
Thanks for the pre-click insight regarding the BWU's content
by Korny , Dalton, Ga. US. Earth, Sol System, Thursday, December 10, 2015, 20:11 (3366 days ago) @ CruelLEGACEY
:P
Oops, early click.
But yes, this is a meaty update. Read it!

Really appreciated urk's section
by Xenos , Shores of Time, Thursday, December 10, 2015, 20:17 (3366 days ago) @ CruelLEGACEY
Not that I was worried, but it's nice to know that big stuff is coming even within the next few months.

Yep.
by Ragashingo , Official DBO Cryptarch, Thursday, December 10, 2015, 20:28 (3366 days ago) @ Xenos
There's still something to be said about being in front of such confusion instead of having to head it off after it has already started rolling downhill... away from the station. In this case, it would have helped a lot if the move to micro transactions based content updates had been officially announced. Yeah, we knew that the Live Team was doing more, but most that we knew about no more paid DLC expansions came from rumors or, at best, incomplete online magazine / website interviews. And then the pessimisim mill got going... and here we are.
It comes back to this: We won't know a major change in distribution has happened if nobody tells us. :(
Yep.
by Earendil, Thursday, December 10, 2015, 21:01 (3366 days ago) @ Ragashingo
It comes back to this: We won't know a major change in distribution has happened if nobody tells us. :(
We also won't know a major change in distribution if they decide quickly that the current path isn't working. It's possible that the microtransactions could have been a failure, thus causing them to go to plan B. Heck, maybe microtransactions WAS plan B, we don't know. But if Bungie makes a huge announcement and a big deal out of something, it makes it harder for them to course correct.

BWU is up!
by Blackt1g3r , Login is from an untrusted domain in MN, Thursday, December 10, 2015, 20:17 (3366 days ago) @ CruelLEGACEY
I feel like Bungie is working hard this year to improve their communication with the players. It's nice to see them confirm a lot of what we already expected including the fact that the pretty numbers in the UI are rounded and don't necessarily translate directly to damage changes.
- That AR "buff" was intentionally small because of the "magnifying" effect of certain +impact mods, which still means they buffed some weapons by nearly zero. That 0.04% damage buff... that's not going to make the weapon relevant in PvP.
- The pulse rifle nerf is minor (despite the 10% damage reduction, the TTK of most pulse rifles remains unchanged).
- Anecdata: The Chaperone seems to have received an overall buff instead of the nerf that was seemingly described, as headshots are now fatal at a greater range. In the one PvP game I played yesterday, I absolutely wrecked with it. Other shotguns are reporting insignificant changes to range.
- Hand cannons: Hawkmoon is being reported as a less reliable 2 shot kill (only with a specific, not as aim assisted barrel selected, apparently), and was effectively nerfed. No other hand cannons seem too different, and TLW remains OP in terms of TTK at close range and neutral game buff from increased mobility. First Curse is still garbage in PvP (3 very slow shots to kill), but is much more effective in PvE. Working as intended?
- Fusion rifles: Does anyone use these? Have info? I got nothin'.
In fact, I don't have any further info on the weapons. I looked at the numbers and also played with a few guns in the most affected categories to see how they felt, and this is what I've got. Chaperone, man... It's soooo goood.
My gut says the current PvP meta is not going to shift even one iota. The net result of all this is that high skill players will dominate more often and lower skill players will feel dominated more often, but weapons of choice will remain pretty much the same. Not my ideal balance scenario, I can tell you that.
--
Totally aside: I'm having a blast with SRL. It's really, really fun and the looser controls for the bikes means it requires constant attention without being overly complicated.

Some gun notes
by Xenos , Shores of Time, Thursday, December 10, 2015, 20:32 (3366 days ago) @ Kahzgul
- Fusion rifles: Does anyone use these? Have info? I got nothin'.
They feel significantly better to me, but reddit is claiming they are worse. I'm wondering if they are using the slow firing fusion rifles which had a lot less change. My quick charging Omolon fusion rifle feels much better than it did before the patch.
I really liked fusions up until they changed the default spread of the projectiles. They are now at best close medium range weapons, not great short range and horrible long range. They just don't have a useful enough min-max range to be effective.
There's a reason why pulse/shotguns are ruling PvP for the most part. A good pulse will get you to the beginning of long range and is better than a scout at short range. And short range a good shotty is by far superior.
Snipers are good if you've got a decent primary that works up close. I've seen HC/sniper combos work well for really good snipers for example.
But really, it's about covering as many bases as you can with your primary/secondary. And fusion rifles give up too much for what amounts to "good only from further short range or close medium range".

Some gun notes
by Ragashingo , Official DBO Cryptarch, Thursday, December 10, 2015, 20:44 (3366 days ago) @ Kahzgul
Eh. Updated change log says Pilse Rifles got up to a 14.23% damage reduction with the popular ones getting a 10.96% nerf. This places them at a lower damage output than they've been since The Dark Below (I think, someone find the 9% across the board increase and fact check me.) That 9% buff was certainly felt, so a 10 - 14% one should be as well. And given the pulse-y drift-y nature of Pulse Rifles and missing a bullet here or there the buffs and nerfs probably don't tell the whole story.
On Shotguns: My Invective NBP Defender felt unchanged but I tended to put all four shots into people so maybe I didn't notice? Ultimately, if all the change does is prevent the longest ranged Lengedaries from one shotting me at Sidearm range then that's good enough. Even shotguns should kill without having to first put the barrel THROUGH someone's helmet.
Eh. Updated change log says Pilse Rifles got up to a 14.23% damage reduction with the popular ones getting a 10.96% nerf. This places them at a lower damage output than they've been since The Dark Below (I think, someone find the 9% across the board increase and fact check me.) That 9% buff was certainly felt, so a 10 - 14% one should be as well. And given the pulse-y drift-y nature of Pulse Rifles and missing a bullet here or there the buffs and nerfs probably don't tell the whole story.
On Shotguns: My Invective NBP Defender felt unchanged but I tended to put all four shots into people so maybe I didn't notice? Ultimately, if all the change does is prevent the longest ranged Lengedaries from one shotting me at Sidearm range then that's good enough. Even shotguns should kill without having to first put the barrel THROUGH someone's helmet.
Apparently the pulse nerf was such that you need 7 out of 9 hits to be headshots with nirwen's, which is 1 more headshot than before, but is not a big enough change that I've noticed. Red Death is slightly less effective (you now need all 6 shots to hit the head in a 2 burst scenario, which is pretty hard). The people who will allegedly feel it the most are hawksaw users (I don't have one, so I can't personally check), but the damage nerf there means 12 or 13 of 15 rounds need to be headshots out of 5 fired bursts, which is *much* harder to pull off. Even so, the amount of flinch that gun delivers still provides a nice advantage.
Shotguns: The range nerf doesn't seem to have affected Conspiracy Theory-D in any noticeable way to my eyes. I don't have a party crasher to check, and my vendor Patch-A feels the same (maybe better, honestly. I feel like I'm shooting a tighter spread, but it's hard to know for sure.

I like Newsk's section. It answered my biggest question.
by Funkmon , Thursday, December 10, 2015, 22:03 (3366 days ago) @ CruelLEGACEY
The question of how did this not get fixed? Answer: he doesn't know. I'm satisfied. Sometimes you fuck up!
I liked Urk's section, and he I think he might have insulted the Destiny community's fickle emotions with his time travelling jealousy. It seems like they trash everything until they get what they want, then they trash what they get after about a week.
"Raids need to be complicated!"
*KF raid*
"This is great!"
*1 week*
"This raid takes too long!"
*Challenge mode*
"Raids need to be more complicated!"
- No text -

I like Newsk's section. It answered my biggest question.
by cheapLEY , Thursday, December 10, 2015, 22:45 (3366 days ago) @ Funkmon
The question of how did this not get fixed? Answer: he doesn't know. I'm satisfied. Sometimes you fuck up!
I liked Urk's section, and he I think he might have insulted the Destiny community's fickle emotions with his time travelling jealousy. It seems like they trash everything until they get what they want, then they trash what they get after about a week.
"Raids need to be complicated!"
*KF raid*
"This is great!"
*1 week*
"This raid takes too long!"
*Challenge mode*
"Raids need to be more complicated!"
That sounds about right.
Urk's outline of future plans actually has me pretty excited. Honestly, probably more excited than another HoW or TDB would have me.

I like Newsk's section. It answered my biggest question.
by Kermit , Raleigh, NC, Thursday, December 10, 2015, 22:55 (3366 days ago) @ cheapLEY
The question of how did this not get fixed? Answer: he doesn't know. I'm satisfied. Sometimes you fuck up!
I liked Urk's section, and he I think he might have insulted the Destiny community's fickle emotions with his time travelling jealousy. It seems like they trash everything until they get what they want, then they trash what they get after about a week.
"Raids need to be complicated!"
*KF raid*
"This is great!"
*1 week*
"This raid takes too long!"
*Challenge mode*
"Raids need to be more complicated!"
That sounds about right.Urk's outline of future plans actually has me pretty excited. Honestly, probably more excited than another HoW or TDB would have me.
Me, too. I like not knowing what's coming, especially if there's nothing to buy. I think SRL is a success. It's like Bungie gave me a racing game I didn't know I wanted for Christmas!

I like Newsk's section. It answered my biggest question.
by Cody Miller , Music of the Spheres - Never Forgot, Thursday, December 10, 2015, 23:07 (3366 days ago) @ Funkmon
"Raids need to be complicated!"
*KF raid*
"This is great!"
*1 week*
"This raid takes too long!"
People only said it took too long because it was the only way to get good gear. If there were other ways, and you could play the raid just for the sake of playing it, then nobody would complain it takes too long. I love a good long raid like anybody else, but not when you have to finish it every week just gear up.
You are missing the nuance to the complaints.

I like Newsk's section. It answered my biggest question.
by cheapLEY , Thursday, December 10, 2015, 23:11 (3366 days ago) @ Cody Miller
"Raids need to be complicated!"
*KF raid*
"This is great!"
*1 week*
"This raid takes too long!"
People only said it took too long because it was the only way to get good gear. If there were other ways, and you could play the raid just for the sake of playing it, then nobody would complain it takes too long. I love a good long raid like anybody else, but not when you have to finish it every week just gear up.You are missing the nuance to the complaints.
We do have more ways, now, and people are still complaining. Just sayin'.
I think the complaints were pretty valid. Being stuck at low light because you're waiting on raid drops sucks. It's where I'm at. SRL has me well on my way to getting out of that hole, though.
I like Newsk's section. It answered my biggest question.
by Claude Errera , Thursday, December 10, 2015, 23:18 (3366 days ago) @ Cody Miller
"Raids need to be complicated!"
*KF raid*
"This is great!"
*1 week*
"This raid takes too long!"
People only said it took too long because it was the only way to get good gear. If there were other ways, and you could play the raid just for the sake of playing it, then nobody would complain it takes too long. I love a good long raid like anybody else, but not when you have to finish it every week just gear up.
Bullshit.
You are missing the nuance to the complaints.
And you're willfully misconstruing it.

BWU is up!
by Cody Miller , Music of the Spheres - Never Forgot, Thursday, December 10, 2015, 22:12 (3366 days ago) @ CruelLEGACEY
No mention of the fusion rifle non buff. As a lover of fusion rifles in PvP this was on my mind. Maybe the chaperone will become a replacement.