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Basking in New Found Power | Update 1.1.4 Thoughts (Destiny)

by INSANEdrive, ಥ_ಥ | f(ಠ‿↼)z | ᕕ( ᐛ )ᕗ| ¯\_(ツ)_/¯, Tuesday, March 27, 2018, 11:23 (2377 days ago)
edited by INSANEdrive, Tuesday, March 27, 2018, 12:18

Quick Initial Thoughts: This feels soooooo good y'all! With the catch of it being a while sience I played, with this update things feel, honestly, Destiny One-ish to me.

*Loud-Whispers* AND I LIKE IT! XD

Edit1: Very noticeable changes on a Warlock. Our jumps definitely so. Supers definitely come back faster now, which of course is awesome. I keep finding myself surprised that - Oh! My super is back, or how close it is to back already. I've found any movement changes a-bit less noticeable on hunters, so I'm curious what someone who mains a Hunter thinks. Can tell the difference in Arcstrider though. Movements are in a much quicker burst, and still feels awesome. Titan is next.

Last Edit: Titans jump movement feels faster to me too. Still can't skate, but hey, speed is speed. Pun intended, I think things feel punchier with a titan, but not sure.

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Feels basically the same to me

by CruelLEGACEY @, Toronto, Tuesday, March 27, 2018, 12:39 (2377 days ago) @ INSANEdrive

Keep in mind, I haven’t played D2 in a while (6-8 weeks or so? Something like that). So I’m not as dialed-in to the feel of the game as many of you probably are. But it feels barely any different to me. If I hadn’t been aware of the update, I probably wouldn’t have noticed any change.
I played a D1 Raid last week, and D2 still feels slow by comparison to me.
Also keep in mind that I’m only playing as a Titan, so I can’t remark on the other characters.

Surprisingly...

by Claude Errera @, Tuesday, March 27, 2018, 14:08 (2377 days ago) @ CruelLEGACEY

Keep in mind, I haven’t played D2 in a while (6-8 weeks or so? Something like that). So I’m not as dialed-in to the feel of the game as many of you probably are. But it feels barely any different to me. If I hadn’t been aware of the update, I probably wouldn’t have noticed any change.
I played a D1 Raid last week, and D2 still feels slow by comparison to me.
Also keep in mind that I’m only playing as a Titan, so I can’t remark on the other characters.

...I sort of agree with this.

Just ran a few strikes. Didn't really feel any movement changes, damage changes... felt the same as they felt last night.

Weird.

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Surprisingly...

by Kermit @, Raleigh, NC, Tuesday, March 27, 2018, 14:18 (2377 days ago) @ Claude Errera

Keep in mind, I haven’t played D2 in a while (6-8 weeks or so? Something like that). So I’m not as dialed-in to the feel of the game as many of you probably are. But it feels barely any different to me. If I hadn’t been aware of the update, I probably wouldn’t have noticed any change.
I played a D1 Raid last week, and D2 still feels slow by comparison to me.
Also keep in mind that I’m only playing as a Titan, so I can’t remark on the other characters.


...I sort of agree with this.

Just ran a few strikes. Didn't really feel any movement changes, damage changes... felt the same as they felt last night.

Weird.

Oh, great, now to be fed even more videos with Destiny logos pasted over the faces of dying characters in popular movies.

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Surprisingly...

by Korny @, Dalton, Ga. US. Earth, Sol System, Tuesday, March 27, 2018, 14:44 (2377 days ago) @ Kermit

Keep in mind, I haven’t played D2 in a while (6-8 weeks or so? Something like that). So I’m not as dialed-in to the feel of the game as many of you probably are. But it feels barely any different to me. If I hadn’t been aware of the update, I probably wouldn’t have noticed any change.
I played a D1 Raid last week, and D2 still feels slow by comparison to me.
Also keep in mind that I’m only playing as a Titan, so I can’t remark on the other characters.


...I sort of agree with this.

Just ran a few strikes. Didn't really feel any movement changes, damage changes... felt the same as they felt last night.

Weird.


Oh, great, now to be fed even more videos with Destiny logos pasted over the faces of dying characters in popular movies.

Keep in mind that Cruel and Claude both run Titans, which were the least-affected class. Also, they both tend to run rockets, which weren’t really changed much.

I’ll be hopping on in a bit, and I’ll run some Dawnblade in the Crucible.

Surprisingly...

by Claude Errera @, Tuesday, March 27, 2018, 15:05 (2377 days ago) @ Korny

Keep in mind, I haven’t played D2 in a while (6-8 weeks or so? Something like that). So I’m not as dialed-in to the feel of the game as many of you probably are. But it feels barely any different to me. If I hadn’t been aware of the update, I probably wouldn’t have noticed any change.
I played a D1 Raid last week, and D2 still feels slow by comparison to me.
Also keep in mind that I’m only playing as a Titan, so I can’t remark on the other characters.


...I sort of agree with this.

Just ran a few strikes. Didn't really feel any movement changes, damage changes... felt the same as they felt last night.

Weird.


Oh, great, now to be fed even more videos with Destiny logos pasted over the faces of dying characters in popular movies.


Keep in mind that Cruel and Claude both run Titans, which were the least-affected class. Also, they both tend to run rockets, which weren’t really changed much.

I actually played as a Warlock (though not Solar, so I didn't try out the biggest changes).

I’ll be hopping on in a bit, and I’ll run some Dawnblade in the Crucible.

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Also curious to MOB stats; testing.

by Harmanimus @, Tuesday, March 27, 2018, 15:15 (2377 days ago) @ Claude Errera

Because while I know here are supposed to be many blanket changes one of the thing they do mention is the impacet of 2-10 for Mobility. Makes me wonder how exactly it is changing things.

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Some of my thots...

by Korny @, Dalton, Ga. US. Earth, Sol System, Wednesday, March 28, 2018, 08:45 (2376 days ago) @ Korny

Keep in mind, I haven’t played D2 in a while (6-8 weeks or so? Something like that). So I’m not as dialed-in to the feel of the game as many of you probably are. But it feels barely any different to me. If I hadn’t been aware of the update, I probably wouldn’t have noticed any change.
I played a D1 Raid last week, and D2 still feels slow by comparison to me.
Also keep in mind that I’m only playing as a Titan, so I can’t remark on the other characters.


...I sort of agree with this.

Just ran a few strikes. Didn't really feel any movement changes, damage changes... felt the same as they felt last night.

Weird.


Oh, great, now to be fed even more videos with Destiny logos pasted over the faces of dying characters in popular movies.


Keep in mind that Cruel and Claude both run Titans, which were the least-affected class. Also, they both tend to run rockets, which weren’t really changed much.

I’ll be hopping on in a bit, and I’ll run some Dawnblade in the Crucible.

First and foremost, the increased movement (both mine and the enemies') was noticeable enough that I had to increase my controller sensitivity so that I could turn my warlock around much faster. It definitely helped as far as mobility, but my aiming went whack, so I lost far more fights than I would have before. I wish there was an ADS sensitivity slider...

Anyway, I tried Dawnblade and Stormcaller.

As far as jumps go, Burst glide feels almost as good as it did in D1, with the major flaw being that unlike D1, you lose momentum if you keep gliding. You can feel the exact point that you start losing speed, so it's fairly easy to cancel the jump and bunny hop across distances. Definitely helped escape lots of tricky situations that I wouldn't have been able to before, as well as making it easier to have a far more aggressive playstyle, since you can easily flank enemies before they can adjust.


With the top tree for Dawnblade, having Icarus back often helped disorient the enemy quite a bit, especially when paired with burst glide, but I'm still horrible at adapting to the inability to feather my jumps thanks to the Winged Sun perk, which I would give anything to disable, as it doesn't feel any more accurate than before.

With the bottom tree, things feel a bit blander, and Phoenix Dive doesn't seem to work at regenerating your health half the time. The saving grace is that the Dawnblade super itself feels far more threatening, though I'm still terrible at it (even worse than I was with Solar Titans in D1!).

Going back to Stormcaller, though, and oh boy. If I wasn't already aggressive before... If feels like the only thing that could really stop me while playing Stormcaller was my hubris. Teamshotting is still a thing, but I also pushed in hard enough to realize that shotguns are a big threat now (the amount of Acrius's that I ran into caused me to reevaluate my face-first-into-Hell approach in some matches).

As far as Heavy ammo, there's a pretty constant supply now, but I died to rockets only once in the handful of matches that I played. Shotguns are the new Crucible Heavy meta it seems... At least for now. Never ran into a fellow sniper, though.

I ran one strike (Exodus Down), and used my Heavy ammo pretty often, but never really ran out, so I started sniping trash mobs, and still wasn't running out. It's pretty dang great to be able to run something other than Wardcliff coil for a change.
Also, did they add new dialogue to those strikes? I was hearing dialogue that Ive never heard before. Then again, I don't play that strike very often...

Anyway, the changes are noticeable for me, and while it won't bring me back, it's definitely a more fun, competitive game than before.

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You people are insane

by stabbim @, Des Moines, IA, USA, Wednesday, March 28, 2018, 12:54 (2376 days ago) @ Claude Errera

I ran as a couple of different Warlock subclasses last night, and found the burst of momentum at the beginning of my glide was so much more than before that it took me a few minutes to recalibrate. I was overshooting things a ton at first. Dawnblade felt hugely different while using the super - I was zooming across the map so fast that I nearly fell off a few times. And I definitely used that super more times than I'm used to during the strikes we ran.

My Nightshade pulse rifle might have felt a bit different, I wasn't as sure about that part. It felt like MAYBE it was doing a bit better on from-the-hip body shots than before. But that gun was never really lacking in the first place IMO. Might be easier to tell with a crap gun, but I dismantled all those already. :P

I'll have to try out the other classes and see how they feel.

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I was almost dizzy

by kidtsunami @, Atlanta, GA, Wednesday, March 28, 2018, 13:03 (2376 days ago) @ stabbim

Dawnblade felt hugely different while using the super - I was zooming across the map so fast that I nearly fell off a few times. And I definitely used that super more times than I'm used to during the strikes we ran.

When I was down and spectating you. I had to re-orient the camera to behind you, cause damn, that was fast.

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You people are insane

by CruelLEGACEY @, Toronto, Wednesday, March 28, 2018, 13:20 (2376 days ago) @ stabbim

I ran as a couple of different Warlock subclasses last night, and found the burst of momentum at the beginning of my glide was so much more than before that it took me a few minutes to recalibrate. I was overshooting things a ton at first. Dawnblade felt hugely different while using the super - I was zooming across the map so fast that I nearly fell off a few times. And I definitely used that super more times than I'm used to during the strikes we ran.

My Nightshade pulse rifle might have felt a bit different, I wasn't as sure about that part. It felt like MAYBE it was doing a bit better on from-the-hip body shots than before. But that gun was never really lacking in the first place IMO. Might be easier to tell with a crap gun, but I dismantled all those already. :P

I'll have to try out the other classes and see how they feel.

I haven't tried Warlock or Hunter yet, nor have I gone out of my way to test and compare all the various things that have been tweaked. I just jumped in with my Titan and played for a couple hours, doing my usual routine through some patrols, public events, and strikes. I used a couple subclasses, a bunch of different weapons. And in that context, literally the only change I noticed was that my Titan's jumps were tweaked... and ironically, they'v been changed in a way that makes me feel slower (the "Catapult" jump now gives the titan a noticeable bump "upwards", but it appears to be at the cost of forward momentum). I'm certainly not denying that the changes are there, and I'm sure there are some changes that are quite noticeable (I ran across several other players who were using Linear Fusion Rifles in patrol, and they looked like they were wrecking shop with them :D).

I'm just saying that as a player who's been away from the game for a while, playing this new update does not feel at all like what I was expecting after watching Bungie's developer commentary video. Maybe I got too excited by what I was hearing, but in my honest opinion they substantially oversold the significance of this update, at least in some cases. Or said another way, the fact that it is possible to jump into the game, play for 2 hours using a variety of loadouts and still not feel any real difference, is evidence that this update is relatively minor. I'd put the fact that it still feels slow compared to D1 in that category as well. I'm sure the tweaks are going to be a nice little improvement to the game for those who are playing and enjoying D2 for what it is. IMO, this update is not going to pull people back into playing if they've fallen away from the game, which is a shame to me, because that's what I was selfishly hoping for.

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You people are insane

by Korny @, Dalton, Ga. US. Earth, Sol System, Wednesday, March 28, 2018, 14:27 (2376 days ago) @ CruelLEGACEY

I ran as a couple of different Warlock subclasses last night, and found the burst of momentum at the beginning of my glide was so much more than before that it took me a few minutes to recalibrate. I was overshooting things a ton at first. Dawnblade felt hugely different while using the super - I was zooming across the map so fast that I nearly fell off a few times. And I definitely used that super more times than I'm used to during the strikes we ran.

My Nightshade pulse rifle might have felt a bit different, I wasn't as sure about that part. It felt like MAYBE it was doing a bit better on from-the-hip body shots than before. But that gun was never really lacking in the first place IMO. Might be easier to tell with a crap gun, but I dismantled all those already. :P

I'll have to try out the other classes and see how they feel.


I haven't tried Warlock or Hunter yet, nor have I gone out of my way to test and compare all the various things that have been tweaked. I just jumped in with my Titan and played for a couple hours, doing my usual routine through some patrols, public events, and strikes. I used a couple subclasses, a bunch of different weapons. And in that context, literally the only change I noticed was that my Titan's jumps were tweaked... and ironically, they'v been changed in a way that makes me feel slower (the "Catapult" jump now gives the titan a noticeable bump "upwards", but it appears to be at the cost of forward momentum). I'm certainly not denying that the changes are there, and I'm sure there are some changes that are quite noticeable (I ran across several other players who were using Linear Fusion Rifles in patrol, and they looked like they were wrecking shop with them :D).


Again, though, as you acknowledge, you were just playing as the barely-changed Titan, doing the same dumb Titan things that your kind usually do, using the same boring guns that you are glued to, despite your likely-overflowing Vault (which, now that we've had the biggest, and likely only major overhaul since launch, the whiny "I don't wanna delete these 200 guns because maybe the Meta will change and they be gooder!" people can finally go through their vault and delete the garbage that they've been hoarding, and we can finally stop hearing complaints about Vault space)...
You gotta mix it up, man!
I mean, the only times that I've loaded D2 up in the past couple of months was mostly to take some picures, and even I notice the drastic changes. Crucible is borderline a Special weapon-fest like D1 was, and pop-and-go tactics help create those so-called "Hero moments" again, assuming you aren't teamshot by a coordinated group.


I'm just saying that as a player who's been away from the game for a while, playing this new update does not feel at all like what I was expecting after watching Bungie's developer commentary video. Maybe I got too excited by what I was hearing, but in my honest opinion they substantially oversold the significance of this update, at least in some cases.

Yeah, that's why I pointed out that the "commentary" was just fluff to hype up some desperately-needed changes. You fell for it. What's the saying? Fool me ten times? Gotta wise up, man.

Or said another way, the fact that it is possible to jump into the game, play for 2 hours using a variety of loadouts and still not feel any real difference, is evidence that this update is relatively minor. I'd put the fact that it still feels slow compared to D1 in that category as well. I'm sure the tweaks are going to be a nice little improvement to the game for those who are playing and enjoying D2 for what it is. IMO, this update is not going to pull people back into playing if they've fallen away from the game, which is a shame to me, because that's what I was selfishly hoping for.


Right, and the thing is that folks like you and I are looking for a content overhaul, not a weapon balance. We need a reason to play, which you can't get simply from improving the gameplay itself. A miniscule sampling of strike-exclusive content isn't going to pull players back in. The gameplay is more fun, but the game is still lacking when it comes to providing us goals to strive for. We need new game modes (not just PvP), new areas to explore, new activities to do with friends, new challenges. We need that Curveball that DE was stressing the importance of...

That you were somehow hoping for a weapon and movement rebalancing to supplant these things to bring you back is kind of silly, no?

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You people are insane

by CruelLEGACEY @, Toronto, Wednesday, March 28, 2018, 14:46 (2376 days ago) @ Korny
edited by CruelLEGACEY, Wednesday, March 28, 2018, 14:51

I ran as a couple of different Warlock subclasses last night, and found the burst of momentum at the beginning of my glide was so much more than before that it took me a few minutes to recalibrate. I was overshooting things a ton at first. Dawnblade felt hugely different while using the super - I was zooming across the map so fast that I nearly fell off a few times. And I definitely used that super more times than I'm used to during the strikes we ran.

My Nightshade pulse rifle might have felt a bit different, I wasn't as sure about that part. It felt like MAYBE it was doing a bit better on from-the-hip body shots than before. But that gun was never really lacking in the first place IMO. Might be easier to tell with a crap gun, but I dismantled all those already. :P

I'll have to try out the other classes and see how they feel.


I haven't tried Warlock or Hunter yet, nor have I gone out of my way to test and compare all the various things that have been tweaked. I just jumped in with my Titan and played for a couple hours, doing my usual routine through some patrols, public events, and strikes. I used a couple subclasses, a bunch of different weapons. And in that context, literally the only change I noticed was that my Titan's jumps were tweaked... and ironically, they'v been changed in a way that makes me feel slower (the "Catapult" jump now gives the titan a noticeable bump "upwards", but it appears to be at the cost of forward momentum). I'm certainly not denying that the changes are there, and I'm sure there are some changes that are quite noticeable (I ran across several other players who were using Linear Fusion Rifles in patrol, and they looked like they were wrecking shop with them :D).

Again, though, as you acknowledge, you were just playing as the barely-changed Titan, doing the same dumb Titan things that your kind usually do, using the same boring guns that you are glued to, despite your likely-overflowing Vault (which, now that we've had the biggest, and likely only major overhaul since launch, the whiny "I don't wanna delete these 200 guns because maybe the Meta will change and they be gooder!" people can finally go through their vault and delete the garbage that they've been hoarding, and we can finally stop hearing complaints about Vault space)...
You gotta mix it up, man!

You know what they say about assumptions ;)

I did mix it up. I used several auto rifles, hand cannons, scout rifles, pulse rifles, swords, rocket launchers, grenade launchers, 2 of my subclasses, experimented with the jumps, tried different grenades...

I did NOT sit there with the patch notes in front of me and go through it like a check list. I just played the game, but swapped gear and abilities more frequently than usual so that I could get a natural, organic feel for how the game plays in its updated form. I still need to do more of that, because I obviously haven't tried everything (nor did I claim that I have). But 2 hours is enough time for me to say with confidence that this update is not a "game changer" in any significant sense. I'm not getting more supers per strike than I used to. I'm still waiting for what feels like forever between grenades. I still can't use my jumps without killing all my forward momentum. For a patch called the "go faster" update, I think it is fair to expect the changes to be sweeping enough to have an impact on the game for all players, not just some players using certain weapons or supers. And I don't feel that is what this update does.


I'm just saying that as a player who's been away from the game for a while, playing this new update does not feel at all like what I was expecting after watching Bungie's developer commentary video. Maybe I got too excited by what I was hearing, but in my honest opinion they substantially oversold the significance of this update, at least in some cases.


Yeah, that's why I pointed out that the "commentary" was just fluff to hype up some desperately-needed changes. You fell for it. What's the saying? Fool me ten times? Gotta wise up, man.

I love the way people tell me not to be so negative when i say I don't take Bungie at their word, and then when I do take them at their word people tell me "Gotta wise up, man!" lol

Or said another way, the fact that it is possible to jump into the game, play for 2 hours using a variety of loadouts and still not feel any real difference, is evidence that this update is relatively minor. I'd put the fact that it still feels slow compared to D1 in that category as well. I'm sure the tweaks are going to be a nice little improvement to the game for those who are playing and enjoying D2 for what it is. IMO, this update is not going to pull people back into playing if they've fallen away from the game, which is a shame to me, because that's what I was selfishly hoping for.

Right, and the thing is that folks like you and I are looking for a content overhaul, not a weapon balance. We need a reason to play, which you can't get simply from improving the gameplay itself. A miniscule sampling of strike-exclusive content isn't going to pull players back in. The gameplay is more fun, but the game is still lacking when it comes to providing us goals to strive for. We need new game modes (not just PvP), new areas to explore, new activities to do with friends, new challenges. We need that Curveball that DE was stressing the importance of...

That you were somehow hoping for a weapon and movement rebalancing to supplant these things to bring you back is kind of silly, no?

Totally off the mark here. Gameplay re-balancing is exactly what I was hoping for. I'll play the same content over and over and over if I find the combat consistently fun and exciting and dynamic. I like Destiny 2. The combat is good. But I have enough problems with how it plays in certain ways that my desire to keep playing has dropped off. I was hoping this update would address at least some of my complaints. So far, I don't think it has.

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You people are insane

by Ragashingo ⌂, Official DBO Cryptarch, Wednesday, March 28, 2018, 16:17 (2376 days ago) @ CruelLEGACEY

I noticed very little “go fast” on my movement as a Titan. But, I run 0 mobility so why would I expect to feel an increase in speed? Similarly, I think your assessment is too limited in scope. The biggest movement updates were to the Arc Strider’s Super and the Dawnblade Super. Making any sort of claim about going fast without trying them is... incomplete.

Personally, I could very clearly feel a difference while Supering with my Arc Strider. The delays after dodging or attacking are very nearly gone leading to a much smoother and faster feel.

I love the way people tell me not to be so negative when i say I don't take Bungie at their word, and then when I do take them at their word people tell me "Gotta wise up, man!" lol

Are these even the same people telling you this? Feels like a cheap shot on your part to me. :(

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You people are insane

by Harmanimus @, Wednesday, March 28, 2018, 16:29 (2376 days ago) @ Ragashingo

WHat jump do you run on your Titan? And do you run the shoulder charge trees? Even with lower mobility there are things that make Titans feel faster. Not D1 pain train fast, but substantially more than they have been.

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You people are insane

by CruelLEGACEY @, Toronto, Wednesday, March 28, 2018, 16:56 (2376 days ago) @ Ragashingo

I love the way people tell me not to be so negative when i say I don't take Bungie at their word, and then when I do take them at their word people tell me "Gotta wise up, man!" lol


Are these even the same people telling you this? Feels like a cheap shot on your part to me. :(

Well it was more of a joke than anything else, along the “damned if you do, damned if you don’t” line.

Also, in this particular case, I was replying to Korny. I wouldn’t put anything past him ;p

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Heh. True. :p

by Ragashingo ⌂, Official DBO Cryptarch, Wednesday, March 28, 2018, 17:41 (2376 days ago) @ CruelLEGACEY

- No text -

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You people are insane

by Cody Miller @, Music of the Spheres - Never Forgot, Wednesday, March 28, 2018, 15:52 (2376 days ago) @ Korny

The gameplay is more fun, but the game is still lacking when it comes to providing us goals to strive for.

Uh, why not strive for a Prestige raid completion? :-p

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You people are insane

by INSANEdrive, ಥ_ಥ | f(ಠ‿↼)z | ᕕ( ᐛ )ᕗ| ¯\_(ツ)_/¯, Wednesday, March 28, 2018, 15:12 (2376 days ago) @ stabbim

Yes. I. Am. ...

I ran as a couple of different Warlock subclasses last night, and found the burst of momentum at the beginning of my glide was so much more than before that it took me a few minutes to recalibrate. I was overshooting things a ton at first. Dawnblade felt hugely different while using the super - I was zooming across the map so fast that I nearly fell off a few times. And I definitely used that super more times than I'm used to during the strikes we ran.

My Nightshade pulse rifle might have felt a bit different, I wasn't as sure about that part. It felt like MAYBE it was doing a bit better on from-the-hip body shots than before. But that gun was never really lacking in the first place IMO. Might be easier to tell with a crap gun, but I dismantled all those already. :P

I'll have to try out the other classes and see how they feel.

What are you doing with the Dawnblade? I've been trying to go fast, but I can't seem to go fast.

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You people are insane

by stabbim @, Des Moines, IA, USA, Wednesday, March 28, 2018, 17:40 (2376 days ago) @ INSANEdrive

I dunno, I just jumped up and hovered like normal, and I was moving around faster than usual up there.

I guess it could depend which jump you're using? I THINK I'm using the in-between one, can't remember for sure right now.

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It feels... nice...

by Ragashingo ⌂, Official DBO Cryptarch, Tuesday, March 27, 2018, 15:14 (2377 days ago) @ INSANEdrive

I was afraid they were going to overdo it with the changes to player movement and weapon power in the Crucible. Instead, it feels nice. There’s still plenty of opportunity to duel or counter most enemy moves (assuming you’re on your game), but it also felt like I could kill someone before they just shrugged and walked around a corner out of sight.

Super recharge isn’t something you will necessarily notice mid match. I hardly even noticed during Strikes where I can better gage how things are going. I felt like I had my Super when I needed it a bit more maybe, but even that was subtle. And why wouldn’t it be subtle. They only cut a minute and forty seconds off the Super recharge. During a 10 minute Crucible match you won’t see a extra Super, all things being equal. Maybe in a 15 minute long Strike you might get an extra Super.

I can’t really comment on the speed/movement changes as I play a 0 mobility Titan. I haven’t seen anything too insane from other players yet, so that’s good. I’d hate for Destiny to turn into Titanfall or something...

Overall, yeah, it just felt a little nicer to me. :)

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Run speed...

by Durandal, Thursday, March 29, 2018, 05:12 (2375 days ago) @ Ragashingo

I'd still like to see the mobility stat affect run speed and super speed, instead of locking those to one value independent of anything else. It doesn't seem like there is still enough incentive to put points into mobility over resilience in many situations.

I see lots of screaming about TTK on the destiny reddit still. It seems to me this has taken on a talsmanic property, where players believe if only they are blessed with lower TTK across the board in PVP (and they can have sniper+rockets) all things will be good again.

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Run speed...

by CruelLEGACEY @, Toronto, Thursday, March 29, 2018, 08:01 (2375 days ago) @ Durandal
edited by CruelLEGACEY, Thursday, March 29, 2018, 08:05

I'd still like to see the mobility stat affect run speed and super speed, instead of locking those to one value independent of anything else. It doesn't seem like there is still enough incentive to put points into mobility over resilience in many situations.

The best explanation I've seen so far is that Bungie wanted to avoid the scenario where you match into a strike, and 1 or 2 players take off sprinting ahead while the player with lower mobility falls progressively further behind with no hope of catching up. So to avoid that, they flattened the sprint speed across all classes and detached it from the mobility stat.

Personally, I'd rather address that problem in other ways, and bring back some more diversity in movement speeds, including sprint speeds. I'd also like to see sprint speeds increased across the board.


I see lots of screaming about TTK on the destiny reddit still. It seems to me this has taken on a talsmanic property, where players believe if only they are blessed with lower TTK across the board in PVP (and they can have sniper+rockets) all things will be good again.

I think a lot of that discussion is kinda circling the key point, but over-simplifying it a bit.

The ideal "time to kill" in any shooter needs to work in a balance with the other aspects of the game, including movement speed, map size and complexity, etc. This is why I'm skeptical any time a developer starts making sweeping sandbox changes to a game that's already released. You can't adjust things like player speed or weapon range and accuracy without tweaking map sizes and layouts along with it. They all interact together. So the chances that you can change movement speed and have it scale in a way that it just "clicks" into place with the existing maps is, in my experience, slim.

We saw this back in Halo Reach, when they reduced/removed bloom. Players were suddenly cross-mapping with the DMR to trap enemies in their spawns because the maps were not designed to be played with guns that were so accurate from so far away, AND the player movement speed was too low to effectively counter such accuracy.

We saw it in Destiny 1 as well. Certain weapons were tweaked right out of being usable because their effective ranges were not balanced around the size and layout of the maps. There never seemed to be a clear, well defined concept of "what is the desirable effective range of a close-quarters weapon, a mid range weapon, and a long range weapon" that remained constant. Because of this, the maps were sometimes incompatible with certain loadouts and playstyles. You'd have maps where the "close quarters" sections were still too big to use any of the short range weapons effectively.

Back to the TTK issue... In my mind, focusing on TTK is kinda putting the cart before the horse if the movement speed isn't nailed down. And movement speed, along with map layout and geometry, often comes down to what feels "fun" or satisfying to control. You want the act of running and jumping, sliding, vaulting, or gliding around the map to feel fluid and smooth and fun all by itself. If you nail this, you have a fantastic base to work from. That's a huge part of why I love Titanfall 2 so much. You could throw me into a map with no enemies, no guns, no objectives of any kind, and I'll still be able to have loads of fun just running and flying through the air and bouncing around the map. I'm not saying Destiny 2 needs to have movements equivalent to Titanfall, but I do believe the movement needs to be equally fun. And right now, I don't think they've quite nailed it. This is totally subjective, but even after like 150 hours playing D2, I still don't find the movement intuitive. The jumps never move quite the way it feels like they should, my character's movement feels like it has no momentum of its own... like I'm about to grind to a halt at any moment. But that's just me.

At any rate, once the movement and map layout is nailed down, that's when the precise TTK needs to be dialed in. I don't think the TTK in D2 is too slow in a vacuum, but I think the map layout, movement speed, and effective ranges of many of the weapons lead to situations where it is often possible to engage and enemy, trade a few shots, and then disengage and retreat to safety. I don't have any problem with that, if that's the sort of combat the game is about. But I think there are other design choices that would better facilitate that style of combat. Like, for example, having health that didn't regenerate or only regenerated partially. Ragashingo is going to hate me, because I'm about to reference Titanfall 2 again, but that's exactly how they approach the Titan combat. The Titan's are bigger targets that move relatively slowly (compared to the ninja-like pilots, although some of the Titans still move quite a bit faster than a guardian in Destiny). But the Titans also have lots of armor, which allows them to take a few punches and then retreat to safety. However, their health doesn't recharge. So if you nail an enemy Titan with a few hits and then he retreats, your attack is not negated. You've done lasting damage.

I suspect that Bungie is not interested in that particular style of combat with regards to Destiny. So if that's the case, they need to tune the game such that it isn't quite so easy to disengage from combat, sit and wait for a few seconds, then jump back in as if the previous damage had never happened. That can be achieved a few ways. It could be done by changing the player movement speed, or increasing the distances between cover, or increasing weapon damage to shorten the TTK. It's tough to mess with those first 2 elements without detracting from the potential for player movement to feel "fun", to shortening the TTK does seem to be the optimal solution in this case. But I certainly don't think its as simple as "shorter TTK is always best".

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Run speed...

by Ragashingo ⌂, Official DBO Cryptarch, Thursday, March 29, 2018, 09:06 (2375 days ago) @ CruelLEGACEY

1. An obligatory, and already addressed “Destiny ain’t Titanfall” reminder. :p
2. You’re exactly right about map/movement speed/TTK being a interconnected balance.
3. My preferred weapon, the High Impact class of Pulse Rifles, just got an ~18% boost in damage output. +6.3% rate of fire increase. +12.5% damage increase. Weapons all over the sandbox received similar buffs. So, Bungie did just do something to make it harder for a 1 on 1 engagement to end in mutual retreat. And I can feel that difference quite clearly. (I would not have gotten my first Pulse Rifle kill in my Apertureing Destiny video with the rules as they were last week. Or the one where I nailed the guy in the rocks right before the Arc Strider slammed near him.)

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Run speed...

by CruelLEGACEY @, Toronto, Thursday, March 29, 2018, 09:22 (2375 days ago) @ Ragashingo

3. My preferred weapon, the High Impact class of Pulse Rifles, just got an ~18% boost in damage output. +6.3% rate of fire increase. +12.5% damage increase. Weapons all over the sandbox received similar buffs. So, Bungie did just do something to make it harder for a 1 on 1 engagement to end in mutual retreat. And I can feel that difference quite clearly. (I would not have gotten my first Pulse Rifle kill in my Apertureing Destiny video with the rules as they were last week. Or the one where I nailed the guy in the rocks right before the Arc Strider slammed near him.)

I still haven’t tried PvP since the update, but I’m hearing great things about Pulse Rifles in general, and the Vigilance Wing in particular... which is hilarious, given I already felt pretty dominant with that thing. Looking forward to taking it for a spin in its new and improved form :D

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Run speed...

by cheapLEY @, Thursday, March 29, 2018, 09:24 (2375 days ago) @ CruelLEGACEY

I still haven’t tried PvP since the update, but I’m hearing great things about Pulse Rifles in general, and the Vigilance Wing in particular... which is hilarious, given I already felt pretty dominant with that thing. Looking forward to taking it for a spin in its new and improved form :D

Vigilance Wing is maybe the one gun in the game that I can point to as just absolutely ridiculous and on-par with the beasts of Destiny 1. It's just a monster. Just thinking about it is enough to make me want to pop in Destiny 2 and shoot a few aliens with it.

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Run speed...

by Harmanimus @, Thursday, March 29, 2018, 11:25 (2375 days ago) @ cheapLEY

Vigilance Wing gained the benefits with being a High Impact Frame Pulse. It has a theoretical 2 Burst, as it is doing 20 on precision hits. It doesn’t even have to be all precision depending on Resilience.

On the discussion re: more general tweaks, I think that the maps in Des2ny were not well suited to the speed or TTK at launch. Haven’t had time to dive into PvP post 1.1.4, but i am hopeful. Even if I’m an Auto Rifle kind of Guardian myself. But on that note, I can inagine more adjustments to the sandbox will come in time, continuing to narrow the TTK. As was said about other interactions being important, as it stands the substantial differences with high Recovery, even with the bottom brought up, still weigh stat spread heavily to recovery for the most “meta” play. A slightly slower potential heal regen are all very (i.e. nerf to Recovery at the higher end) can probably help out the overall feel of engagements and felt time to kill. Because someone with a 9-10 Recovery ducking a corner and popping back out may have already imbalanced the fight compared to someone with a lower or middling Recovery.

Albeit I’d still like to see Resilience brought up a little, too. But if Recovery is a little less powerful, dodging and tanking shots becomes more viable and valuable.

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Basking in New Found Power | Hunter Impressions

by CruelLEGACEY @, Toronto, Saturday, March 31, 2018, 12:00 (2373 days ago) @ INSANEdrive

So I spent the past few days getting my baby Hunter through the campaign and fully leveled. I spent most of that time playing as an Arcstrider, and I’m really enjoying the way they play now. In particular, the lower skill tree that grants faster sprint speed... combined with the updated mobility stats, the arcstrider feels snappy, agile, and effective. The super feels deadly now, too.

I had a decent time playing through the campaign, but things really clicked into place when I hit level 25 and was able to swap my Tractor Cannon over from my Titan. Ooooooh baby, I’ve found my new favourite way to play! I almost never stop sprinting. I’ll come flying into a crowd of enemies (from above, if possible), hit them with a quick Boop or two, then dash away before they an focus much fire on me. My Destiny playstyle has always been pretty tanky. I like to be crazy aggressive. This build, along with the sandbox update, makes hit-and-run play loads of fun. I’m still being aggressive in a way that I love, but weaving in and out of direct fire in a way that I couldn’t pre-update, or even post-update on my other character.

I just got Quickfang, too. Looking forward to having some fun with that :)

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Basking in New Found Power | Hunter Impressions

by cheapLEY @, Saturday, March 31, 2018, 21:48 (2373 days ago) @ CruelLEGACEY

So I spent the past few days getting my baby Hunter through the campaign and fully leveled. I spent most of that time playing as an Arcstrider, and I’m really enjoying the way they play now. In particular, the lower skill tree that grants faster sprint speed... combined with the updated mobility stats, the arcstrider feels snappy, agile, and effective. The super feels deadly now, too.

I had a decent time playing through the campaign, but things really clicked into place when I hit level 25 and was able to swap my Tractor Cannon over from my Titan. Ooooooh baby, I’ve found my new favourite way to play! I almost never stop sprinting. I’ll come flying into a crowd of enemies (from above, if possible), hit them with a quick Boop or two, then dash away before they an focus much fire on me. My Destiny playstyle has always been pretty tanky. I like to be crazy aggressive. This build, along with the sandbox update, makes hit-and-run play loads of fun. I’m still being aggressive in a way that I love, but weaving in and out of direct fire in a way that I couldn’t pre-update, or even post-update on my other character.


I'm interested to see how it feels. I really like playing as a Hunter, but I was having a decently difficult time surviving when I used her for the Raid Lair during the final encounter. She couldn't take many hits, but wasn't really any faster to make up for that. I'd like see a max mobility Hunter become a unique playstyle with some real viability.

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