Actually: *SPOILERS* (Off-Topic)

by stabbim , Des Moines, IA, USA, Tuesday, December 22, 2015, 14:48 (3262 days ago) @ cheapLEY

Allow me to pile on...

3. Kylo Ren, a powerful Force-user, fights a light saber duel with an ex-janitor who has never held a light saber and yet (a) never uses the Force on his opponent, though doing so would have ended the duel immediately, and (b) barely wins the fight, suggesting that he is simultaneously one of the least strategic wielders of the Force the Dark Side has ever seen and, despite his training, absolutely terrible with a light saber. None of this stops Kylo Ren from designing and building his own, completely impractical cross-barred lightsaber.

I see this complaint all the time, and it's stupid. He handily wins the fight against Finn; it's not even close. Keep in mind that he's wounded. But how do we know what Finn's training is? Finn fights another Stormtrooper with that electrified club thing; maybe Finn has trained with that thing? He handled himself alright in that fight, so it's a possibility.

People also forget that The Force is not just some resource that obeys commands. It controls the user as much as the user controls it, maybe even more. Those who wield it are sometimes just instruments, used to whatever end The Force is working toward. Being a Force sensitive person doesn't necessarily mean you win everything. It does mean that you sometimes progress toward your destiny in unusual ways, but that destiny still might be your own doom.

Basically, this person needs to play KotOR II. Kreia droppin' some knowledge on fools.

4. Rey becomes nearly as effective a Force-user in a few hours as Luke Skywalker did in a few years.

I think that's intentional, and it's supposed to show us both that Rey is very powerful with the Force and that Kylo Ren isn't as well-trained and badass as he thinks he is.

Yep. There's plenty of precedent in the Star Wars universe for exceptional force-users who gain ability faster than normal, or with not much training. Darth Bane developed pre-cognition abilities years before he even knew The Force existed. Also, see above about the nature of The Force. If it needs Rey to win the mental battle against Kylo in the chair, then she will.

Also, I think it's pretty clear that aside from lacking proper training, Kylo is unfocused and may not even be a "true" follower of the dark side. He mostly just seems to be lost and trying to emulate Vader. He surely must have some innate ability given his lineage, but he's not necessarily reaching that potential in his current role. My guess is he'll end up having a Vader-like change of heart further down the road. Which makes me wonder who his dark adversary will be at that point.

6. The reason Ren was slowly bleeding to death -- instead of being dead by Rey's hand -- is that a massive a chasm had just miraculously opened up in the several feet between the two of them. Such bad timing for Rey! (Damn you, deus-ex-geology!)

Well there was a massive earthquake happening from the explosion and destabilization. Sure, lucky that it separated them. Not worth being upset about.

Yeah, that's not really a plot hole. It is, however, a literal hole. ;)

7. Rey, who has never left her home planet since she was a child, can speak Wookie. Nobody can speak Wookie -- it's a running joke in the Star Wars universe. But Rey being able to speak Wookie surprises neither her, Han Solo, nor Chewbacca himself.

Can she? I honestly don't remember her answering Chewie, but I've only seen it once so I might have just missed it.

No, she doesn't answer, she merely understands what he said. Lots of people have that ability, including Han himself. This could mean she's well-read, but it could also just be a manifestation of The Force.

8. It's okay that Poe survived a Tie Fighter crash; after all, so did Finn. But has any film ever cared less about (a) giving the false impression a character has died, and then (b) having that character show up later with no one being surprised by it? Even Finn doesn't seem to care very much what the explanation is.

Did anyone actually believe Poe was dead? I would call that person naive.

Again, this is not actually a plot hole. Why would there need to be an explanation? There was no special way Finn survived, he simply woke up and walked away. Why would Poe not have been able to do the same thing? Apparently Star Wars universe airbags and chassis crumple zones are just hella good. The only thing Finn might reasonably wonder about is how Poe got away from the wreck and off of Jakku. Which, though I'm sure Finn might wonder about it in his head, isn't really necessary to go into for the purpose of advancing the film's plot.

11. Kylo Ren is the head of the Knights of Ren, but there are no other Knights of Ren in the movie.

Plot hole doesn't mean what he thinks it means, I don't think. Just because they're not in the movie doesn't mean they don't exist. Also he's wrong, as they're in Rey's vision.

So what? Why do they need to be in this movie? It's the first part of a trilogy, it NEEDS to set up mysteries precisely like this. Good grief, is this guy for real?

Also, who says Kylo's the head of the Knights? Maybe he's just a disciple. I think this person's assuming the Knights of Ren are named after Kylo, but remember that Kylo Ren is not his given name. It might be that he took the name AFTER joining this organization, to denote his membership.

12. Captain Phasma is supposed to be a big-deal character in The Force Awakens, if the merchandising and casting are any indication, and yet (a) how bad of a commanding officer do you have to be, how thoroughly inept in military tactics and strategy, to command the worst-trained fighting force in the Galaxy (the Stormtroopers hit even less with their blasters in The Force Awakens than in any preceding Star Wars film); (b) she's only in three scenes, in one of which she relays an order from Kylo Ren to initiate a massacre of innocents (hardcore!) and in another of which she immediately surrenders to Han, Rey, and Finn as soon as they encounter her and then does exactly everything they ask of her (pathetic!), making her character incomprehensible; and (c) in her third scene she effectively reveals that Finn's character is incomprehensible, as she notes that he has in fact been trained since birth to obey all orders, and has never in his life disobeyed even a single order until the day he decides to act like he's never been trained, indoctrinated, or dehumanized at all.

Okay, agreed, Phasma was underused and kindof stupid.

Yeah, she did seem pretty under-utilized TBH. Still, this is hardly a plot hole. Just something that maybe could have been fleshed out better, and it might be later. Maybe not in the films, but a character like that (who stands out but isn't delved into) is a perfect opportunity for some EU material.

14. Finn is an ex-janitor who goes AWOL from a Stormtrooper force numbering in the tens of thousands. Yet he is absolutely convinced, despite being someone of no importance whatsoever to the First Order, that he will be chased across the galaxy for having defected. Apparently, there's a premium on janitors in this quadrant of the Galaxy. Sure, Finn killed some people during his escape, but doesn't the First Order emphasize with every tactical decision it makes that it considers its soldiers thoroughly expendable, and don't they quite obviously have much bigger fish to fry during the events of The Force Awakens than to worry about Finn? Why wouldn't this be obvious to him?

Okay, he's a janitor. I don't think he's privy to all the First Order's grand plans. He's probably been indoctrinated to think that abandoning the First Order will lead to a manhunt and is the worst thing he could ever do. That's how ruling by fear works.

You nailed it. His initial characterization revolves around his fear of the First Order and desire to get away. That fear doesn't have to be entirely rational, in fact part of the schtick, I think, is that he is overly fearful.

On the other hand, maybe they do relentlessly hunt down the disobedient. We have no evidence to suggest otherwise. It's true that stormtroopers are considered disposable, but that only means their bosses don't care or feel remorse if they die. It does NOT mean that said bosses are content to let them go free, which might encourage others to do the same and lead to more disobedience. That's a pretty fantastic leap in logic, and indicative of someone who's just TRYING to make up faults IMO.

16. By the end of the movie, the impression is left that every single First Order soldier is dead besides Supreme Leader Snoke, General Hux, and Kylo Ren.

Are we given that impression? Was every single Imperial soldier killed aboard the first Death Star? I certainly wasn't given that impression.

I didn't think so. By "the impression is left," I think they mean "I assumed, based on no evidence other than having seen SOME of them die." ONCE AGAIN, how is this a plot hole? This is just devolving into a list of questions now, many of which are OK questions to have hanging in the air after the first film of a trilogy. Why do we need to know the exact number of troops left on each side? Even if this was a universe where number of troops mattered, that would be an OK question to leave for the next movie. But this is Star Wars, where only the major characters really matter. It always comes down to Jedi vs. Sith in the end.

17. Why does General Hux need to gather all of his troops just to tell them he's about to press a button and destroy the entire Republic? Can't he do that without a cattle-call of his entire army? Because it really ends badly for him, putting his entire army on the very planet he's about to make Resistance Target #1. No chance anybody saw that coming?

It's a dramatic show of force and probably some sort of morale booster for his troops. It's what they've been working for. Making a sort of ceremony around it isn't that peculiar.

Right. This seems pretty obvious. I agree that having everyone (though again, no evidence that it is actually "everyone") in one place is a tactical mistake, but how does that matter? What, movie characters don't make mistakes? This is just silly.

19. Why wasn't the Resistance able to access R2D2's data archives at any point over the course of the many years Luke was gone? Why did they, instead, simply prop him up in a corner, when they had to know that he knew Luke's whereabouts -- as he always has in the past?

It seemed pretty clear to me that Luke did something to him to make it impossible to retrieve that information until the time was right.

Yup. Duh. C-3PO specifically mentions that R2-D2 conveniently powered down around the time Luke disappeared. Seems pretty obvious that he was just waiting for the right time. And anyone who thinks that trying to hack R2-D2 would be a worthwhile endeavor is out of their mind. :P

21. Kylo Ren has such a Force-enabled sense of where his father is in the Galaxy that when his father lands on Starkiller Base, Ren immediately exclaims to himself, "Solo!" Yet a few minutes later, when Ren is just twenty feet from Solo, he can't detect him -- and actually starts searching for him in the wrong direction.

The exact same thing happens in A New Hope. Vader senses Obi-Wan's presence, but doesn't know exactly where he is

It's not a damn radar. Sheesh.

24. Rey says that the Millennium Falcon is "garbage" and hasn't been flown in many, many years. Indeed, it's such junk, in her view, that she won't even board it when she's about to be ripped to pieces by twenty Tie Fighters. Then she gets on board and it basically flies perfectly. So much so that it's not at all clear why no one has been flying it, let alone why its owner (Unkar Plutt) hasn't tried to sell it at any point over the past dozen years -- despite the fact that Plutt appears to live in a hovel.

It's the Millennium Falcon, that's sort of the running joke. Yeah, everyone thinks it's garbage, but it's not, and it's basically indestructible and just keeps on running. Also, maybe he hasn't sold it because to him it's like that rusted out, beat up '67 Mustang that he'll fix up "someday".

Oh FFS, now they're harping on the idea that the Millenium Falcon is more than it appears? Has this person ever seen a single Star Wars film? I don't even know how to respond to this.

25. Why does Plutt offer Rey 250 times her usual pay for BB-8 and then, when she says "no," simply tell some of his heavies to just steal it? If Plutt is enough of a baddie to order it stolen at all, why not just steal it from the outset instead of first offering some random urchin the biggest financial windfall she's ever seen?

Because it's often much, much easier to buy something than it is to take it by force. And more importantly, because that moment informs us on Rey's character more than her simply fighting a few dudes to protect him would.

Her normal pay is crap. 250 times that is still a piddly amount to him. It's pretty clear that he's the rich one here and everyone else is working for such small scraps that they're almost slaves. Also, he probably has to pay his goons, and I bet they're more expensive than the meager sustenance he gives the scavengers. So really, his initial offer not only represented less potential trouble, it likely would have been cheaper for him.

26. Maz Kanata is a friend to the Resistance. So why is she hiding Luke's light saber from them? Wouldn't she give them anything she could to help them find Luke, and doesn't it in fact turn out (as anyone could have supposed) that Luke's light saber is indeed helpful in tracking the last Jedi down?

Where was is said Maz Kanata is a friend to the Resistance? She's a friend of Han Solo, the smuggler, who doesn't have anything to do with the Resistance.

And anyway, you don't just give a lightsaber to any old goon. You wait for the right person.

29. Who trained Rey to fight with a staff as effectively as she does, given that (a) she is an orphan with no friends or family, and (b) she has never been in a battle, but is, rather, merely a scrap-metal scavenger?

That's an awful lot of assumption about someone we've know for all of five minutes of her 20-something year life. How do we know she's never been in a battle? In fact, I'd bet you're wrong and that she's had to fight plenty to survive on Jakku.

No one trained her. She's been surviving on her own in a lawless wasteland since she was a toddler, and we're surprised that she might have had to bash a few skulls?

30. If Finn is such a good guy that he would try to save Rey the moment he saw she was in distress, doesn't it further call into question just how in the world the order to kill civilians on Jakku was the first time he'd ever had qualms about doing something the First Order had asked him to do?

Again, he was a garbage-man. It seemed pretty clear that was the first time he'd seen combat.

This is just a repeat of 13.

Also, can I just say that bit where Finn starts going to help her, and then she just beats the guys down on her own, was great? Aside from being funny, it established early on who Rey is.

31. Given that all Poe knows about Finn is that he's a First Order defector, why does he seem happy to see Finn just seconds after (and perhaps as) BB-8 tells him Finn is alive? There's no real reason for Poe to trust Finn -- or care about his well-being -- at all. Rather, he would assume, as anyone would, that whatever Finn did or did not do on Jakku, he surely had committed other atrocities for the First Order (and killed many a Resistance fighter) before then.

You wouldn't be happy to see the person that saved your life?

33. Why does Kylo Ren assign just a single Stormtrooper to guard Rey, the most valuable prisoner in the history of the First Order?

Why wouldn't he? She's locked up pretty securely.

He felt it was the correct course of action. Sometimes The Force works towards its own ends, and just uses people.

34. How do the Rathtars on Han's freighter get loose? If he's just keeping them loose in the hanger, why don't they kill him when he's walking through the freighter toward the Millennium Falcon, or at any other time? And if he's got them chained up, how do they escape?

That's literally explained in the movie. Pay attention instead of trying to find things to point out on the internet.

Seriously, there's a whole bit of dialogue whose only purpose is to lead up to them being released. Did they even see the movie?

36. Why are all Stormtroopers human (or humanoid)? If by the time of the First Order any clones being raised to be Stormtroopers are no longer clones of Jango Fett, why aren't there now Stormtroopers of every species as well as every (human) race? Why aren't there flying Stormtroopers from the same species as, say, Watto (from The Phantom Menace)?

I guess maybe it's not canon anymore, but the Empire used to be basically a bunch of racists and didn't want anything to do with anyone that wasn't human.

The same reason that Nazis were all white Germans. Sheltered childhood much?

37. If basically everyone in the Galaxy knows the Force is not a myth -- for instance, every single Stormtrooper in the First Order, who has seen Kylo Ren use it or heard tell of him using it; every single person in the Resistance, who knows the Resistance is looking for Luke Skywalker; every single person in the Republic, which was first established in part by the heroism of the Jedis -- how is the existence of the Force a total shock to Rey? Jakku is sheltered, but as we know from the film (cf. Lor San Tekka) there are many people on Jakku who either have seen the Force first-hand or heard first-hand accounts of it from visitors to the planet.

I've seen this point a lot, too. What it boils down to, I think, is that not many knew about the Force to begin with, and the Empire spent the better part of 40 years erasing the Jedi and the Force from history books everywhere. In A New Hope, people that worked directly with Vader didn't believe in the Force.

I also get the impression that not many people know the full legacy of Luke Skywalker. The only one that knows what happened in the second Death Star is Luke anyone that Luke happened to tell, which probably only amounts to Leia and Han.

It's pretty much a Star Wars trope at this point that the Sith always set about trying to erase the legacy of the Jedi. And they're not the only ones. The Jedi ban certain Sith knowledge and artifacts.

TL:DR; the author of this piece is bad and he should feel bad (and pay more attention the movies he's trying to bash online).

TBH I think he should pay LESS attention and just try to enjoy the friggin' story.