Xbox slightly removes stick from butt (Destiny)
by petetheduck, Monday, March 14, 2016, 23:41 (3270 days ago)
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Instructions unclear, stick still in my butt. Xbox no help.
by Funkmon , Tuesday, March 15, 2016, 00:34 (3270 days ago) @ petetheduck
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Nothing could help you
by CougRon, Auburn, WA, USA, Tuesday, March 15, 2016, 00:47 (3270 days ago) @ Funkmon
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must eat sock before stick can be removed.
by unoudid , Somewhere over the rainbow, Tuesday, March 15, 2016, 00:48 (3270 days ago) @ Funkmon
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Just Curious
by unoudid , Somewhere over the rainbow, Tuesday, March 15, 2016, 00:47 (3270 days ago) @ petetheduck
Is this a push from Microsoft as a way to continue to move towards combining the PC and XBone? Is this cross-platform support really a way to weaken their gaming console in favor of having a broader gaming dominance with games being on windows and xbox? Not sure if this makes sense. But mainly wondering if this plays into a 10-year plan instead of just a 2-year plan.
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Network effects.
by narcogen
, Andover, Massachusetts, Tuesday, March 15, 2016, 01:07 (3269 days ago) @ unoudid
Is this a push from Microsoft as a way to continue to move towards combining the PC and XBone? Is this cross-platform support really a way to weaken their gaming console in favor of having a broader gaming dominance with games being on windows and xbox? Not sure if this makes sense. But mainly wondering if this plays into a 10-year plan instead of just a 2-year plan.
I think they're admitting they've lost the installed base war for this generation.
Imagine, for example, a world where the PS4 outsold the Xbone 10:1, and everybody plays Destiny. There are 1 million Xbox-owning Destiny players, but 10 million on PS4.
Privately, MS approaches Sony about cross-platform play. Sony sees that this benefits MS more than it does Sony. With the smaller installed base, Destiny on the Xbox will take longer to do matchmaking, and will support fewer active playlists. There's also the chance that people will leave the platform for the PS4 to gain access to the playerbase, thus making the problem worse.
Adding 1M Xbox players to the pool of Destiny players on Sony's platform won't benefit that platform as much as adding 10M Sony players to the pool of Xbox players would, so Sony declines to allow cross-platform play.
Of course, this example assumes that the gap between the platforms is large, and that each platform owner both knows, and is willing to admit publicly, what the relationship is. If the gap is only a few million and not an order of magnitude, then it's likely the underdog only considers it a matter of time before they are in the lead, so in this case, neither side wants cross-platform play. Neither side wants to be seen as seeking it, because it can be interpreted as admission of a weaker position.
Promoting cross-play between PS4 and Windows, for instance, would be an obvious tactic by Sony. It means the Sony playerbase actually gets augmented by players on a Microsoft owned platform from which Microsoft draws no benefit, since they get a cut of game sales on Xbox but don't on Windows, and don't control that platform the way they do the Xbox.
I've actually seen similar effects in different industries. In the late 90s /early 2000s, the first two GSM mobile operators launched in Kazakhstan. At that time, both were part owned by Turkish mobile operators that were competitors in their home market, and were engaged in a proxy war here. Voice calls (by legislative requirement) between the two operators passed through the national wireline operator at a high tariff (so all three would get a cut). That made those calls expensive. Calls in-network were the cheapest, and operators would practically give those minutes away in order to attract users. (They still do this today.)
The sticking point was text messaging (SMS). Neither operator would seek or grant permission for text messages to flow between the two operators. With expensive internetwork calls and no internetwork SMS, many people carried two phones. (I did for several years.) Allowing subscribers to a competitors network to access subscribers on your network via SMS would mean that users could drop one of their two phones, and everyone was afraid of being the one that got dropped.
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Developer Pushed?
by red robber , Crawfish Country, Tuesday, March 15, 2016, 01:55 (3269 days ago) @ narcogen
Is it possible that some of the developers have pushed this? Perhaps as a way to keep their game's playerbase as large as possible? Imagine your game is slowly dying and your base is split between two consoles. You may essentially be able to double your matchmaking pool and provide better service to the consumers. It may also help sell more games from the launch. If a game has a heavy multiplayer/coop portion, but many of your friends play on a different console, you may not buy a game. With cross-console, I could imagine a small boost to sales.
Of course this is the opposite of what the console makers want. Exclusive games can sell their consoles. How many games are there that are really console sellers though? The halo series was the most obvious for Xbox. But imagine how much more money Bungie could have made (if they were independent at the time) by also selling Halo on PS.
It seems to me that the winners of this system are the devs/publishers, and the consumer. Console makers have to rely more on the quality, performance, and features of the console to increase sales. Again, this is a win for the consumer because the manufacturers are more likely to make positive changes and add features to compete.
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Yes, but not why it's happening.
by narcogen
, Andover, Massachusetts, Wednesday, March 16, 2016, 00:46 (3269 days ago) @ red robber
Is it possible that some of the developers have pushed this? Perhaps as a way to keep their game's playerbase as large as possible? Imagine your game is slowly dying and your base is split between two consoles.
I am sure many, if not all third party developers who do multiplatform releases of multiplayer games would push for this. However, the early example being brought out is Rocket League, which is a runaway hit, not a game slowly dying.
That said, yes, increasing the potential pool of players always makes matchmaking work better.
However, I am sure devs were pushing for it last year and the year before, so this isn't MS caving to mounting pressure from devs, it's caving to mounting pressure from somewhere else.
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Yes, but not why it's happening.
by Cody Miller , Music of the Spheres - Never Forgot, Wednesday, March 16, 2016, 00:49 (3269 days ago) @ narcogen
I am sure many, if not all third party developers who do multiplatform releases of multiplayer games would push for this. However, the early example being brought out is Rocket League, which is a runaway hit, not a game slowly dying.
So Destiny is slowly dying you say?
Bet Bungie wished they didn't lock themselves in for another 8 and a half years.
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Yes, but not why it's happening.
by narcogen
, Andover, Massachusetts, Wednesday, March 16, 2016, 02:52 (3268 days ago) @ Cody Miller
I am sure many, if not all third party developers who do multiplatform releases of multiplayer games would push for this. However, the early example being brought out is Rocket League, which is a runaway hit, not a game slowly dying.
So Destiny is slowly dying you say?
Oh, of course. Because there are only two games in existence, as everyone knows. Rocket League and Destiny. I was absolutely insinuating that.
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ArsTechnica surmises as much
by kidtsunami , Atlanta, GA, Tuesday, March 15, 2016, 13:38 (3269 days ago) @ narcogen
Today, the console market looks quite different from Microsoft's point of view. Worldwide, the PS4 is now in close to twice as many homes as the Xbox One. Even in the usually Microsoft-friendly American market, Microsoft only rarely beats Sony in raw monthly console sales numbers these days.
That means, all things being equal, this console generation is much more likely to see a critical mass of your friends playing on Sony's PlayStation Network rather than on Microsoft's Xbox Live. If both online ecosystems are closed off from each other, more new console buyers are going to follow those friends to Sony's console if they want to play online. But in the world of cross-platform play Microsoft is proposing, the Xbox One might suddenly get a second look—especially since the system will give you access to a new Halo in addition to letting you play Call of Duty and Madden with all your PS4-owning friends.
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Saw that.
by narcogen
, Andover, Massachusetts, Wednesday, March 16, 2016, 00:47 (3269 days ago) @ kidtsunami
Yeah, saw that article later. I actually posted a Facebook comment on Polygon's story of the MS announcement and got called a fanboy, a shill and a troll (for Sony, apparently). Later I just posted the link to the Ars article into the thread.
What are the chances this is just Microsoft trying to build some goodwill with the public and be seen as the good guys for once?
As narcogen said, this seems to be a benefit for Microsoft more than anyone else. Especially where Rocket League is concerned. Despite selling nearly a million copies on Xbox One, if you try to find a match in the middle of a weekday it's like a ghost town. So MS gets the benefit of getting population for its players, but they also get to say they've done what they could to allow cross play if Sony doesn't play ball. I don't honestly think that matters much, but I feel like they're probably in s position to take whatever goodwill they can find.
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Public Opinion?
by Ragashingo , Official DBO Cryptarch, Tuesday, March 15, 2016, 04:03 (3269 days ago) @ cheapLEY
Are Xbox Live and the PSN just magically compatible? Surely more work has to be done than changing a 'no' to a 'yes' in a config file somewhere? What happens if I logon to Xbox Live and PSN as Ragashingo at the same time and start up Destiny? I'd guess it will be years before we see anything result from this even if Sony was all for it...
Likely this works via Bungie's matchmaking servers. As long as the consoles send their data to other consoles the same (regardless of platform) then it's a matter of a good communication layer -- which it's very likely bungie already has.
For example the stock twitter client or a 3rd party twitter client. They're both communicating in the same way to the twitter servers. A simplified example, but that's the gist of it.
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Public Opinion?
by MacAddictXIV , Seattle WA, Tuesday, March 15, 2016, 15:29 (3269 days ago) @ slycrel
Likely this works via Bungie's matchmaking servers. As long as the consoles send their data to other consoles the same (regardless of platform) then it's a matter of a good communication layer -- which it's very likely bungie already has.
For example the stock twitter client or a 3rd party twitter client. They're both communicating in the same way to the twitter servers. A simplified example, but that's the gist of it.
Yeah, this is literally what I do as a day job. I work with unifying data across multiple platforms (Databases) to one source. So as long as Bungie has set some sort of Unified Data Format, it shouldn't matter what the source is.
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Public Opinion?
by Ragashingo , Official DBO Cryptarch, Tuesday, March 15, 2016, 16:50 (3269 days ago) @ MacAddictXIV
I'm not so worried about Bungie's end. They're already handling logins from 4 consoles split across two networks + PC dev kits. It's Xbox Live talking to PSN that seems the bigger challenge. That's two big networks that were never designed to interact with each other...
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I don't think they ever would.
by slycrel , Tuesday, March 15, 2016, 20:25 (3269 days ago) @ Ragashingo
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Public Opinion?
by stabbim , Des Moines, IA, USA, Tuesday, March 15, 2016, 15:53 (3269 days ago) @ slycrel
That's all fine and dandy as far as getting automatically matched into a game together, and you could probably even invite them to your fireteam. Things outside the game like viewing their console-based profile, voice parties, messaging, etc., would probably dead-end.
Basically, I don't think anyone questions that cross-platform would be technically possible, there's just a lot of questions about how it would be implemented so that users can deal with it.
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Public Opinion?
by MacAddictXIV , Seattle WA, Tuesday, March 15, 2016, 16:03 (3269 days ago) @ stabbim
That's all fine and dandy as far as getting automatically matched into a game together, and you could probably even invite them to your fireteam. Things outside the game like viewing their console-based profile, voice parties, messaging, etc., would probably dead-end.
Basically, I don't think anyone questions that cross-platform would be technically possible, there's just a lot of questions about how it would be implemented so that users can deal with it.
My guess would that be that Microsoft would just be providing the hooks for developers and all the party/joining stuff would have to be done in game. There will probably be no input from the XBox console.
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So...It's Shadowrun 2??
by Morpheus , High Charity, Tuesday, March 15, 2016, 00:57 (3270 days ago) @ petetheduck
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Maybe Microsoft is doing it for their customers?
by MacAddictXIV , Seattle WA, Tuesday, March 15, 2016, 11:04 (3269 days ago) @ petetheduck
hahaha, I couldn't help myself. No there is money somewhere down the line. I mean that or they are saving face for the shit they pulled when they released the XBone.
Ultimately, I hate the fact that the things that would improve gamers experience, like cross-platform networking, is not good business for the companies. I'm also scared to see what will happen with exclusive content, because it will most likely be the next battlefield. And I hated exclusive content before this...
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Maybe Microsoft is doing it for their customers?
by Korny , Dalton, Ga. US. Earth, Sol System, Tuesday, March 15, 2016, 12:25 (3269 days ago) @ MacAddictXIV
hahaha, I couldn't help myself. No there is money somewhere down the line. I mean that or they are saving face for the shit they pulled when they released the XBone.
Wonder how the fanboys are going to react to the continued depreciation of the Xbone, considering how they reacted to news that the Xbox exclusives are headed to PC. This is not a move that adds value to the Xbone, but it does help save face. Makes one wonder how long of a lifespan Microsoft plans for the Xbone (assuming those "optional hardware upgrades" underwhelm).
Ultimately, I hate the fact that the things that would improve gamers experience, like cross-platform networking, is not good business for the companies. I'm also scared to see what will happen with exclusive content, because it will most likely be the next battlefield. And I hated exclusive content before this...
Yeah, those were my same thought's just one thread over.
Personally, I wouldn't care. I'd gladly pay a win-some-lose-some game of exclusives if it meant playing with friends across the board.
Heck, I'd love one of our PS4 Trials teams to go up against Xbox people. :P
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Perhaps both benefit in some ways?
by Durandal, Tuesday, March 15, 2016, 12:36 (3269 days ago) @ Korny
Combining playerbases has some non-obvious benefits to Sony and Microsoft. Niche games will last longer before dropping below the critical player threshold. You don't have to spend millions on risky platform exclusive games, instead you have a much lower cost for platform exclusive gear/maps/content. You also potentially increase the number of games available, and can tempt players who've stuck with other consoles because they won't lose their friends by switching.
It all depends on how much the extra support and validation costs versus the potential savings and cross platform conquest from the above. There should be a bunch of paper pushers somewhere in both companies trying to validate that case.
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Maybe Microsoft is doing it for their customers?
by Cody Miller , Music of the Spheres - Never Forgot, Tuesday, March 15, 2016, 14:50 (3269 days ago) @ Korny
Heck, I'd love one of our PS4 Trials teams to go up against Xbox people. :P
Something tells me we will get cross platform play before custom games.
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Maybe Microsoft is doing it for their customers?
by Korny , Dalton, Ga. US. Earth, Sol System, Tuesday, March 15, 2016, 14:58 (3269 days ago) @ Cody Miller
Heck, I'd love one of our PS4 Trials teams to go up against Xbox people. :P
Something tells me we will get cross platform play before custom games.
I'd gladly scoop up a couple of Xbox friends over Custom Games any day. It's a brave new world!
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Maybe Microsoft is doing it for their customers?
by Kuga, Tuesday, March 15, 2016, 17:54 (3269 days ago) @ Korny
I could admire your PS4 exclusive eq while it fails to shade my standard infinite line boots.
I'm more interested in rocket league on multi platforms but Destiny 2 would be a nice addition.
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Maybe Microsoft is doing it for their customers?
by Cody Miller , Music of the Spheres - Never Forgot, Tuesday, March 15, 2016, 18:14 (3269 days ago) @ Korny
Heck, I'd love one of our PS4 Trials teams to go up against Xbox people. :P
Something tells me we will get cross platform play before custom games.
I'd gladly scoop up a couple of Xbox friends over Custom Games any day. It's a brave new world!
If given the choice between one or the other, I'd actually agree with you there.
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Maybe Microsoft is doing it for their customers?
by narcogen
, Andover, Massachusetts, Wednesday, March 16, 2016, 00:49 (3269 days ago) @ Korny
hahaha, I couldn't help myself. No there is money somewhere down the line. I mean that or they are saving face for the shit they pulled when they released the XBone.
Wonder how the fanboys are going to react to the continued depreciation of the Xbone, considering how they reacted to news that the Xbox exclusives are headed to PC. This is not a move that adds value to the Xbone, but it does help save face. Makes one wonder how long of a lifespan Microsoft plans for the Xbone (assuming those "optional hardware upgrades" underwhelm).
Like this:
(Apologies for Facebook link)