players are defeated by enemies, so be careful when you're attempting to loot a Lost Sector with high Renown!


So uh, does that mean they are going to actually make lost sectors hard? :-p

Reading these stats, not as many players are attempting Escalation Protocol with a fireteam of three as our designs intended, mostly because of how difficult waves 6 and 7 are.


Maybe the rather punishing light level requirement has something to do with that too…

It seems to me the best thing to do would be to scale the difficulty with the number of players in the event. They said it themselves: they have the ability to 'switch' the enemy levels to different values. So why not set the difficulty based on the number of current players? Why not spawn extra enemies for additional players? It should be such that more players is always advantageous, but not overwhelmingly so. I remember while playing Diablo 2, if a player joined the game "Diablo's minions grow stronger". It was the same type of system designed so that large groups don't completely steamroll, yet single players aren't hopelessly overpowered by the enemies.

In Borderlands, not only do the enemies get stronger when people join you, but the quality of the loot drops also increases (and you can stack drop-rate-boosting artifacts on characters, too).

I think you're over-estimating how much effort Bungie put into the difficulty flags.

I think a better solution for Escalation Protocol would have been to have two modes by default:

Normal- Activated like it is already. It's much lower-light, but the more people you have in your fireteam, the tougher it is, and the better the chances are at loot drops.

Heroic- Doing two Patrol missions, a Heroic Public Event, or successfully completing three Normal waves of Escalation Protocol will rile up enemies in an area (reward you with a Heroic Token). You can hold down the activation Button longer on a tower to trigger Heroic Escalation Protocol, which is at the current difficulty that it's been at. It's very tough, but clearly doable, and you have a higher chance at Catalyst drops on every boss fight. Completing Three waves at this difficulty guarantees Legendaries, with a high chance at being at or above your current Light level (If you do get a Powerful engram drop on wave 3, you will have to beat Wave 5 to reset a reward cooldown so that Wave 3 can drop a Powerful engram again). Solo players who help you complete at least three waves also have a higher chance at a Powerful/exotic Engram drop. You can also get exclusive ornaments for Ana Bray's armors, apart from the existing EP armor set.

Now randoms have a much higher incentive to help you, while you have a higher incentive to activate Heroic Escalation Protocol, but lower-light/solo players can also experience a version of the content in its entirety, and have it be rewarding!

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THAB 05/31/18 - Year 2 Reveal Event Details

by cheapLEY @, Thursday, May 31, 2018, 20:30 (2155 days ago) @ Korny

but lower-light/solo players can also experience a version of the content in its entirety, and have it be rewarding!

Pfft, what do you think this is? Warframe?
(:

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THAB 05/31/18 - Year 2 Reveal Event Details

by ManKitten, The Stugotz is strong in me., Friday, June 01, 2018, 07:07 (2154 days ago) @ Cody Miller

Reading these stats, not as many players are attempting Escalation Protocol with a fireteam of three as our designs intended, mostly because of how difficult waves 6 and 7 are.

This line that you highlighted seems to be the basis of so much frustration. We aren't playing the game as they intended. What if the intention of the game was just to have fun? Instead of having all these stipulations and rules and designs of intention, how about we just have a game that we can play however we want.

I am so tired of constantly referencing Halo as a comparison to Destiny but, my goodness, the freedom we had in that game! I think we would have way more fun with this game if it were designed as a playground. Or maybe when they are brainstorming things, replace the phrase "but they have to" with "and they get to".

Imagine the difference in Escalation Protocol using those two terms.

Guardians will fight multiple waves of powerful enemies [but they have to] be in a fireteam or scrap together random players to beat it.

Guardians will fight multiple waves of powerful enemies [and they get to] be in a fireteam or scrap together random players to beat it.

The first design locks you in to only beating it one way.
The second design provides multiple ways to beat it.

At this stage of their existence... have we EVER played the game they way they intended?

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THAB 05/31/18 - Year 2 Reveal Event Details

by Harmanimus @, Friday, June 01, 2018, 09:50 (2154 days ago) @ ManKitten

I think that is a major disservice to the designs and obvious design intent of most of Halo under Bungie’s stewardship. The narrower scope and (generally) lower play hours in most of the play spaces tint most of those memories. Given that the majority of folks play time was in PvP and the functions of map design in Halo, most of the maps have a number of “but they have to” elements in order to improve win probability. And PvE spaces have similar design logic.

I don’t think it is fair to Destiny to suggest Halo was a bastion of player freedoms without designer influence.

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THAB 05/31/18 - Year 2 Reveal Event Details

by Malagate @, Sea of Tranquility, Friday, June 01, 2018, 11:06 (2154 days ago) @ Harmanimus

I don’t think it is fair to Destiny to suggest Halo was a bastion of player freedoms without designer influence.

Halo was kind of designed to be a sandbox, though. You could take the same handful of implements of destruction and approach a situation multiple ways. Physics played a huge part in gameplay. Destiny is MUCH more limited in that respect.

And of course every aspect in both cases has been designer-influenced. But Destiny's moment-to-moment gameplay feels...scripted, I guess, in comparison.

~M

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THAB 05/31/18 - Year 2 Reveal Event Details

by Harmanimus @, Friday, June 01, 2018, 12:01 (2154 days ago) @ Malagate

I can take any variety of gear, I can approach an engagement from any angle I can travel to, and I have various emegent gameplay motivators through exotics and class perks. I guess I just feel like saying that everything in Destiny is somehow less of a sandbox than Halo would be the same as someone playing through the Halo campaigns but never changing weapons from what they spawn with and always walking the same path through each level.

I admit they are structurally different in their approach to sandboxing (comparing curated linear playspaces to modular variable playspaces), but I don’t think that is something Destiny lacks - unless it is self-imposed. The perspective of Destiny as less of a sandbox might just be higher encounter familiarity due to staying in locations for longer spans of time. /shrug

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Agreed.

by Ragashingo ⌂, Official DBO Cryptarch, Friday, June 01, 2018, 12:37 (2154 days ago) @ Harmanimus

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THAB 05/31/18 - Year 2 Reveal Event Details

by ManKitten, The Stugotz is strong in me., Friday, June 01, 2018, 12:58 (2154 days ago) @ Harmanimus
edited by ManKitten, Friday, June 01, 2018, 13:02

(channeling my inner Stugotz here)

There were things that could be modified in Halo.

In the campaigns there were skulls. These skulls were sometimes a direct smack in the face to "not how we intended you to play it" Also, the campaigns WERE linear, so yes in that regard you had to play it as designed. But they eventually added in things like times and scores, these also changed the design of the gameplay. But in PvP, there is no comparison. Heck, we had Forge where we could build our own maps, gametypes, pretty much anything and everything we could customize as we pleased.

Destiny 2 is:

Players are opening treasure chests too fast and we didn't intend that.
Players are ranking up too fast and we didn't intend that.
Players are earning tokens too fast and we didn't intend that.

ooh...you mean we were playing the game? Extremely well and efficiently based on the task?

But with escalation protocol, their intention was "Hey we will make this really difficult so players have to team up with everyone else on the map to beat it."

Really? Who thought that was good? Nobody wants to rely on blueberries, especially in patrol. It's one thing jumping into strikes with randos, you all know what you're getting into and have a common goal. In patrol, you're mixing up all light levels, some people are working on catalyst quests, some are doing lost sectors, one guy has been standing there for 5 minutes with a bubble of dots over his head. This is who they intended us to play this extremely difficult mode with?

[image]

They need to give up this "intentional design" stuff and give us our freedom of choice back. "I mean, they outta be ashamed of themselves, how 'bout that?" - Stugotz :P

P.S. I'm not nearly as bothered by all this as my post sounds.

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The "Faction Rally 2.0" Thoughts + Salt

by INSANEdrive, ಥ_ಥ | f(ಠ‿↼)z | ᕕ( ᐛ )ᕗ| ¯\_(ツ)_/¯, Thursday, May 31, 2018, 22:33 (2155 days ago) @ CyberKN

Destiny Update 1.2.1 brought improvements to Faction Rallies for Season 3. Back in March, the Seasons team discussed their overall goals for the event. Today, we’ll revisit those goals and outline the changes that have been made to achieve them.

Those goals being...

Seasons Team: We have been reviewing player feedback on Faction Rallies and are planning to make some fundamental changes to the event. Here are a few of the overall goals we are trying to achieve:

  • Pledging to a faction should be a meaningful choice.
  • Rewards should not be time-gated.
  • Faction Rallies should provide a unique gameplay experience and not simply be a reward layer on top of the existing game.
  • The event should grant additional insight into faction lore and goals.
  • It should build upon player interest in Lost Sectors and armor ornament objectives.

Keep this list in mind, and I now return you to this weeks THAB quotes with my thoughts in Bold Green.

Pledging to a faction should be a meaningful choice.

  • Players may now only pledge to one faction per account during a Faction Rallies event
    No more juggling factions per event. Gives whatever choice you make have more weight.
  • Reputation progress is retained through multiple events, and it will not be reset during the season, even if a player changes allegiance
  • Each faction offers unique rewards, such as Exotic armor ornaments or Masterwork Catalysts for Exotic weapons
    Destiny is a loot based franchise, so this honestly is to be expected, but it also makes point number 4 irrelevant. "The event should grant additional insight into faction lore and goals." Why are people joining, for lore or loot? Apparently Guardians are some the worst sort of false friends. I'll come back to this point at the end.
  • We are planning to host three Faction Rallies events over the course of Season 3
    .... O_o planning to host... only three? Uh oh. With this set up, I don't like where those words may possibly lead game play wise.
  • Dead Orbit will offer the Eye of Another World ornament and the Graviton Lance Catalyst
  • New Monarchy will offer the Crest of Alpha Lupi ornament and the Sweet Business Catalyst
  • Future War Cult will offer the Knucklehead Radar ornament and the Sunshot Catalyst
    Translation: We hate Future War Cult too, but it's ok because they already knew that.

Alright... so the next one looks to beeee... "Rewards should not be time-gated."

Seasonal Vendor Progression
Shit.

  • Each faction now features ranks, which players can reach by earning faction tokens
  • Faction rank-up rewards will continue to grant Legendary armor and weapons past Rank 30
    Past rank 30? Has... has that been an issue?

Faction Rallies should provide a unique gameplay experience and not simply be a reward layer on top of the existing game. Additionally, these events should build interest in Lost Sectors and armor ornament objectives.
In other words, they bundled the next two points into this one.

  • Faction Rallies now features the “Renown” system
    • After pledging to a faction, players may earn Renown by completing a public event or patrol, or by defeating high-value targets on destinations
    • Players who loot a Lost Sector with Renown active will receive significantly more faction tokens than usual—the more stacks of Renown they have, the more faction tokens they earn
    • Renown is lost when players are defeated by enemies, so be careful when you're attempting to loot a Lost Sector with high Renown!

  • Renown increases the level of challenge in gameplay
    • Health regeneration is vastly reduced (all stack levels)
      • Enemy kills have a chance to drop health orbs (all stack levels)
  • Player damage decreased (scales with stack, up to 5)
  • Incoming damage increased (scales with stack, up to 5)
    So... in other words, they put nightfall into Lost Sectors? Am I understanding that right? If so... UGH! Not only is that not a unique game play experience, that is... just unfortunate. Destiny 2 already has plenty of spaces to play in with bullet sponges. It's obvious that the environment artists really took care in creating some of these game play spaces (per the usual), and it's sad these spaces are just being relegated to more of the same shit. UGH! My goodness! These spaces beg to be a Raid Light. A one or two phase halfway point, but no... just... Lost Sectors deserve better.

    While Renown is active on a player, others around them can see which faction the player has pledged to:
    [image]
    Here. Let me embed to you what I think about this...

... Life will go on, but for as long as I have that tramp stamp floating on my 3rd person, I'm going to be screaming internally.

...And that's it. That is updated faction rally. It's different, but the same, A.K.A Destiny 2. Anyone here notice what's missing? Hint hint...

  • The event should grant additional insight into faction lore and goals.

I miss when Bungie cared about proper storytelling in games. Admittedly and as implied people are primarily joining for loot, but what choice do we have? THERE IS NO LORE unless you care enough to dig beyond the surface description, and frankly there are other games that care more that make it less difficult to find lore. To find story. Shoot! Freeking Overwatch does a better job with lore! Well... once again Activision/Bungie you've shown how much of a fool I apparently must be.



¯\_(ツ)_/¯

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The "Faction Rally 2.0" Thoughts + Salt

by DiscipleN2k @, Edmond, OK, Thursday, May 31, 2018, 23:11 (2155 days ago) @ INSANEdrive

[*]Dead Orbit will offer the Eye of Another World ornament and the Graviton Lance Catalyst
[*]New Monarchy will offer the Crest of Alpha Lupi ornament and the Sweet Business Catalyst
[*]Future War Cult will offer the Knucklehead Radar ornament and the Sunshot Catalyst
Translation: We hate Future War Cult too, but it's ok because they already knew that.

Dude, if they hate Future War Cult so much, would they be bribing everyone to join by offering up this sweet, sweet sidearm for new FWC recruits?

[image]


Wait, sorry, that one's a little hard to see. One sec...


[image]

Aww, yeah. There she is. Rightfully given pride-of-place in the bottom-right 5% of the image. We're going to have so many new FWC recruits, we'll have to start turning people away!

-Disciple

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The "Faction Rally 2.0" Thoughts + Salt

by Xenos @, Shores of Time, Friday, June 01, 2018, 07:33 (2154 days ago) @ DiscipleN2k

To be fair, I think out of the three Catalysts Graviton Lance is the one most people will want (at least from what I've seen in the wild). Really they are setting up Dead Orbit to win.

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It's like they're not even trying anymore

by Beorn @, <End of Failed Timeline>, Friday, June 01, 2018, 09:45 (2154 days ago) @ Xenos

To be fair, I think out of the three Catalysts Graviton Lance is the one most people will want (at least from what I've seen in the wild). Really they are setting up Dead Orbit to win.

No joke. It's going to be a landslide.

Between terribly lame Warlock Bonds and miserable FWC loot/shaders, it's like Bungo doesn't want me to have the things that I like. :-P

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It's like they're not even trying anymore

by Robot Chickens, Friday, June 01, 2018, 10:33 (2154 days ago) @ Beorn

Between terribly lame Warlock Bonds and miserable FWC loot/shaders, it's like Bungo doesn't want me to have the things that I like. :-P

From the looks of it, I don't think I like any of the new armor sets. The only thing that caught my eye is the FWC Titan helm. It's hard to tell from this image, but I think it may look good. I've been looking for a good one since D2 started.

[image]

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It's like they're not even trying anymore

by Ragashingo ⌂, Official DBO Cryptarch, Friday, June 01, 2018, 11:15 (2154 days ago) @ Beorn

To be fair, I think out of the three Catalysts Graviton Lance is the one most people will want (at least from what I've seen in the wild). Really they are setting up Dead Orbit to win.

No joke. It's going to be a landslide.


[image]

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