I don't know what's going on w/ me, but I haven't even finished the latest expansion story missions yet, let alone the raid lair(s?) & strike(s?) & stuff.

Anyone else in this situation?

I don't know what's going on w/ me, but I haven't even finished the latest expansion story missions yet, let alone the raid lair(s?) & strike(s?) & stuff.

Anyone else in this situation?

Ummmm, I haven't finished it on my 2 alt characters. Does that count?

I don't know what's going on w/ me, but I haven't even finished the latest expansion story missions yet, let alone the raid lair(s?) & strike(s?) & stuff.

Anyone else in this situation?

Ummmm, I haven't finished it on my 2 alt characters. Does that count?

Mostly. ;)

I don't know what's going on w/ me, but I haven't even finished the latest expansion story missions yet, let alone the raid lair(s?) & strike(s?) & stuff.

Anyone else in this situation?

Ummmm, I haven't finished it on my 2 alt characters. Does that count?

Mostly. ;)

Which is kinda funny that one of those alts has been doing the raid lair for the last couple weeks.

I don't know what's going on w/ me, but I haven't even finished the latest expansion story missions yet, let alone the raid lair(s?) & strike(s?) & stuff.

Anyone else in this situation?

Neither I nor Sammy have finished the story missions, though I think we're on the last one. We marathoned it the day it came out, then never went back to it. Part of it is Holiday season stuff, part of it is that we just didn't feel like running it.

I have played the game quite a bit, but I don't really feel pressured to do stuff in CoO, nor am I in any hurry to try the Raid Lair. I mostly just do Mayhem if I play Destiny at all these days.

Still working on the Lost Prophecy weapon grind.

Still working on Masterworks upgrades/grind.

Our mostly over age 60 fire team are still busting our heads on the 1st boss stage of the raid lair. Bungie really doesn't seem to care if people have great difficulty completing some game activities. Maybe they will care when we move to other games.

We gave up on the full raid until a later date. Maybe we can successfully grind for superior weapons that could enable us to succeed.

i played through the story on one character. was not that all impressed, and haven't done any of the heroic adventures. I did some of the dawning stuff on the first day and put it down.

Bungie just wants to drive everything through eververse. until that changes, I probably won't be on much.

I'm in the exact same position. Finished the story on only one character, only did the first mission in the other 2. I've only ran the lair once. It was fun, but I'm not going to go out of my way to play like I have in the past. I just have too many other things going on.

until that changes

I am not confident that this new focus on Eververse ever will change.

I don't know what's going on w/ me, but I haven't even finished the latest expansion story missions yet, let alone the raid lair(s?) & strike(s?) & stuff.

Anyone else in this situation?

Still doing the raid lair.

I didn't even own it until Saturday. But I did basically nothing all weekend so I've now run through the story content on all 3 characters. :)

Still working on the Lost Prophecy weapon grind.

Still working on Masterworks upgrades/grind.

Our mostly over age 60 fire team are still busting our heads on the 1st boss stage of the raid lair.

Is it because you don't understand what the mechanics are? Once you get the mechanics down in the lair it mostly just takes very good team work. Miscommunication is the biggest cause of failure in this. Yes, there are some guns/abilities that help more than others, but it's by no means required.

Bungie really doesn't seem to care if people have great difficulty completing some game activities. Maybe they will care when we move to other games.

I believe that Bungie wants the raids to be difficult. For some it's easier, for others it's harder. That is a simple fact of experience and skill levels. I think it would be worse to have a really easy raid that the majority of players breeze through than to have a hard raid that requires multiple tries to eventually beat. I'm sure that Bungie set the difficulty of the raid to the point where a majority of the player base can beat it after several attempts. If your team is under that threshold, then I can understand how that is frustrating, but don't blame Bungie for it.

If you need tips or tricks that made the encounters easier, just ask. We are happy to help.

We gave up on the full raid until a later date. Maybe we can successfully grind for superior weapons that could enable us to succeed.

I guess it depends on how you define "superior" but in my mind there isn't really a set of weapons that are required.

Bungie really doesn't seem to care if people have great difficulty completing some game activities. Maybe they will care when we move to other games.

Maybe we can successfully grind for superior weapons that could enable us to succeed.

The Leviathan has been beaten by a deaf team, several teams that did not communicate in any way (even HUDless), the entire raid has been 4-manned, and the final boss has been 2-manned...

At some point you have to stop blaming Bungie or the weapons, and start looking in the mirror at what the real problem is, man...

We've had discussions about how pretty much any weapon is viable throughout the raid. We've raided with Blue weapons and armor. We've raided with mostly blind teams. You seem to be one of the only people constantly complaining about content being "made too hard", but honestly, the problem lies with you and your team. The content is fine. The level requirement is fine, and the mechanics are fine (there's several ways to beat the encounters, even!).

Bungie just wants to drive everything through eververse. until that changes, I probably won't be on much.

I know this is an exaggeration but what do you think actually goes through Eververse?

I personally can think of two things that do this:
1. The Dawning (which afaik has been the case since D1)
2. Experience engrams

I get this feeling that people think that Eververse is taking over D2 or something. I know it's because of Microtransactions and all that, so if anything goes through her then it feels like Bungie is stabbing you in the back. I can understand peoples feelings about MT, but to say that there is some slow creeping conspiracy by Bungie to make all pathways lead to Eververse is taking it a little far don't you think?

Again, correct me if I'm wrong on my facts because I'm basing this on memory and mine isn't the best.

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I held off finishing the new campaign so that any rewards would come in at a higher light level. Now that I'm 333, I should look to finish it to help bump me up to 335.

I held off finishing the new campaign so that any rewards would come in at a higher light level. Now that I'm 333, I should look to finish it to help bump me up to 335.

Doing the Powerful Engram milestones every week (Flashpoint, Call to Arms, Heroic Strikes, Clan XP) should bring you up to 335 from 333 in 1-2 weeks, maybe 3 if your RNG luck is bad. No need for extra content (though it's FUN to do extra content).

Bungie really doesn't seem to care if people have great difficulty completing some game activities. Maybe they will care when we move to other games.

Maybe we can successfully grind for superior weapons that could enable us to succeed.

The Leviathan has been beaten by a deaf team, several teams that did not communicate in any way (even HUDless), the entire raid has been 4-manned, and the final boss has been 2-manned...

At some point you have to stop blaming Bungie or the weapons, and start looking in the mirror at what the real problem is, man...

We've had discussions about how pretty much any weapon is viable throughout the raid. We've raided with Blue weapons and armor. We've raided with mostly blind teams. You seem to be one of the only people constantly complaining about content being "made too hard", but honestly, the problem lies with you and your team. The content is fine. The level requirement is fine, and the mechanics are fine (there's several ways to beat the encounters, even!).

You're a highly skilled player, Korny. It makes a difference. I will say most of the raid team I play with most often is ~50, and at times we've had some epic struggles completing certain challenges. I think we all believed we could do it eventually, though, and there's little or no complaining about the problem being Bungie. DEEP, if you and your group complain like you do here, then it doesn't surprise me you fail. It's a self-fulfilling prophecy. The mental game is always an element of performance. Believing that we could always improve is what gave us the motivation to continue to refine our strategy until we found roles each of us could perform consistently. I'm not saying it's not possible that the raid is too hard for your group, but to the extent that I've ever entertained the thought, I've been surprised at how easy they can be later when we each do the right things consistently because we've built up our skills and muscle memory.

Kerm

P.S. I love the raid lair.

Agreed.

The Raid Lair, more than any other Raid, requires an increased level of active participation and active, ongoing communication and reacting on the fly not just to what the game throws at you but also to what your teammates decide to do.

It ain't no original style Vault of Glass rules with stable, predefined roles, that's for sure!

In some ways, I think the 1st stage of the boss fight is even tougher than the 2nd, but even then I think the 2nd stage requires a lot of coordination and a whole lot of coordinate DPS.

It's not "Skolas with Burns" level hard, but I do think it is a good step more difficult than any thing else we've been asked to do in Destiny.

There's no shame in calling in some ringers now and then.

I’ve finished the story on all three characters. Working on the fourth Lost Prophecy weapon. I only have a single Masterwork Weapon, but it’s hard because I keep dismantling them to get the cores to upgrade the ones I want.

I’ve seen all of the Raid Lair but haven’t beat the final boss yet.

CoO revitalized my interest in Destiny in a big way for a bit there. I think I’m falling off again though. There are just way too many great games right now for me to continue to sink a whole lot of time into D2.

If this is the schedule they’re going to keep up, I’d be very happy. It’s perfect for me. Give me an excuse to come back to the game for a few weeks every few months.

until that changes

I am not confident that this new focus on Eververse ever will change.

Oh it will. That's why they had that job posting after all. But that change is just going to be finding the minimum level of bullshit to maximum money ratio. It's not going away sadly.

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Jackie and I finished the story,but have not unlocked the adventures yet.

Have not done raid or raid lair.

I'd like to do trials, but she's not interested.

We also have barely done strikes.

Need a third to run with us that doesn't insist on sprinting every encounter.

Maybe I'll post a FTB event soonish

Need a third to run with us that doesn't insist on sprinting every encounter.

Ooh... pick me!

Need a third to run with us that doesn't insist on sprinting every encounter.

If only we were on the same platform. :(

Bungie really doesn't seem to care if people have great difficulty completing some game activities. Maybe they will care when we move to other games.

Maybe we can successfully grind for superior weapons that could enable us to succeed.

The Leviathan has been beaten by a deaf team, several teams that did not communicate in any way (even HUDless), the entire raid has been 4-manned, and the final boss has been 2-manned...

At some point you have to stop blaming Bungie or the weapons, and start looking in the mirror at what the real problem is, man...

We've had discussions about how pretty much any weapon is viable throughout the raid. We've raided with Blue weapons and armor. We've raided with mostly blind teams. You seem to be one of the only people constantly complaining about content being "made too hard", but honestly, the problem lies with you and your team. The content is fine. The level requirement is fine, and the mechanics are fine (there's several ways to beat the encounters, even!).

You're a highly skilled player, Korny. It makes a difference.

I know that I'm probably a bit better at this game than some folks, which is why I'm not dismissing his complaints by saying "this stuff is easy". The problem is that he often claims that the content is tailored for the most elite players, and saying that Bungie should make the hardest content in the game easier, because it's completely unfair otherwise. This isn't the case, and I listed to a number of examples where people have deliberately made the game unfair, and were still able to beat it (sometimes going flawless, even). This is an example of casting blame on others for your own faults, while the game has enough real faults as it is.

I will say most of the raid team I play with most often is ~50, and at times we've had some epic struggles completing certain challenges. I think we all believed we could do it eventually, though, and there's little or no complaining about the problem being Bungie. DEEP, if you and your group complain like you do here, then it doesn't surprise me you fail. It's a self-fulfilling prophecy. The mental game is always an element of performance. Believing that we could always improve is what gave us the motivation to continue to refine our strategy until we found roles each of us could perform consistently.

+100

It's always been fun seeing your Xbox team posts whenever new content drops, hearing about the challenges that your group's faced, and what it took for you guys to inch towards victory, until we get the "We did it!" posts. You Deeply-Flawed Raider guys never give up, and it's great (it should be inspiring for Deep's group, even). You guys have tackled everything that the game's thrown at us, normal and Hard mode, and I can't recall any of y'all saying that the content was "unfair" or that you were "required to have this and that" to beat it.

I'm not saying it's not possible that the raid is too hard for your group, but to the extent that I've ever entertained the thought, I've been surprised at how easy they can be later when we each do the right things consistently because we've built up our skills and muscle memory.

I'd love to do the Prisms in the Pleasure Gardens some day, when are you hosting your raid practice events again? :)

P.S. I love the raid lair.

Still blind on that, looking forward to tackling it this year!

PS. Sorry that said Blindness has forced me to turn you guys down when you needed a Sixth.

PS. Sorry that said Blindness has forced me to turn you guys down when you needed a Sixth.

We’re just bummed because we could use a ringer. (:

No one begrudges you not jumping in. I’m actually excited that you are going to get to do it blind still. That’s not necessarily an easy commitment to wait so long.

PS. Sorry that said Blindness has forced me to turn you guys down when you needed a Sixth.

We’re just bummed because we could use a ringer. (:

No one begrudges you not jumping in. I’m actually excited that you are going to get to do it blind still. That’s not necessarily an easy commitment to wait so long.

I think we have the skill. We just need to figure out a way to coordinate the maximum number of craniums, and having bothe a rift and barrier. I have some ideas I’ll run by you guys.

PS. Sorry that said Blindness has forced me to turn you guys down when you needed a Sixth.

We’re just bummed because we could use a ringer. (:

No one begrudges you not jumping in. I’m actually excited that you are going to get to do it blind still. That’s not necessarily an easy commitment to wait so long.

I think we have the skill. We just need to figure out a way to coordinate the maximum number of craniums, and having bothe a rift and barrier. I have some ideas I’ll run by you guys.

It's amazing how much it helps to have a nightstalker + X number of celestrial nighthawks.

PS. Sorry that said Blindness has forced me to turn you guys down when you needed a Sixth.

We’re just bummed because we could use a ringer. (:

No one begrudges you not jumping in. I’m actually excited that you are going to get to do it blind still. That’s not necessarily an easy commitment to wait so long.

I think we have the skill. We just need to figure out a way to coordinate the maximum number of craniums, and having bothe a rift and barrier. I have some ideas I’ll run by you guys.

It's amazing how much it helps to have a nightstalker + X number of celestrial nighthawks.

This is one dilemma. We have two hunters. Do we 2x Nighthawk, or have one tether?

PS. Sorry that said Blindness has forced me to turn you guys down when you needed a Sixth.

We’re just bummed because we could use a ringer. (:

No one begrudges you not jumping in. I’m actually excited that you are going to get to do it blind still. That’s not necessarily an easy commitment to wait so long.

I think we have the skill. We just need to figure out a way to coordinate the maximum number of craniums, and having bothe a rift and barrier. I have some ideas I’ll run by you guys.

It's amazing how much it helps to have a nightstalker + X number of celestrial nighthawks.

This is one dilemma. We have two hunters. Do we 2x Nighthawk, or have one tether?

The orb generation is the most important thing. If your other 4 players can still create enough orbs to get a second golden gun out of your nighthawks then you don't need the tether.

I mean it ultimately comes down to how many golden gun shots can you get off. If a nighthawk and a tether is the same as 2 nighthawks then it doesn't really matter unless your other DPSers need the orbs too (I hear that hammer bros are good too although I haven't tried it)

PS. Sorry that said Blindness has forced me to turn you guys down when you needed a Sixth.

We’re just bummed because we could use a ringer. (:

No one begrudges you not jumping in. I’m actually excited that you are going to get to do it blind still. That’s not necessarily an easy commitment to wait so long.

I think we have the skill. We just need to figure out a way to coordinate the maximum number of craniums, and having bothe a rift and barrier. I have some ideas I’ll run by you guys.

We were pretty consistent about getting six craniums charged last night (essentially following Chappy's strategy [Chappy, could you please write that up?]). We weren't as consistent about using rifts or rallying barriers. The wipe mechanic is what got us most of the time. This is the usual progression of the learning curve as I've experienced it. We'll get there.

PS. Sorry that said Blindness has forced me to turn you guys down when you needed a Sixth.

We’re just bummed because we could use a ringer. (:

No one begrudges you not jumping in. I’m actually excited that you are going to get to do it blind still. That’s not necessarily an easy commitment to wait so long.

I think we have the skill. We just need to figure out a way to coordinate the maximum number of craniums, and having bothe a rift and barrier. I have some ideas I’ll run by you guys.

We were pretty consistent about getting six craniums charged last night (essentially following Chappy's strategy [Chappy, could you please write that up?]). We weren't as consistent about using rifts or rallying barriers. The wipe mechanic is what got us most of the time. This is the usual progression of the learning curve as I've experienced it. We'll get there.

Try to get his strategy down and then explain it to us :-p

PS. Sorry that said Blindness has forced me to turn you guys down when you needed a Sixth.

We’re just bummed because we could use a ringer. (:

No one begrudges you not jumping in. I’m actually excited that you are going to get to do it blind still. That’s not necessarily an easy commitment to wait so long.

I think we have the skill. We just need to figure out a way to coordinate the maximum number of craniums, and having bothe a rift and barrier. I have some ideas I’ll run by you guys.

We were pretty consistent about getting six craniums charged last night (essentially following Chappy's strategy [Chappy, could you please write that up?]). We weren't as consistent about using rifts or rallying barriers. The wipe mechanic is what got us most of the time. This is the usual progression of the learning curve as I've experienced it. We'll get there.

Try to get his strategy down and then explain it to us :-p

We do 6 craniums: 3 for the orbs and 3 for DPS (2 if we have a nightstalker who is on permanent orb duty) and do only 1 DPS phase per round.

I would explain it, but I suck at explaining things.

On the note of rifts/barriers, they are awesome with the exception that they are extremely deadly to use because of the nets that get you. When you are all clumped up like that it's easy to get caught. Being caught, especially if you are a golden gunner, can seriously cut down on DPS.

PS. Sorry that said Blindness has forced me to turn you guys down when you needed a Sixth.

We’re just bummed because we could use a ringer. (:

No one begrudges you not jumping in. I’m actually excited that you are going to get to do it blind still. That’s not necessarily an easy commitment to wait so long.

I think we have the skill. We just need to figure out a way to coordinate the maximum number of craniums, and having bothe a rift and barrier. I have some ideas I’ll run by you guys.

We were pretty consistent about getting six craniums charged last night (essentially following Chappy's strategy [Chappy, could you please write that up?]). We weren't as consistent about using rifts or rallying barriers. The wipe mechanic is what got us most of the time. This is the usual progression of the learning curve as I've experienced it. We'll get there.

The wipe mechanic is the easiest thing to mess up (and interestingly, it's one of the most forgiving pieces if you do it right; 2 people, doing it right, can easily clear both break points, while 6, shooting less well, can fail multiple times in a row).

The most important thing is keeping up constant crit dps. If you're not getting yellow damage numbers, you're not contributing to the weak spot turning red. It's really that simple. If you've got fewer people (dead folks, folks who missed the jump, folks who are not in position to hit the spot you're focused on at the moment), make sure that the people who ARE there are staggered; a nearly-killed weak spot can revert back to white, making you start over (and probably fail) just because everyone was reloading at the same time. Longer-firing guns (slow-shooting ARs, larger-mag'd ARs, etc) are better, because there's less downtime. I'll put in another vote for Sweet Business; I was once successful at killing both crit spots by myself, using Sweet Business and Actium War Rig. But any good AR will do, if you're getting crit hits. Stand on the lower platforms for the rear spots, higher ones for the top and sides. Make sure everyone is shooting at the same one at any given time (I've played with teams that always shoot right first, and teams that always shoot left first - it doesn't matter, as long as everyone knows where they're going and what they're shooting).

And if you're seeing white damage numbers, MOVE YOUR RETICLE. ;)

That's true. I suppose I meant that I'm not convinced the core of Destiny 2's design will (or can) be untethered from Eververse. It seems that the MTX system will continue to drive decision-making where design changes are concerned.

I have never minded MTX in theory, and I do not oppose their inclusion as long as they remain purely cosmetic, but Bungie could rein in the obvious MTX-driven events like The Dawning. Eververse should be icing on the cake for the die-hards (and, frankly, for the whales that make this system viable in the first place), but not the entire cake.

I don't know what's going on w/ me, but I haven't even finished the latest expansion story missions yet, let alone the raid lair(s?) & strike(s?) & stuff.

Anyone else in this situation?

I finished it on Xbox... mostly. I haven’t beaten the final raid lair boss, but I’m not really burning to get it done either. I slowly started making my way through the expansion over on PS4, but it’s a real chore. Sorry to say it, but this is by far the toughest Destiny content to replay, because the expansion itself is already so repetitive. I finished the main story on PS4 with 1 character, but I have no interest in doing the adventures or Patrol stuff. Don’t think I’m going to touch my other characters either. I doubt I’ll go back to them until some future expansion let’s me bypass the CoO content and reach max level some other way.

I only just got it. Haven't gotten very far at all yet, but I've enjoyed what I've played so far.

Try to get his strategy down and then explain it to us :-p

3 DPS – Start on plates
3 Pushers – Start on skulls, assigned L-C-R for sparks.
1 DPS calls out plate and elements of sparks in L-C-R order.
Pushers cook skulls in appropriate locations. DPS “quarterback” calls out remaining cook locations, prioritizing plate location if possible, and one other already cooking location if necessary (to help with ad control).

Everyone brings skulls to plate, and pushers do a 3-2-1 countdown. DPS and pushers hit with their skulls (pushers with what they have left). Rift and rally barrier should be down. Try not to die from all the crazy stuff happening. When DPS is over, kill ads, and have someone call out wipe mechanic side (left, right or back). Don’t screw up the wipe mechanic. Rinse/repeat.

There is a significant element of luck, in that certain combinations of plates and skulls are much more difficult to deal with. The worst case scenario is that all the pusher skulls are at the plate location, because there will be a few moments when everyone at the plate is holding a skull, leaving no ad control. Best case scenario is all the pusher skulls are at the same non-plate location, so they can all head over together and push while the DPS team controls ads. The sequence of plates overall is also important, as the boss very occasionally changes the direction he is facing during the wipe mechanic (he usually faces arc), so you want to avoid (or quickly recognize) having to jump over to his far side during that phase.

I’m sure Chappy will eventually post a more detailed version.

Try to get his strategy down and then explain it to us :-p

3 DPS – Start on plates
3 Pushers – Start on skulls, assigned L-C-R for sparks.
1 DPS calls out plate and elements of sparks in L-C-R order.
Pushers cook skulls in appropriate locations. DPS “quarterback” calls out remaining cook locations, prioritizing plate location if possible, and one other already cooking location if necessary (to help with ad control).

Everyone brings skulls to plate, and pushers do a 3-2-1 countdown. DPS and pushers hit with their skulls (pushers with what they have left). Rift and rally barrier should be down. Try not to die from all the crazy stuff happening. When DPS is over, kill ads, and have someone call out wipe mechanic side (left, right or back). Don’t screw up the wipe mechanic. Rinse/repeat.

There is a significant element of luck, in that certain combinations of plates and skulls are much more difficult to deal with. The worst case scenario is that all the pusher skulls are at the plate location, because there will be a few moments when everyone at the plate is holding a skull, leaving no ad control. Best case scenario is all the pusher skulls are at the same non-plate location, so they can all head over together and push while the DPS team controls ads. The sequence of plates overall is also important, as the boss very occasionally changes the direction he is facing during the wipe mechanic (he usually faces arc), so you want to avoid (or quickly recognize) having to jump over to his far side during that phase.

I’m sure Chappy will eventually post a more detailed version.

We do this as well. I will add in some other stuff that helps if you are running a Nightstalker and Golden Gunners. I would say if you have 2 hunters, just make them be GGers, if you have more than that, 1 NS and the rest GGers. We had a dedicated NS that always went right to the DPS platform and started creating orbs which means we only had 2 DPS skulls. With 2+ GGers the lack of 1 DPS was fine. We also made sure the GGers were "pushers" because when they were done pushing they didn't need to pick up a DPS skull and thus waste time they could be using to fire off GGs and collecting orbs for more GGs.

I completely forgot about the L-C-R assignments. That makes sense.

Heh - I wrote this up when Mac said he was bad at explaining things. I'm not sure this is better than Squid's, but it's certainly more detail. Much of this info came from Chappy, with some additions from the Mac and Friends group.

Two teams: DPS team, and Orb team. (Orb team is pushing orbs into the center, DPS team is keeping platforms clear.) Orb team members pick their orb (by position) before you even start. (That is: someone picks left orb - and is responsible for that orb, on every damage phase, regardless of the element. Someone else is on Center/Top orb, and is responsible for that orb, every time, regardless of element type. Etc.)

These are separate from starting positions; you'll have two players on each cranium pickup area (these were used in Phase 1, and are usually clockwise from their elemental base - so the Arc craniums are considered those that spawn between Arc and Void, etc.)

When cycle starts, one person in each position (usually from the Orb team) picks up a cranium, the other (DPS team) waits on the platform to call out orb positions. These are read out in a consistent order - Left, Center, Right. The advantage to picking orb positions at the start is that you really only have to listen for your position - if someone says "Arc platform, Arc Arc Void" and you're center orb, you know you have to go to Arc platform to charge your cranium. There's no cross chatter, no confusion. It means that sometimes you have a lot of running to do - up to halfway around the play area to charge, then up to halfway around again to use - but there's plenty of time for this.

It's helpful if one person who can do the math quickly can help the DPS team charge properly. You want as many DPS craniums as possible on the fighting platform - but of course orb craniums take priority. So: in the above example (Arc platform, arc arc void), two of the orb team would go to Arc, one to Void - that leaves room for one DPS member to go to Arc, and the other two (for teamwork's sake) should charge at Void. (That gives more players in one place to help with add control.) If all three orb choices are at platforms that are NOT the final fighting platform (eg "Void platform, Solar Arc Solar"), all DPS should go to the final fighting platform (void, in this case). Having someone who can quickly do these calculations calling them out can be helpful for folks who get confused, or who weren't listening closely.

Side note: we found that having one Nightstalker with Orpheus Rig boots can generate enough orbs to help GG Hunters get a second shot off during each damage phase - this was so helpful (the team was 1 Titan, 4 GG Hunters, and one Nightstalker Hunter) that we changed things up where the Nightstalker didn't even wait to pick up a cranium, he just went straight to the final platform and started tethering stuff. (Other DPS folks in the area - LET THE TETHER WORK BEFORE YOU KILL STUFF.) The other advantage to this particular kind of orb generation is that all the orbs are in one place - generally near where you're going to be standing for the damage phase. Masterworks Orbs, and many roaming super orbs, are created where the baddies die - which is NOT where you're going to be standing during the damage phase.

Once craniums are charged, bring them to the fighting platform. (There's no real advantage to hanging out where you charged them for longer than you need to.) You obviously need all three orb craniums in place before you can start the next phase, but it's more important that EVERYONE's ready than that you go as quickly as possible - the time pressure here isn't huge, and it's pretty critical that all DPS folks are in position before you break the barrier. They'll usually take a few extra seconds (because they picked up their orbs later), so don't rush the orb pushing.

Once everyone's in position, drop a rally barrier and/or an empowering rift in a place near the back where you have a clear shot at Argos' face (Solar side has a big block right in the middle of the back, so dead center is a bad idea on that side), and push the three orbs into the center. Keep a sharp eye out for the net, which will come out right after the shield goes down (and often a second time, farther along during the damage phase). As Mac pointed out, it's quite easy to get multiple people caught if you're all bunched up behind the rally barricade. Argos will look towards where he throws the net, so watch his face. (Added fun: the net is not really stopped by rocks, so crouching down behind a rock does NOT make you safe.) The net can eat rockets and golden gun shots, too, so it's not just about being caught.

Any harpies you didn't kill during the lead-up to the damage phase will turn into guided rockets... these will target a specific (random) player and head in a group towards them. Be aware of these, and remain near cover if possible when they launch. (There are two launches; one partway through the damage phase, once at the end of the damage phase. The rockets move slowly enough to shoot, if you're paying attention, and are dodgeable... but can still kill you pretty dead if you're not staying alert.)

If you can do 1/3 damage during each damage phase, you're good - you get a max of 4 damage phases (and 3 wipe mechanic phases), so this gives you a little leeway if something goes wrong later on.

The vast majority of the time, Argos will turn after the damage phase to face the Arc platform, so you should prepare to position yourself for the wipe mechanic phase based on this. (It's not a guarantee - every once in a while, he'll face a different way, so if he spins to somewhere else, make sure that is called out, clearly.) There are three sets of weak spots - two on his head, two on his back, two on his arms - but it turns out that doing one head and one arm is more efficient (in terms of player movement) than both arms at once. The order is somewhat unimportant, as long as everyone knows where they're supposed to go. Don't say "Left" - say "Argos' left, our right" or "void side top and arm" or whatever you decide is clearest to your team. (I've experienced a number of wipes, with a variety of teams, that happened simply because not everyone understood where they were supposed to go.)

If you are successful, and there's still time before the platforms disappear, you should try to kill one or both of his upper arms - the cannons at the end can be pretty unpleasant, and taking them out of the equation in later rounds can be really helpful. You don't want to shoot the cannons, you want to shoot the horizontal pieces that hold them to his body. It can be hard to tell when you've successfully broken one. And make sure you get off the platforms, and onto solid ground, before you fall to your death when they disappear; staying safe is far more important than ensuring those cannons are offline.

Assuming all goes well, rinse and repeat!

I completely forgot about the L-C-R assignments. That makes sense.

We started using this in the last raid and it really cuts down on the chat from the "pushers" when they are going to their locations. It means that there is only 1 person talking instead of 3. It takes a little more time for rotations, but there is plenty of time (one more reason I like this raid)

Here is where I am confused.

Let's say the DPS side is solar. If there are no solar craniums that need charging, then it makes sense. Just put 3 on solar, then the 'dps' team has their craniums. But what if not?

Let's say there is one solar that needs charging. How do you get 6x craniums? One would need to be charged elsewhere… the craniums vanish when dropped do they not? So how do you get all the DPS craniums to the point while still killing ads?

Worst case is solar side, and 3 solars need charging. Explain how to get the other 3 craniums over using your strat. While carrying a cranium, you kind of can't kill anything.

Also is level an issue in terms of dmg? Most of us are in the 31x range. Is this why we can't DPS the boss? If I get off a golden gun + 6 rockets + residual cranium + primary I do ~800K dmg.

- No text -

I don't know what's going on w/ me, but I haven't even finished the latest expansion story missions yet, let alone the raid lair(s?) & strike(s?) & stuff.

Anyone else in this situation?

I finished it on Xbox... mostly. I haven’t beaten the final raid lair boss, but I’m not really burning to get it done either. I slowly started making my way through the expansion over on PS4, but it’s a real chore. Sorry to say it, but this is by far the toughest Destiny content to replay, because the expansion itself is already so repetitive. I finished the main story on PS4 with 1 character, but I have no interest in doing the adventures or Patrol stuff. Don’t think I’m going to touch my other characters either. I doubt I’ll go back to them until some future expansion let’s me bypass the CoO content and reach max level some other way.

Here's a tip:

1. Get raid ready on PS4.
2. Do the raid with all the cool people (like me).
3. Profit

Here is where I am confused.

Let's say the DPS side is solar. If there are no solar craniums that need charging, then it makes sense. Just put 3 on solar, then the 'dps' team has their craniums. But what if not?

Let's say there is one solar that needs charging. How do you get 6x craniums? One would need to be charged elsewhere… the craniums vanish when dropped do they not? So how do you get all the DPS craniums to the point while still killing ads?

Worst case is solar side, and 3 solars need charging. Explain how to get the other 3 craniums over using your strat. While carrying a cranium, you kind of can't kill anything.

Also is level an issue in terms of dmg? Most of us are in the 31x range. Is this why we can't DPS the boss?

First off, charged craniums disappear faster than regular, but you can still drop it for roughly 10 seconds (I think Beorn counted once). Which is plenty of time to get off a clip.

So in the case where DPS is on solar side and you only need 1 skull charged at solar for the orb, then the 3 DPS skull players will have to call out which 2 are going to solar and which 1 person is cooking their skull on another platform.

Which should be fine, because the pushers will be on other platforms anyway, which means you only have to wait tops 30 seconds for the DPS skull to catch up before the pushers start the DPS phase.

Do you mean Rampage? Origin Story stacks x3.

If you can do 1/3 damage during each damage phase, you're good - you get a max of 4 damage phases (and 3 wipe mechanic phases), so this gives you a little leeway if something goes wrong later on.

Even when we get 6 craniums, and everything goes perfectly, we barely do 1/4 damage. That's the BEST we've managed.

Here is where I am confused.

Let's say the DPS side is solar. If there are no solar craniums that need charging, then it makes sense. Just put 3 on solar, then the 'dps' team has their craniums. But what if not?

Let's say there is one solar that needs charging. How do you get 6x craniums? One would need to be charged elsewhere… the craniums vanish when dropped do they not? So how do you get all the DPS craniums to the point while still killing ads?

Worst case is solar side, and 3 solars need charging. Explain how to get the other 3 craniums over using your strat. While carrying a cranium, you kind of can't kill anything.

Orb team would do DPS on DPS side during charging, while DPS team would go to either of the other two sides and charge (and do DPS locally while they wait). When DPS team is ready, they come back to DPS side. Safest thing is for Orb team to clear large adds (Minotaurs, mostly) before picking up craniums and pushing... but in a pinch, DPS team can drop cranium, fire for a couple of seconds, pick up cranium. (This is dangerous, because you're right, it disappears after a few seconds. Someone said 10 seconds, but I think it's less than that. It's more than 5, though. If you screw up, you've hosed the group, so play it safe.)

Also is level an issue in terms of dmg? Most of us are in the 31x range. Is this why we can't DPS the boss? If I get off a golden gun + 6 rockets + residual cranium + primary I do ~800K dmg.

I haven't looked at full damage numbers for a cycle, but as a 33x Hunter, my golden gun was doing a bit under 300k.

Do you mean Rampage? Origin Story stacks x3.

Triple Tap is the perk where 3 crit hits put a bullet back in the mag.

I haven't looked at full damage numbers for a cycle, but as a 33x Hunter, my golden gun was doing a bit under 300k.

Okay Weird. I'm 312, and mine does 360k.

I haven't looked at full damage numbers for a cycle, but as a 33x Hunter, my golden gun was doing a bit under 300k.

Okay Weird. I'm 312, and mine does 360k.

Were you standing in an empowering rift? (Or was he tethered?) The 290k number is without any bonuses at all.

Here is where I am confused.

Let's say the DPS side is solar. If there are no solar craniums that need charging, then it makes sense. Just put 3 on solar, then the 'dps' team has their craniums. But what if not?

Let's say there is one solar that needs charging. How do you get 6x craniums? One would need to be charged elsewhere… the craniums vanish when dropped do they not? So how do you get all the DPS craniums to the point while still killing ads?

Worst case is solar side, and 3 solars need charging. Explain how to get the other 3 craniums over using your strat. While carrying a cranium, you kind of can't kill anything.

Also is level an issue in terms of dmg? Most of us are in the 31x range. Is this why we can't DPS the boss?

First off, charged craniums disappear faster than regular, but you can still drop it for roughly 10 seconds (I think Beorn counted once). Which is plenty of time to get off a clip.

So in the case where DPS is on solar side and you only need 1 skull charged at solar for the orb, then the 3 DPS skull players will have to call out which 2 are going to solar and which 1 person is cooking their skull on another platform.

Which should be fine, because the pushers will be on other platforms anyway, which means you only have to wait tops 30 seconds for the DPS skull to catch up before the pushers start the DPS phase.

Okay this is super helpful, thanks.

So the Orb team continually drops their craniums to shoot ads while the DPS team retrieves their craniums?

I haven't looked at full damage numbers for a cycle, but as a 33x Hunter, my golden gun was doing a bit under 300k.

Okay Weird. I'm 312, and mine does 360k.

Were you standing in an empowering rift? (Or was he tethered?) The 290k number is without any bonuses at all.

No tether, no bonus. Celestial Nighthawk.

I haven't looked at full damage numbers for a cycle, but as a 33x Hunter, my golden gun was doing a bit under 300k.

Okay Weird. I'm 312, and mine does 360k.

Were you standing in an empowering rift? (Or was he tethered?) The 290k number is without any bonuses at all.

No tether, no bonus. Celestial Nighthawk.

Well, yeah, CN - you're not getting those numbers without it. ;)

Weird. I dunno. I was getting those numbers consistently, and they were yellow (so it wasn't like I was missing the crit shot). Can't explain.

Here is where I am confused.

Let's say the DPS side is solar. If there are no solar craniums that need charging, then it makes sense. Just put 3 on solar, then the 'dps' team has their craniums. But what if not?

Let's say there is one solar that needs charging. How do you get 6x craniums? One would need to be charged elsewhere… the craniums vanish when dropped do they not? So how do you get all the DPS craniums to the point while still killing ads?

If it's one solar, two void, the orb team worries about those, and dps team uses the the two spare spots at solar and the one spot at void. You always fill all slots on the DPS side, which means there are always three players waiting for those who can kills adds.

Worst case is solar side, and 3 solars need charging. Explain how to get the other 3 craniums over using your strat. While carrying a cranium, you kind of can't kill anything.

Again, the guns are picked up until adds are relatively clear, so you've got at least three players without guns in their hands killing adds.

Maybe I'm misremembering. (I can see the damn number in my head, when I close my eyes... but whatever.)

The guys who killed him on one shield break were presumably max light - that guy was getting 378k/shot. So your 360k is close enough that I wouldn't worry about light level.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g4S7YW89b4k

PS. Sorry that said Blindness has forced me to turn you guys down when you needed a Sixth.

We’re just bummed because we could use a ringer. (:

No one begrudges you not jumping in. I’m actually excited that you are going to get to do it blind still. That’s not necessarily an easy commitment to wait so long.

I think we have the skill. We just need to figure out a way to coordinate the maximum number of craniums, and having bothe a rift and barrier. I have some ideas I’ll run by you guys.

It's amazing how much it helps to have a nightstalker + X number of celestrial nighthawks.

This is one dilemma. We have two hunters. Do we 2x Nighthawk, or have one tether?

I can be a Hunter too, if we need it.

Here is where I am confused.

Let's say the DPS side is solar. If there are no solar craniums that need charging, then it makes sense. Just put 3 on solar, then the 'dps' team has their craniums. But what if not?

Let's say there is one solar that needs charging. How do you get 6x craniums? One would need to be charged elsewhere… the craniums vanish when dropped do they not? So how do you get all the DPS craniums to the point while still killing ads?

Worst case is solar side, and 3 solars need charging. Explain how to get the other 3 craniums over using your strat. While carrying a cranium, you kind of can't kill anything.

Also is level an issue in terms of dmg? Most of us are in the 31x range. Is this why we can't DPS the boss?

First off, charged craniums disappear faster than regular, but you can still drop it for roughly 10 seconds (I think Beorn counted once). Which is plenty of time to get off a clip.

So in the case where DPS is on solar side and you only need 1 skull charged at solar for the orb, then the 3 DPS skull players will have to call out which 2 are going to solar and which 1 person is cooking their skull on another platform.

Which should be fine, because the pushers will be on other platforms anyway, which means you only have to wait tops 30 seconds for the DPS skull to catch up before the pushers start the DPS phase.

Okay this is super helpful, thanks.

So the Orb team continually drops their craniums to shoot ads while the DPS team retrieves their craniums?

Generally, whoever is on the DPS platform kills adds (if there is a Nightstalker, only after he tethers, who should always be at the platform) while their skull is cooking. So you should always have 3 people clearing adds while waiting for the other three skulls to get there.

basically, no matter what the order for DPS and pushers, there should always be three skulls cooking at DPS platform and thus 3 people killing adds there.

If you do it well, then you should never have to drop a skull to kill adds :D

Adds were my biggest problem last night. I was really missing Cody’s tether. Every time I popped a rally barricade, at least one Minotaur jumped in the way so I couldn’t use it.

Adds were my biggest problem last night. I was really missing Cody’s tether. Every time I popped a rally barricade, at least one Minotaur jumped in the way so I couldn’t use it.

So I switch back, and use Orpheus Rigs to make a shit tons of orbs for Destroyo to golden gun the shit out of Argus.

No prob! :)

Not Triple Tap, but Valakadyn is a pretty great go-to rifle thanks to the Rapid-Fire-Frame perk, which gives it a 53-round mag. Pulse your shots, and you don't have to reload too often (Plus, thanks to the Under Pressure perk, the gun becomes more stable as the mag gets smaller), especially with the War Rig.

Yeah, I'm down to just running my main now... I've hardly touched my alts in D2. :-(

Generally, whoever is on the DPS platform kills adds (if there is a Nightstalker, only after he tethers, who should always be at the platform) while their skull is cooking. So you should always have 3 people clearing adds while waiting for the other three skulls to get there.

basically, no matter what the order for DPS and pushers, there should always be three skulls cooking at DPS platform and thus 3 people killing adds there.

If you do it well, then you should never have to drop a skull to kill adds :D

Now I am confused again.

All craniums are done charging. Let's say it's solar side, and there was one ball of each color. So we now have three solar charged, one void, and two arc. A,B,C are pushers, D,E,F are DPS. Who goes where to pick up the craniums, and in what order? Maybe walk me through it from the start of the round.

I still don't get the strat. It seems like to always have three people on solar killing ads, DPS and pushers have to switch roles constantly.

Here is where I am confused.

Let's say the DPS side is solar. If there are no solar craniums that need charging, then it makes sense. Just put 3 on solar, then the 'dps' team has their craniums. But what if not?

Let's say there is one solar that needs charging. How do you get 6x craniums? One would need to be charged elsewhere… the craniums vanish when dropped do they not? So how do you get all the DPS craniums to the point while still killing ads?

If it's one solar, two void, the orb team worries about those, and dps team uses the the two spare spots at solar and the one spot at void. You always fill all slots on the DPS side, which means there are always three players waiting for those who can kills adds.

Worst case is solar side, and 3 solars need charging. Explain how to get the other 3 craniums over using your strat. While carrying a cranium, you kind of can't kill anything.

Again, the guns are picked up until adds are relatively clear, so you've got at least three players without guns in their hands killing adds.

Okay. So 3 always charging on the damage platform. So when the last 3 are done, the 'pushers' collect those, and if necessary drop it on the platform for the DPS people? This makes sense now. It clicked. We're gonna get it dude.

Generally, whoever is on the DPS platform kills adds (if there is a Nightstalker, only after he tethers, who should always be at the platform) while their skull is cooking. So you should always have 3 people clearing adds while waiting for the other three skulls to get there.

basically, no matter what the order for DPS and pushers, there should always be three skulls cooking at DPS platform and thus 3 people killing adds there.

If you do it well, then you should never have to drop a skull to kill adds :D

Now I am confused again.

All craniums are done charging. Let's say it's solar side, and there was one ball of each color. So we now have three solar charged, one void, and two arc. A,B,C are pushers, D,E,F are DPS. Who goes where to pick up the craniums, and in what order? Maybe walk me through it from the start of the round.

I still don't get the strat.

In your example, pusher A goes to Solar, pusher B to Void, pusher C to Arc. DPS D and E go to Solar, DPS F goes wherever he wants (as long as he wants Void or Arc).

When B, C, and F are done charging, they come back to solar. None of them shoot. When everyone's back, and in position, A picks up his cranium, while D and E keep killing adds.

A, B, C push, D, E kill adds, F drops barrier/rift if they can, stay out of the way if they can. Pushing takes 5 seconds or so, right? As soon as the barrier's down, D, E pick up their solar craniums, and D, E, F empty craniums in boss. A, B, C fire GGs if they have 'em (or hammers if they don't). Everyone downgrades to Heavy/Energy/Kinetic ammo as they run out of the more powerful stuff.

Here is where I am confused.

Let's say the DPS side is solar. If there are no solar craniums that need charging, then it makes sense. Just put 3 on solar, then the 'dps' team has their craniums. But what if not?

Let's say there is one solar that needs charging. How do you get 6x craniums? One would need to be charged elsewhere… the craniums vanish when dropped do they not? So how do you get all the DPS craniums to the point while still killing ads?

If it's one solar, two void, the orb team worries about those, and dps team uses the the two spare spots at solar and the one spot at void. You always fill all slots on the DPS side, which means there are always three players waiting for those who can kills adds.

Worst case is solar side, and 3 solars need charging. Explain how to get the other 3 craniums over using your strat. While carrying a cranium, you kind of can't kill anything.

Again, the guns are picked up until adds are relatively clear, so you've got at least three players without guns in their hands killing adds.

Okay. So 3 always charging on the damage platform. So when the last 3 are done, the 'pushers' collect those, and if necessary drop it on the platform for the DPS people? This makes sense now. It clicked. We're gonna get it dude.

Pushers never need to drop anything for DPS people - they're either bringing over their pushing craniums from other platforms, or they're waiting at the DPS platform to pick their cranium up out of the fire when everyone's in position. Unless you've screwed up (maybe someone died while carrying over a cranium, or something), there should NEVER be a need for one team to pass craniums to the other team.

Generally, whoever is on the DPS platform kills adds (if there is a Nightstalker, only after he tethers, who should always be at the platform) while their skull is cooking. So you should always have 3 people clearing adds while waiting for the other three skulls to get there.

basically, no matter what the order for DPS and pushers, there should always be three skulls cooking at DPS platform and thus 3 people killing adds there.

If you do it well, then you should never have to drop a skull to kill adds :D

Now I am confused again.

All craniums are done charging. Let's say it's solar side, and there was one ball of each color. So we now have three solar charged, one void, and two arc. A,B,C are pushers, D,E,F are DPS. Who goes where to pick up the craniums, and in what order? Maybe walk me through it from the start of the round.

I still don't get the strat. It seems like to always have three people on solar killing ads, DPS and pushers have to switch roles constantly.

Okay, so for the example you just gave:

So ABC will pick up the first round of skulls, and go to their respective spots
Solar: A
Arc: B
Void: C

Then, as soon as they start cooking, the second round of skulls will come out and the DPS people will pick up their skulls. 2 will go to solar and the other will call out that he is going to Arc

Solar: A, D, E
Arc: B, F
Void: C

Now, as soon as A, D and E have started cooking their skulls, they add clear until B, F and C get to the DPS platform. There should be plenty of time. B and C should get to the platform first because they started cooking first and they will either have to do the drop/pickup the skulls to help A,D and E add clear or they will just hide somewhere until F catches up. Once F gets there A will pick up his skull so that A, B and C can start the DPS phase. Then D and E will pick up their skull to DPS (so will F) as soon as the shield is down.

Hopefully that makes more sense :D

Here is where I am confused.

Let's say the DPS side is solar. If there are no solar craniums that need charging, then it makes sense. Just put 3 on solar, then the 'dps' team has their craniums. But what if not?

Let's say there is one solar that needs charging. How do you get 6x craniums? One would need to be charged elsewhere… the craniums vanish when dropped do they not? So how do you get all the DPS craniums to the point while still killing ads?

If it's one solar, two void, the orb team worries about those, and dps team uses the the two spare spots at solar and the one spot at void. You always fill all slots on the DPS side, which means there are always three players waiting for those who can kills adds.

Worst case is solar side, and 3 solars need charging. Explain how to get the other 3 craniums over using your strat. While carrying a cranium, you kind of can't kill anything.

Again, the guns are picked up until adds are relatively clear, so you've got at least three players without guns in their hands killing adds.

Okay. So 3 always charging on the damage platform. So when the last 3 are done, the 'pushers' collect those, and if necessary drop it on the platform for the DPS people? This makes sense now. It clicked. We're gonna get it dude.

Pushers never need to drop anything for DPS people - they're either bringing over their pushing craniums from other platforms, or they're waiting at the DPS platform to pick their cranium up out of the fire when everyone's in position. Unless you've screwed up (maybe someone died while carrying over a cranium, or something), there should NEVER be a need for one team to pass craniums to the other team.

This^. And I meant to say the charged guns ARE NOT picked up until the adds are cleared. Worst case is orb team needs to use all three guns cooking at the DPS side, in which case during the four seconds when the orb team is shooting their orbs, everyone has a gun in their hand can can't kill adds. That would be bad luck.

A big problem of the fight is it seems like there needs to be a lot of communication, and with so much communication comes miscommunication. The beauty of this strategy it requires less communication. The key is the "quarterback," as it's been called here, who can quickly tell the DPS team members what to do.

Key points to help eliminate confusion:

• Everyone is responsible for their own gun.
  
• DPS members cook on their home plate unless there's room on the DPS plate.
  
• If there's one slot for DPS on the DPS plate, the DPS person positioned there charges there. If three's two slots free the DPS member to the right moves clockwise to take the second slot. If there's three free all DPS members charge their guns on the DPS side.

Need a third to run with us that doesn't insist on sprinting every encounter.

Ooh... pick me!

Did you get on PS4 and we not know??

Need a third to run with us that doesn't insist on sprinting every encounter.

Ooh... pick me!

Did you get on PS4 and we not know??

Claude does indeed have a character leveled on PS4, and I'm willing to bet it's at a higher power level than yours!

It does take a certain amount of guilting him into firing up the PS4 though...

Need a third to run with us that doesn't insist on sprinting every encounter.

Ooh... pick me!

Did you get on PS4 and we not know??

Claude does indeed have a character leveled on PS4, and I'm willing to bet it's at a higher power level than yours!

Most likely, I'm like....312....311.

It does take a certain amount of guilting him into firing up the PS4 though...

Psh, there's no guilt if he wants to play with you

:P

Psh, there's no guilt if he wants to play with you

:P

Heh. Touché!

Need a third to run with us that doesn't insist on sprinting every encounter.

Ooh... pick me!

Did you get on PS4 and we not know??

Claude does indeed have a character leveled on PS4, and I'm willing to bet it's at a higher power level than yours!

It does take a certain amount of guilting him into firing up the PS4 though...

I was on twice last week. Played alone, because I didn't see anyone on when I started.

(And yeah, my Titan's about 10 levels above Rev's. :) )

Need a third to run with us that doesn't insist on sprinting every encounter.

Ooh... pick me!

Did you get on PS4 and we not know??

Claude does indeed have a character leveled on PS4, and I'm willing to bet it's at a higher power level than yours!

It does take a certain amount of guilting him into firing up the PS4 though...

I was on twice last week. Played alone, because I didn't see anyone on when I started.

(And yeah, my Titan's about 10 levels above Rev's. :) )

Well dang son. I'll check the clan list and add you. Assuming it's your regular name, right?

- No text -

Need a third to run with us that doesn't insist on sprinting every encounter.

Ooh... pick me!

Did you get on PS4 and we not know??

Claude does indeed have a character leveled on PS4, and I'm willing to bet it's at a higher power level than yours!

It does take a certain amount of guilting him into firing up the PS4 though...

I was on twice last week. Played alone, because I didn't see anyone on when I started.

(And yeah, my Titan's about 10 levels above Rev's. :) )

Well dang son. I'll check the clan list and add you. Assuming it's your regular name, right?

Yeah... no.

Try PfhorPlay. :)

I made a few exceptions to make more dawning gifts last week, but for the most part I'm playing one character per season per console this time around.

There were some weeks in year one Destiny where I touched six characters. Never again!

Need a third to run with us that doesn't insist on sprinting every encounter.

Ooh... pick me!

Did you get on PS4 and we not know??

Claude does indeed have a character leveled on PS4, and I'm willing to bet it's at a higher power level than yours!

It does take a certain amount of guilting him into firing up the PS4 though...

I was on twice last week. Played alone, because I didn't see anyone on when I started.

(And yeah, my Titan's about 10 levels above Rev's. :) )

Well dang son. I'll check the clan list and add you. Assuming it's your regular name, right?

Yeah... no.

Try PfhorPlay. :)

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Try PfhorPlay. :)

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Not what I hear...

- No text -

Bungie just wants to drive everything through eververse. until that changes, I probably won't be on much.

I know this is an exaggeration but what do you think actually goes through Eververse?

I personally can think of two things that do this:
1. The Dawning (which afaik has been the case since D1)
2. Experience engrams

I get this feeling that people think that Eververse is taking over D2 or something. I know it's because of Microtransactions and all that, so if anything goes through her then it feels like Bungie is stabbing you in the back. I can understand peoples feelings about MT, but to say that there is some slow creeping conspiracy by Bungie to make all pathways lead to Eververse is taking it a little far don't you think?

Again, correct me if I'm wrong on my facts because I'm basing this on memory and mine isn't the best.

All ghost shells, sparrows, and ships for one thing. There are no raid sparrows/ships/ghosts. The best looking armor is generally found in Eververse. In D1 Eververse started out as just a place to buy emotes, and it gradually got worse.

Most of the new gear released in CoO is locked behind Eververse.

The whole purpose of "seasons" is to entice people to spend money on the things they couldn't get thru engrams before they go away "forever."

They purposely jacked with the XP system to drive people to eververse.

Bungie is not Bungie anymore. I'm done trusting them with my money and my time. I'll play through the next DLC, b/c i was a sucker and already paid for it. But the next installment will have to be really groundbreaking with amazing reviews.

Bungie just wants to drive everything through eververse. until that changes, I probably won't be on much.

I know this is an exaggeration but what do you think actually goes through Eververse?

I personally can think of two things that do this:
1. The Dawning (which afaik has been the case since D1)
2. Experience engrams

I get this feeling that people think that Eververse is taking over D2 or something. I know it's because of Microtransactions and all that, so if anything goes through her then it feels like Bungie is stabbing you in the back. I can understand peoples feelings about MT, but to say that there is some slow creeping conspiracy by Bungie to make all pathways lead to Eververse is taking it a little far don't you think?

Again, correct me if I'm wrong on my facts because I'm basing this on memory and mine isn't the best.

All ghost shells, sparrows, and ships for one thing. There are no raid sparrows/ships/ghosts.

I can totally understand that because it's basically extras, not terribly important stuff.

The best looking armor is generally found in Eververse.

That's purely opinion, I for one have yet to find a single piece of armor I like. And the vast majority of armor is elsewhere.

In D1 Eververse started out as just a place to buy emotes, and it gradually got worse.

I never understood this. Every vendor has evolved since the start of D1! Has it gotten worse because the Vanguard vendors changed? How about the gunsmith? I really want to know why it's so bad.

Most of the new gear released in CoO is locked behind Eververse.

You do realize that every piece of gear is locked behind something right? And to say that most of the gear is locked behind Eververse is not true. Last I checked, it was something like 1/3 or something, and half of that was Emotes. Either way, everything is locked behind something. Eververse is locked behind playing the game. Let me say this again, anything you do in destiny gets you experience, which gives you stuff from eververse. Which means, eververse gear takes the least effort to get.

The whole purpose of "seasons" is to entice people to spend money on the things they couldn't get thru engrams before they go away "forever."

Maybe to you. If you want to see it that negatively. I see it as a coming and a going. A mark in time. Gives meaning to the items you acquired past even how you acquired them. I understand that getting rid of items so people grind/pay for them sounds evil. But it's also on the people who are willing to pay and believe they need those items.

They purposely jacked with the XP system to drive people to eververse.

Go on... Giving people engrams for gaining experience is a great way to open up those emotes that Eververse was originally selling only for money. The idea that you think there is some grand conspiracy/money grab....

Bungie is not Bungie anymore. I'm done trusting them with my money and my time. I'll play through the next DLC, b/c i was a sucker and already paid for it. But the next installment will have to be really groundbreaking with amazing reviews.

And that is your choice. It's sad that it comes to this. I just wish people wouldn't blame Bungie as if they were the mafia who has a nice front business to hide all their shady dealings.

Apparently I picked the wrong time for a vacation :).

Excellent write-up, Claude!

I'll try to clarify briefly since there seems to still be some confusion regarding the cranium handling just before the pushers start.

While all 6 guardians will each charge and use a cranium every DPS round, the "pusher" team gets priority on platform selection for their charging. As Claude described, each pusher must charge their cranium to match the elemental spark they're responsible for. If the call out is "Arc, Solar, Solar on Void platform", the person pushing the left spark must charge at Arc, and the people pushing center and right must charge at solar.

With the pusher charge locations dictated by the game's RNG, the DPS team must charge their craniums in the remaining locations, starting with any open charging areas at the elemental platform Argos is facing. Once all three charging locations in front of Argos are filled, any DPS team member(s) still needing a charge should go to another occupied elemental platform. The goal is to ensure that all three charge locations in front of Argos are filled (by either pushers or DPSers), and that there are 2 or three guardians together on another plate.

Wherever craniums are charging, their bearers should be clearing local enemies. For the platform facing Argos where everyone will gather during the DPS phase, there should be three people on ad control. Guardians charging craniums at other platforms should stay together to help each other on ad control. They should leave for the DPS platform as a group. The pusher team should call out when they're at the DPS platform and ready - a simple "left here", "center here", "right here" is enough to ensure that once the current wave of adds are down, it's safe to begin DPS. Try to make sure all Minotaurs are gone before starting.

The three guardians charging at the Argos-facing platform should be killing enemies until the last possible moment. If they are pushers, they should pick up their cranium once the "3, 2, 1, push" countdown begins. If they are DPSers, they can wait until after the shield drops to pick up their cranium.

The pushers will have 5-15 shots remaining in their cranium after the push, they should empty them at Argos before shifting to golden gun/hammers/rockets. The DPSers will have a full cranium and should use it first. An empowering rift can significantly increase the team's damage if all cranium shots at Argos are made within it (after his shield is dropped). During the DPS phase, remember that it's faster and safer to stop shooting and dodge the incoming nets rather than get caught up in them - watch his head, be ready, and MOVE if he's looking at you when he fires it. Also remember that there will be a wave of incoming "missile" harpies towards the end.

Speaking as a Lair "quarterback", the directions for the DPS team reduce to following two rules in turn. The pushers will go where they're needed, so you only need to assign the 3 DPS people based on the initial callout. The rules are simple:

• If there are unused charge locations on the DPS platform send one or more DPSers there until all three are occupied.
  
• If there are still unassigned DPSers, assign them to a plate where at least one pusher is charging so they can help each other.

Okay, I completely understand now.

Our problem was that we had the three 'dps' team members all stay on the damage platform, and the 'pusher' team hand all the cranium charging.

Your way makes complete sense.

We are gonna do it tonight for sure.

DPSer train of thought:

• Start on an elemental platform
  
• Is Argos facing me?
  Yes: Call out spark locations left to right, clear a few enemies, and grab your cranium
  No: Clear a few enemies, grab your cranium after the call out
  
• Go to your assigned charge location
  
• Charge your cranium and kill enemies
  
• Is your charge location the platform Argos is facing?
  No: Continue killing enemies until all local craniums are charged, then leave for the DPS platform together
  Yes: Continue killing enemies until the pusher countdown begins. Grab your cranium as the push is happening.
  
• (Sparks are pushed, shield drops)
  
• Are you a warlock?
  Yes: Drop your cranium, create an empowering rift, and pick up your cranium
  
• Are you a Titan?
  Yes: Drop your cranium, create a rally barrier in front of the rift, and pick up your cranium
  
• When the shield drops, step into the rift and fire briefly at Argo's head
  
• Wait for the Net and dodge if necessary
  
• Continue firing your cranium from the rift until it is empty
  
• Are you a hunter?
  Yes: Fire your golden gun, then switch to rockets
  
• Are you a Titan?
  Yes: Throw your (upper tier) hammers, then switch to rockets
  
• Are you a Warlock?
  Yes: Look for the Minotaur that snuck up on everyone and kill it. Switch to rockets
  
• Dodge the second net
  
• Shoot the harpy missiles
  
• Clear adds
  
• Get in position to jump for the wipe mechanic platforms
  
• After the wipe mechanic, return to your starting platform, kill enemies and repeat form the top.

Pusher's train of thought:

• Start at your cranium, pushers should pick them up together to start encounter
  
• Wait for the call out
  
• Take your cranium to the elemental platform you're responsible for (left, right or center)
  
• Charge your cranium and kill enemies
  
• Is your charge location the platform Argos is facing?
  No: Continue killing enemies until all local craniums are charged, then leave for the DPS platform together
  Yes: Continue killing enemies until the pusher countdown begins.
  
• Call out "left/center/right here" when you're at the DPS platform with either a charged cranium in-hand or in front of you
  
• Wait for the "3,2,1 push" callout. If your cranium is charging at the DPS plate, pick it up on "3" and be aimed and ready to fire on "push"
  
• (Sparks are pushed, shield drops)
  
• Are you a warlock?
  Yes: Drop your cranium, create an empowering rift, and pick up your cranium
  
• Are you a Titan?
  Yes: Drop your cranium, create a rally barrier in front of the rift, and pick up your cranium
  
• When the shield drops, step into the rift and empty your remaining cranium ammo at Argo's head
  
• Wait for the Net and dodge if necessary
  
• Are you a hunter?
  Yes: Fire your golden gun, then switch to rockets
  
• Are you a Titan?
  Yes: Throw your (upper tier) hammers, then switch to rockets
  
• Are you a Warlock?
  Yes: Look for the Minotaur that snuck up on everyone and kill it. Switch to rockets
  
• Dodge the second net
  
• Shoot the harpy missiles
  
• Clear adds
  
• Get in position to jump for the wipe mechanic platforms
  
• After the wipe mechanic, return to your cranium spawn point and repeat form the top.

Depends what "Finished" means.

I got through the story in ToO, but not done any of the adventures or whatever comes after that. I did some Raid Lair stuff, but have not had time to go back after that first night with the blind group.