Destiny 2 Exp II Prologue

For whatever reason, this reminded me of Jillybean's excellent story back in the day that was inspired by this concept art. I've looked and looked and cannot find it.

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Bungie, please... stop teasing us by showing guardians doing awesome things in trailers if we aren’t going to be able to do it in-game. Zavala’s backstory piece was cool and all, but all I could think while watching it was “combat in Destiny is nothing like this”. Now we’ve got a guardian doing a spinning split kick and using her knife to climb an ice wall.

At best, it breaks any immersion do to the sheer contrast with actual gameplay. Worst case scenario, it kinda borders on false advertising.

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Bungie, please... stop teasing us by showing guardians doing awesome things in trailers if we aren’t going to be able to do it in-game. Zavala’s backstory piece was cool and all, but all I could think while watching it was “combat in Destiny is nothing like this”. Now we’ve got a guardian doing a spinning split kick and using her knife to climb an ice wall.

At best, it breaks any immersion do to the sheer contrast with actual gameplay. Worst case scenario, it kinda borders on false advertising.

Hear, hear.

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Bungie, please... stop teasing us by showing guardians doing awesome things in trailers if we aren’t going to be able to do it in-game. Zavala’s backstory piece was cool and all, but all I could think while watching it was “combat in Destiny is nothing like this”. Now we’ve got a guardian doing a spinning split kick and using her knife to climb an ice wall.

At best, it breaks any immersion do to the sheer contrast with actual gameplay. Worst case scenario, it kinda borders on false advertising.

Hear, hear.

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Reading about the long canceled Human Head Studios version of Prey 2, I read something that felt relevant to this discussion. So here it is. Relevant sentence in bold.

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Later in the project, we were told Prey 2 suddenly had a lot of quality issues. One of the ideas discussed was changing the beginning of the game. One had you start out at the plane crash site from the first Prey. Another one had you working with Tommy sabotaging a location before he appeared to sacrifice himself saving you.

One that I favored was getting the player in as quickly as possible without a series of tutorials. A bombastic James Bond opening. You play what you saw in Blur's Cinematic trailer made with Human Head’s direction. The video did a great job at introducing all the core mechanics. At the time it was a rare trailer showcasing what you could actually do in the game instead of a story cinematic.

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No. It's nowhere close to false advertising. You have got to be reasonable. And making that claim when each of those videos proceeded an hour's worth of showing the game as it is... is just not intellectually supportable.

Beyond that... come on! Live a little, man! Let your imagination out of that dark, cold cellar you've apparently stuffed it in. If all you can think about is the things you can't do when watching the single best Destiny cutscene ever then... well... the words I'm searching for I can't say because Destiny is rated T for Teen. :/

Are there real examples that do go too far beyond what a game actually offers? Sure. But neither of your examples are them.

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Letting your imagination loose on the world of Destiny is the single best way to be disappointed when the game doesn’t measure up.

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Letting your imagination loose on the world of Destiny is the single best way to be disappointed when the game doesn’t measure up.

No, expecting Destiny to be on par with your imagination is the best way to be disappointed. And never letting your imagination loose in the first place is just depressing.

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Letting your imagination loose on the world of Destiny is the single best way to be disappointed when the game doesn’t measure up.

No, expecting Destiny to be on par with your imagination is the best way to be disappointed. And never letting your imagination loose in the first place is just depressing.

My problem with Raga’s point about imagination is that he’s assuming I’m not bringing mine to the table... I am, but these inconsistencies my immersion.

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Letting your imagination loose on the world of Destiny is the single best way to be disappointed when the game doesn’t measure up.

No, expecting Destiny to be on par with your imagination is the best way to be disappointed. And never letting your imagination loose in the first place is just depressing.

My problem with Raga’s point about imagination is that he’s assuming I’m not bringing mine to the table... I am, but these inconsistencies my immersion.

I kinda sit somewhere in between your points. I know you both use your imagination, but I always expect a trailer to be a candy coated version of the game. But maybe that's just me! It's even possible that we are individual people with different expectations of things! *gasp*

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Look at the Halo 3 Starry Night commercial for the difference.

Sure, it’s short, but we see Master Chief being a badass, but he uses the bubble shield which we can totally do, and then he just attacks a bunch of enemies. The spirit of showing cool stuff in a stylized way is there, but it also shows something that is actually possible in the game.

Heck, even look at the Venus live action trailer for Destiny. It perfectly captures the tone of how people play the game and doesn’t show a bunch of stuff we literally can’t do as players.

I’m with Cruel here. It’s not a huge deal, but it can be bummer to see Guardians in cutscenes pulling off a bunch of cool moves that we can’t, especially when Destiny 2 already made Guardians feel less powerful than they did in D1 in many instances. It’s like they know Guardians are supppsed to be amazing, but they use cutscenes to show us instead of actually letting us do it.

I’ll disagree that this cutscene does that for me, just because that kick looks dumb and using a knife to stop a fall like that has basically become a lame cliche—nothing about that scene said badass to me, but there’s no accounting for taste, so my feelings on the trailer don’t really come into play. I still feel what Cruel is talking about.

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I still think the promotion leading up to Halo 3 was the best I've ever seen, but that video still gets me excited and fuels my mancrush for MC.

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Look at the Halo 3 Starry Night commercial for the difference.

Sure, it’s short, but we see Master Chief being a badass, but he uses the bubble shield which we can totally do, and then he just attacks a bunch of enemies. The spirit of showing cool stuff in a stylized way is there, but it also shows something that is actually possible in the game.

Heck, even look at the Venus live action trailer for Destiny. It perfectly captures the tone of how people play the game and doesn’t show a bunch of stuff we literally can’t do as players.

I’m with Cruel here. It’s not a huge deal, but it can be bummer to see Guardians in cutscenes pulling off a bunch of cool moves that we can’t, especially when Destiny 2 already made Guardians feel less powerful than they did in D1 in many instances. It’s like they know Guardians are supppsed to be amazing, but they use cutscenes to show us instead of actually letting us do it.

I’ll disagree that this cutscene does that for me, just because that kick looks dumb and using a knife to stop a fall like that has basically become a lame cliche—nothing about that scene said badass to me, but there’s no accounting for taste, so my feelings on the trailer don’t really come into play. I still feel what Cruel is talking about.

I was going to point out that trailer and talk about how we can't sprint as ole Master Chief in the Bungie halos....

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I was going to point out that trailer and talk about how we can't sprint as ole Master Chief in the Bungie halos....

Sure you can. Push the thumb stick all the way forward. That’s Master Chief’s sprint speed.

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I was going to point out that trailer and talk about how we can't sprint as ole Master Chief in the Bungie halos....

Sure you can. Push the thumb stick all the way forward. That’s Master Chief’s sprint speed.

He's like, twice as fast as Usain Bolt if the waypoint distance markers are accurate.

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No. It's nowhere close to false advertising. You have got to be reasonable. And making that claim when each of those videos proceeded an hour's worth of showing the game as it is... is just not intellectually supportable.

Yes, it is supportable. First, you’re making the giant false assumption that this cutscene is only being viewed within the context of the live-stream. But that’s patently untrue. It exists on YouTube as a stand-alone piece of marketing. Plus, nobody HERE is going to be fooled or misled by it. We know the game. My “false advertising” statement kicks in when this trailer is viewed by those who aren’t already familiar with how Destiny plays.

When any developer creates any form of marketing to promote their game, potential customers look to that content to give them an idea about the kind of game they’re going to play. If I see a guardian doing all sorts of cool stuff that makes me say “that’s awesome, and it looks like it would be a lot of fun to do!”, then I pick up the controller and find that my guardian can’t do those things at all, that is misleading advertising.

Even if we take the perspective of “advertising” away (since this Warmind piece appears to be an in-game cutscene that is being used for marketing), it’s still creating a frustrating and disappointing contrast where I sit there with the controller in my hands wishing I could do the cool things I just saw on screen.

There’s another layer to this, which I’ll get to below.

Beyond that... come on! Live a little, man! Let your imagination out of that dark, cold cellar you've apparently stuffed it in. If all you can think about is the things you can't do when watching the single best Destiny cutscene ever then... well... the words I'm searching for I can't say because Destiny is rated T for Teen. :/

“Live a little”? Really dude? What exactly am I supposed to have a lively relationship with here? The masterful dramatic narrative that is the Destiny universe? [Taeko 3 voice] Real talk [/Taeko 3 voice], I have a great imagination... but I’m not going to use it to prop up bad writing and poor storytelling in a franchise that I don’t trust to ever deliver a fiction-based payoff. I play Destiny for the gameplay, the eye candy, and to have fun with my friends. Bungie’s work over the past 3 years has trained me to expect that, and nothing more. I go into a Destiny cutscene with such low expectations (since I don’t care about the story), the least I can expect is some level of thought towards vaguely consistent world building. And that extends to the things guardians can do in the Destiny world.

I get why the cutscene writer(s) include such moments. They look cool, and it makes sense for Guardians to be able to do such things. That right there is the ultimate point of contention for me. We’re seeing guardians do cool things that they obviously should be able to do in cutscenes, but for some reason we can’t do it in-game.

Also, I’ve gotta call you out (in a friendly way) on saying “the best Destiny cutscene ever” as if that holds any weight. I don’t say that as a criticism of the work done by the people who create the cutscenes, it’s just that Destiny’s story is such a lost cause at this point. Even when we have a very cool cutscene, like the one about Zavala, it’s about freaking Zavala; a character too lame and dull and uninteresting to care about. Or that Curse of Osiris prologue, which I thought was very cool. How well did that pay off? ;)

Are there real examples that do go too far beyond what a game actually offers? Sure. But neither of your examples are them.

Counterpoint; the examples I mentioned are particularly annoying precisely because they’re relatively minor actions. Watching 117 fly out of the air lock and fall towards the Covenant ship? That was awesome, and didn’t bother me in the least. It made sense to show that moment, rather than play it. My suspension of disbelief was stretched a little, but it was worth it to deliver such a powerful moment.

Back to the Destiny examples, they’re not big grand actions that serve better as spectacle, thus justify a cutscene in place of gameplay. They’re small actions that make sense within the context of the game world, and look fun as hell. And personally, I feel their absence acutely. Every time I play Destiny, I feel like I should be able to do those kinds of things. They’re actions that so clearly fit, the writers have Guardians do it in cutscenes.

Throughout all this, please understand that I don’t think any of this is a big deal. I used the phrase “pet peeve” intentionally. It annoys me a bit, that’s all.

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In a big fictional world there will always be more things that can happen fictionally than can be done in gameplay. You bring up Halo. In Halo’s world, massive battles involving space warships are routine. The Forerunner vs. the Flood. Humanity vs. The Covenant. Etc. Yet, we never have and almost certainly never will command a starship in Halo. Whatever Spartan we play will likely also not go to a strategy conference. We probably won’t get an in-game weight training sequence. We probably won’t stand before some UNSC board of officers while they discuss whether we should be awarded or court marshaled.

I personally think that being able to talk about or show characters doing things, sometimes really cool awesome things, even though they aren’t in the game helps build the world. To limit it to just things the player can mash a button to do puts too many limits on how cool a world can be. In a lot of ways, it’s the cutscenes or lore or books that are the best, most perfect, most real version of a game. Because they don’t have the limits of things like keeping the gameplay flowing or fitting in an infinite amount of actions into a 20-ish button controller.

By and large I appreciate cutscenes like this Warmind one or Zavala’s history of The City because they acknowledge that they is potential beyond the game. I think there must be some level of inconsistency that would annoy me, but not something so simple as these two examples which are merely and logically expanding on the way the world would work if budgets and gameplay considerations didn’t exist.

If something does annoy me in Destiny cutscenes, it’s when characters don’t act properly. For instance, when Zavala walks then runs straight up to that large Cabal and tries to take away its gun before getting smacked down onto his back. THAT, for me, was inconsistent. THAT was immersion breaking because there is no way the player would even want to play that badly. There were so many better ways to pin down a ton end Titan to achieve the story beat of him needing to be saved than have him engage in stupid melee combat vs a bunch of gun wielding enemies. (Plus, even his stealing away the gun was visually pretty clunky...)

Back to “false advertising.” I still am entirely against you labeling things that. Could maybe someone temporarily be confused about what’s possible? Sure. But there is plenty of demonstrations showing what the game actually is about. I think any accusations of false advertising has to consider intent. Did Bungie try and trick people? That’s clearly a no. And for me, that’s the end of it. It’s fine to say it could be a little confusing for a new player or something. But it is absolutely not ok to start throwing around terms like “false advertising.” It is bad terminology and it implies bad intent which I firmly believe is not there. These cutscenes are animators having fun with the world of Destiny in a consistent, realistic manner. Nobody is trying to deceive or be sneaky about any of it.

Finally, I simply cannot understand your thinking on the Zavala cutscene. That cutscene is legitimately great, all the way through. It establishes setting. It establishes motive. It has awesome combat. It touches on history and mystery in the universe. It shows parts of the lore we hadn’t seen before. If all of Destiny was as good as that cutscene we’d all have very few complaints. But instead of acknowledging that, you choose to view it as not worth the time because the rest is a “lost cause.” And genuinely upsets me.

I’d never ask you to say something bad is good. I do ask that you acknowledge when something is actually good. And on the Zavala cutscene you are failing at that.

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If something does annoy me in Destiny cutscenes, it’s when characters don’t act properly. For instance, when Zavala walks then runs straight up to that large Cabal and tries to take away its gun before getting smacked down onto his back. THAT, for me, was inconsistent. THAT was immersion breaking because there is no way the player would even want to play that badly. There were so many better ways to pin down a ton end Titan to achieve the story beat of him needing to be saved than have him engage in stupid melee combat vs a bunch of gun wielding enemies. (Plus, even his stealing away the gun was visually pretty clunky...)

Wait, you mean like players do in actual gameplay all the time? That scene was totally consistent with how actual players as Guardians play the game (other than trying to steal the gun, of course).

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If all of Destiny was as good as that cutscene we’d all have very few complaints.

This is exactly my point. The problem is that it isn’t. Everything that trailer did well the game doesn’t do at all. The marketing should be the taste and the game the meal. And the meal should satisfy you.

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Bungie, please... stop teasing us by showing guardians doing awesome things in trailers if we aren’t going to be able to do it in-game. Zavala’s backstory piece was cool and all, but all I could think while watching it was “combat in Destiny is nothing like this”. Now we’ve got a guardian doing a spinning split kick and using her knife to climb an ice wall.

At best, it breaks any immersion do to the sheer contrast with actual gameplay. Worst case scenario, it kinda borders on false advertising.

I don't share the specifics, but I do share the sentiment somewhat. For me the issue isn't that it shows things you can't do. The issue is that the world feels more real and alive in the marketing than it does in the game.

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Bungie, please... stop teasing us by showing guardians doing awesome things in trailers if we aren’t going to be able to do it in-game. Zavala’s backstory piece was cool and all, but all I could think while watching it was “combat in Destiny is nothing like this”. Now we’ve got a guardian doing a spinning split kick and using her knife to climb an ice wall.

At best, it breaks any immersion do to the sheer contrast with actual gameplay. Worst case scenario, it kinda borders on false advertising.

I don't share the specifics, but I do share the sentiment somewhat. For me the issue isn't that it shows things you can't do. The issue is that the world feels more real and alive in the marketing than it does in the game.

I think you've making a valid point. Whatever the differences between what actions are shown in the cutscene and what are possible in gameplay, those differences seem less important when the worlds presented seem to be the same.

Cutscenes have almost always shown things that weren't feasible in gameplay. What I've disliked more is when games use cutscenes for sequences that could have been gameplay (343 has been guilty of this).

Speaking to your point about the game feeling alive and real, Cody, I think there are people here like Xenos and Raga who have absorbed the lore to such an extent that, for them, the experience in the game world is substantially more alive and real than it is for others. They're more imaginatively engaged.

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Speaking to your point about the game feeling alive and real, Cody, I think there are people here like Xenos and Raga who have absorbed the lore to such an extent that, for them, the experience in the game world is substantially more alive and real than it is for others. They're more imaginatively engaged.

That’s definitely true, and it’s awesome that they can engage like that. I point to that as a failure of the game to make people care enough to engage, rather than a failure of the players to use their imagination.

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Speaking to your point about the game feeling alive and real, Cody, I think there are people here like Xenos and Raga who have absorbed the lore to such an extent that, for them, the experience in the game world is substantially more alive and real than it is for others. They're more imaginatively engaged.

That’s definitely true, and it’s awesome that they can engage like that. I point to that as a failure of the game to make people care enough to engage, rather than a failure of the players to use their imagination.

I didn't point on purpose. :)

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Speaking to your point about the game feeling alive and real, Cody, I think there are people here like Xenos and Raga who have absorbed the lore to such an extent that, for them, the experience in the game world is substantially more alive and real than it is for others. They're more imaginatively engaged.

That’s definitely true, and it’s awesome that they can engage like that. I point to that as a failure of the game to make people care enough to engage, rather than a failure of the players to use their imagination.

I didn't point on purpose. :)

It’s interesting the way different people are able to engage with games on different levels. I often wish I could get invested in Destiny’s lore, because as you point out, I’m sure I’d enjoy aspects of the game more. I just can’t seem to get into the lore if the primary narrative doesn’t grab me. I’m playing God of War right now, and I’m just down and absorbing every piece of lore I can find. It’s wonderfully delivered, inherently fascinating, and it pays off through the narrative. But I’m not sure if I’d be invested on that level if I wasn’t already invested in the primary characters and plot.

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But I’m not sure if I’d be invested on that level if I wasn’t already invested in the primary characters and plot.

That’s certainly part of it.

Part of it is also the way Destiny is structured. I can only go into the same cave so many times before it just stops being a gorgeous cave the Fallen are in and starts just being a different hallway the Fallen are in that’s just like every other hallway the Fallen are in. Part of that is on me fur just not paying attention, sure, but part of it is on the game for making me feel like I need to collect tokens as quickly as possible to move on to the next thing.

I started D2 on Xbox last week before God of War cane out, and I did a Lost Sector in the EDZ. You go into a cave with Fallen, and you emerge into this clearing with a domed building in it, and the sunlight is beaming in through an opening in the ceiling and it’s gorgeous. I had to stop and stare it at, and walk around it, and look at the map and tried to think about what was above and where that building used to be. I’ve probably been in that cave a dozen times before, but this was the first time I’d really noticed what it was. Maybe that’s not the game’s fault, but I think it partly is, because the only reason anyone goes in that cave anyway is to get the loot chest at the end of it, and the game is inherently built around loot and collecting those tokens. I don’t think the game is paced appropriately to give those spaces and moments the time to sink in.

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I started D2 on Xbox last week before God of War cane out, and I did a Lost Sector in the EDZ. You go into a cave with Fallen, and you emerge into this clearing with a domed building in it, and the sunlight is beaming in through an opening in the ceiling and it’s gorgeous. I had to stop and stare it at, and walk around it, and look at the map and tried to think about what was above and where that building used to be. I’ve probably been in that cave a dozen times before, but this was the first time I’d really noticed what it was. Maybe that’s not the game’s fault, but I think it partly is, because the only reason anyone goes in that cave anyway is to get the loot chest at the end of it, and the game is inherently built around loot and collecting those tokens. I don’t think the game is paced appropriately to give those spaces and moments the time to sink in.

Raga's next prompt:

Take a screenshot of a space in Destiny or Destiny 2, and write a backstory for/about it.

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Now we’ve got a guardian doing a spinning split kick and using her knife to climb an ice wall.

At best, it breaks any immersion do to the sheer contrast with actual gameplay. Worst case scenario, it kinda borders on false advertising.

What's even more silly, is she just jumped down to get to the lower ice level... then she gets swung up, then slides down to almost the same ice level again; stopping her slide with her knife.

But instead of just dropping down and going AROUND the shard sticking out of the ground, she climbs all the way to the top... just to jump down... again? O.o

This makes ZERO sense to me. It's not a very well thought out sequence of events to showcase the new character. :/

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I agree, it doesn't make much sense. However, it is exactly what I usually do when playing. Go around a rock? What are you doing in your life with all this effort you're saving?

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Now we’ve got a guardian doing a spinning split kick and using her knife to climb an ice wall.

At best, it breaks any immersion do to the sheer contrast with actual gameplay. Worst case scenario, it kinda borders on false advertising.

What's even more silly, is she just jumped down to get to the lower ice level... then she gets swung up, then slides down to almost the same ice level again; stopping her slide with her knife.

But instead of just dropping down and going AROUND the shard sticking out of the ground, she climbs all the way to the top... just to jump down... again? O.o

This makes ZERO sense to me. It's not a very well thought out sequence of events to showcase the new character. :/

As best as I can tell, she:

1. Started high and scanned the surrounding area
2. Jumped down and headed towards the Clovis Bray / Warmind facility
3. A hatch / launch door beneath her opened raising her up and she slid down its side
4. She stopped herself with her knife then climbed back to the top of that now fully raised launch door.

Doesn't the trailer end with an ominous shadow getting cast on her while she is still at the top of that launch door?

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Just to spite Blackstar

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Just to spite Blackstar

I will take back every bad thing I've ever said about Destiny if she's our planetary vendor and she's just standing on that fucking ice spire the entire time. That'd be hilarious.

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For whatever reason, this reminded me of Jillybean's excellent story back in the day that was inspired by this concept art. I've looked and looked and cannot find it.

Dammit. I went looking, and ended up here. (My son, trying the cinnamon challenge.) Kermit, you're a bad person. I can't stop laughing, and my stomach hurts.

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For whatever reason, this reminded me of Jillybean's excellent story back in the day that was inspired by this concept art. I've looked and looked and cannot find it.

Dammit. I went looking, and ended up here. (My son, trying the cinnamon challenge.) Kermit, you're a bad person. I can't stop laughing, and my stomach hurts.

I secretly hoped you would find it for me. Now I can't stop laughing either. (I recognize that deck :))

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Can't it just be that? Sheeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeesh.

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For me, there’s a bunch of cool stuff packed in:

- Will we hear more about how Guardians aren’t supposed to investigate their past.
- Ana’s full name being Anastasia. I hope we learn more about her and more how she even found out who she was.
- There’s a Hive army, including Tombships?!, trapped under the ice. How did that happen? Did the Traveler freeze them? Or Rasputin / Clovis Bray?
- It was confirmed that those are Warsats crashing from the skies. You can even see one not crash but hit in the distance and skip across the ground/skybox in the gameplay Bungie showed. Are they crashing deliberately? Are they helping thaw the ice?
- It appears what Ana climbs is a launch door for something. Could in be some awesome Human ship or a badass doomsday device? Or maybe it’s a Hive ship.

So yeah, character implications, implications on what happened during the collapse, and possibly big implications about the future of the fight for our solar system.

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Knowing Bungie, and their track record over the past four years, I already know all of the answers to your questions.

- Will we hear more about how Guardians aren’t supposed to investigate their past.

Nope. It'll be a throwaway line that has little do do with what happens in the DLC.
(See: Osiris getting exiled)

- Ana’s full name being Anastasia. I hope we learn more about her and more how she even found out who she was.

We'll talk to Lakshmi to get some quick backstory on Ana Bray, and she'll probably say it during the first direct interaction with her, then it'll never be brought up again. (See: Eris, Petra Venj, and anyone with a remotely interesting backstory).

- There’s a Hive army, including Tombships?!, trapped under the ice. How did that happen? Did the Traveler freeze them? Or Rasputin / Clovis Bray?

No explanation as to exactly how, just that X did it as "a last resort" to stop Y threat. Probably through radio chatter with Ghost. (See: SIVA, Skolas' escape and the Wolves rebellion)

- It was confirmed that those are Warsats crashing from the skies. You can even see one not crash but hit in the distance and skip across the ground/skybox in the gameplay Bungie showed. Are they crashing deliberately? Are they helping thaw the ice?

Yes, Rasputin is crashing them deliberately, as he always has. Except this time, it's because something vague is wrong, and we are being sent to investigate the mysterious circumstances (See: Every other DLC)

- It appears what Ana climbs is a launch door for something. Could in be some awesome Human ship or a badass doomsday device? Or maybe it’s a Hive ship.

Probably just Rasputin-related tech, which will be an alternate path to the Warmind (through Hive tunnels, no doubt). Expect the story missions to take place underground. (See: Rise of Iron, CoO)

So yeah, character implications, implications on what happened during the collapse, and possibly big implications about the future of the fight for our solar system.

Nah, just monster-of-the-week stuff involving Rasputin, a reskinned Hive, and possibly a fight against corrupted machines (SIVA-related business?). Calus is the focus of the main story moving forward, so I don't see them tying Rasputin to him for anything significant leading up to the September DLC. (See: Anything non-Hive-related in the past four years.)

Let's see how much of this holds up come launch day!

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Ok. If there’s no reason for me to speculate or hope then I won’t.

Goodbye.

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Ok. If there’s no reason for me to speculate or hope then I won’t.

Goodbye.

Speculation can be dangerous.

“Rey is Luke’s Daughter! Or a Kenobi”
Rey’s parents turn out to be random nobodies.
“Man! FUCK THE LAST JEDI!” NERD RAGE

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Ok. If there’s no reason for me to speculate or hope then I won’t.

Goodbye.

Speculation can be dangerous.

“Rey is Luke’s Daughter! Or a Kenobi”
Rey’s parents turn out to be random nobodies.
“Man! FUCK THE LAST JEDI!” NERD RAGE

Or you could speculate but skip the nerd rage step.

Go back and read the early days of the HBO forum. (BBO forum, I guess.) Search for 'crack pipe' for speculation posts.

There were so many out-there ideas, most of which had nothing whatsoever to do with reality - but it didn't matter, because it was fun. And because the game we got in the end, while not the ridiculously complicated, intricate game we had envisioned for a couple of years, was still fun.

Destiny is still fun. (For me.) If it's not fun for you, then sure, watching cool cutscenes that you KNOW aren't going to pan out the way they seem might be frustrating... but really, if you're so down on the game that the cutscenes make you angry, why are you even watching them?

This whole conversation is silly. There are people who in one breath say "this doesn't really bother me, it's a tiny pet peeve" and in the next breath (or dammit, even in the same sentence) say "Destiny's story is so disappointing that I expect NOTHING from it any more."

Well, fuck, if I felt that way, I'd walk away. Really. So all this discussion is silly - either the disconnect between what you can see and what you can do is minor, in which case this thread has gone on about 10,000% longer than it has any right to, or you really are pissed at Bungie for the disappointments, in which case you probably shouldn't be here at all. (If you hate the narrative, then WAIT UNTIL THE NARRATIVE IS OUT BEFORE YOU JUDGE THE NEXT PIECE. You're making yourself (and everyone around you) angry about something you really don't know about yet.)

I'm pretty damned disappointed in this whole thread. Raga wants to enjoy what he saw, and even wants to explain to people WHY he enjoyed what he saw. And pretty much everyone else is shitting on him for it.

I have enough bullshit in my life right now. I'll be back after the 8th. See you guys.

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Destiny is still fun. (For me.) If it's not fun for you, then sure, watching cool cutscenes that you KNOW aren't going to pan out the way they seem might be frustrating... but really, if you're so down on the game that the cutscenes make you angry, why are you even watching them?

I haven't seen anyone here voice the opinion that a cutscene makes them angry. I personally have said I find certain elements "annoying" or that they break my immersion. I don't know where this idea of anger is coming from.

This whole conversation is silly. There are people who in one breath say "this doesn't really bother me, it's a tiny pet peeve" and in the next breath (or dammit, even in the same sentence) say "Destiny's story is so disappointing that I expect NOTHING from it any more."

Well, fuck, if I felt that way, I'd walk away. Really.

Claude, you're skipping the part where I said "I play Destiny for the gameplay, the eye candy, and to have fun with friends". I do enjoy Destiny. A lot. There is a certain aspect of the game that doesn't do anything for me, and I voice that opinion. I don't crap on anyone who does enjoy that aspect.

So all this discussion is silly - either the disconnect between what you can see and what you can do is minor, in which case this thread has gone on about 10,000% longer than it has any right to, or you really are pissed at Bungie for the disappointments, in which case you probably shouldn't be here at all. (If you hate the narrative, then WAIT UNTIL THE NARRATIVE IS OUT BEFORE YOU JUDGE THE NEXT PIECE. You're making yourself (and everyone around you) angry about something you really don't know about yet.)

I'm pretty damned disappointed in this whole thread. Raga wants to enjoy what he saw, and even wants to explain to people WHY he enjoyed what he saw. And pretty much everyone else is shitting on him for it.

I need to lovingly and respectfully call BS on this point. Raga didn't start this particular line of discussion, I did. I expressed an opinion. Raga chose to jump in and share his disagreement with my opinion. It's been a voluntary back and forth the whole way down, and not once have I seen anyone "shitting on Raga" for his opinions or enjoying the things he enjoys.

This is exactly the sort of reaction that I have tried to point out in the past. Somebody makes an honest and respectful criticism, sharing their personal thoughts on something Destiny related, others disagree, but inevitably the discussion shifts over to what is "wrong" with the people making the criticisms. Even Raga's initial response to my post included the assertion that I'm not using my imagination the way I should be (ie, I am doing something wrong). Which is totally fair game, and I'm happy to have that discussion in a friendly and respectful way. What I take issue with is the assertion that Raga is somehow being piled up on or attacked for his views.

So honest question time:

What exactly about this thread is so aggravating? I don't see anyone being rude or disrespectful to each other. I see a range of opinions, both positive and negative and everywhere in between. I see good points being made all around. However, I do also see some defensiveness. I totally get that people like to be excited about things... I'm no different. But I'm also of the opinion that people should be able to disagree on things (especially things as superficial as what they like or dislike about a videogame) without getting all worked up about it. For crying out loud, all I did was say that I'm not a fan of this little trend that I see in some trailers, and I find it a little annoying. And because I never like to say anything critical without showing my reasoning, I went into my thoughts with some greater detail. Is that really all it takes to get people upset? Is DBO supposed to be some kind of "safe space" for fanboys who don't ever want to read anything they disagree with when it comes to this videogame?

Maybe the answer to that last question is "yes", and that's fine. If that's the case, I've just had the wrong idea about this forum. I want to believe that if that were the case, somebody would just step out and say it plainly, instead of accusing people who are sharing their thoughts about the game of shitting on another forum member. That's not cool, as I see it. We banged opposing ideas together. That's all.

Either way, I'm out <3

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I believe Claude was MOSTLY talking about this subthread. ManKitten and Raga posted about being excited, Raga laid down some specific things he's interested in without addressing anything about the other part of the thread and then his subthread was taken over by someone literally pointing out the "problems" in everything that he listed he was excited about and people agreeing with him.

People are 100% welcome to express their opinion, but it does feel counterproductive to throw cold water on someone's hype for no reason.

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I believe Claude was MOSTLY talking about this subthread. ManKitten and Raga posted about being excited, Raga laid down some specific things he's interested in without addressing anything about the other part of the thread and then his subthread was taken over by someone literally pointing out the "problems" in everything that he listed he was excited about and people agreeing with him.

People are 100% welcome to express their opinion, but it does feel counterproductive to throw cold water on someone's hype for no reason.

It's not the disagreement, it's the pervasive cynicism. There's a few active voices who, like clockwork, must respond to enthusiasm by tamping it down.

It's exhausting and damaging to the esprit de corps.

I cried watching this earlier:

Why did I? I was moved by the humanity on display. Is there any creative endeavor today with higher stakes or more fraught with stress that AAA game development? I think not. Hats off to these people at Bungie and 343 and elsewhere who are trying to move the art form forward while earning a living and maybe having a life, too.

I don't know how to phrase exactly what I want to say. Passion and compassion are in short supply. Hopefulness. Admiration. These elements felt baked in the cake at one time. Now they stand out.

There are many factors. D2 not being as "sticky." There are many more games to play and distractions than there were in 2001. I get bummed, too. I wish I had more time to play. I wish it didn't feel like pulling teeth to get a raid team together.

I don't blame anyone for not loving D2. And I wish the reactions and reactions to reactions in this subthread didn't play out how they did, but I can certainly sympathize. I'm tired. If you're angry, pissed, or feel blamed for something, take a break. Count to 10. Count to 10,000. Remember what you what like about Bungie, D1 or D2, the people in the community. Don't do anything rash like quit the clan.

We've got an expansion to look forward to. Soon™.

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I cried watching this earlier:

Why did I? I was moved by the humanity on display. Is there any creative endeavor today with higher stakes or more fraught with stress that AAA game development? I think not. Hats off to these people at Bungie and 343 and elsewhere who are trying to move the art form forward while earning a living and maybe having a life, too.

But this does not automatically garner admiration. I mean sure, to make a game of any sort is an accomplishment. But if you don't measure up… you should be okay with the resulting criticism. One should focus on the result, not so much the process. It doesn't matter how hard you worked if what you produced was no good. If that's not something you can accept, then the field isn't really for you.

Criticism is not an attack on your person… unless you are doing evil things like designing systems to purposely waste people's time.

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Either way, I'm out <3

Didn't we cover all of this stuff in the Criticism thread?

Remember all of that stuff where I explained how snowflakey some folks are around here sometimes?
Well, it's obviously on both sides of the debate, Cruel. Sure, folks get defensive, but you can't get offended by the fact that others take their side, too, and act upon that in their own way, especially if you're of the mindset where something that people are enjoying is not enjoyable to you.

The forum is certainly not a college campus safe space (as much as some defensiveness-prone folks would like it to be). If it was, I'd have been banned long ago (you can't kill me, Xenos).

I think it's fine if Claude wants to take a break, and if you want to take your ball and stomp away as well, that's fine. But don't act like anyone's trying to silence your opinion. You're coming across as butthurt as the defensive folks. All triggered by a dang pre-rendered teaser.
Everyone around here should take some time to chill out.

You really need to...

(Hey, maybe you can take a break by playing some Dead Space 2!)

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I dunno about all that.

I think it’s a real bummer to see what appeared to me to be a totally respectful thread and discussion met with “this thread sucks, I’m leaving.” I guess my perspective of cynicism and negativity is just wildly different from everyone else’s, if this is the thread that broke the camel’s back.

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I dunno about all that.

I think it’s a real bummer to see what appeared to me to be a totally respectful thread and discussion met with “this thread sucks, I’m leaving.” I guess my perspective of cynicism and negativity is just wildly different from everyone else’s, if this is the thread that broke the camel’s back.

I mean, yeah, that's how I took it all as well. Even Raga's huff and pout about not being excited just seemed to be borne out of frustration than a reaction to any group of people piling on him for it.

Like I said (or tried to say), I feel like Claude and Cruel both overreacted, but if that's what they need to cool off, it's whatever. My post was about overreaction. The thread was civil otherwise (and my post in reply to Ragas wasn't to tell him to stop being excited, just how I believed the game would address every one of his questions, based on the past four years of Bungie answering everything the same way, which isn't necessarily negative).

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my post in reply to Ragas wasn't to tell him to stop being excited, just how I believed the game would address every one of his questions, based on the past four years of Bungie answering everything the same way, which isn't necessarily negative).

Heh, I get it. You didn't inhale.

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What exactly about this thread is so aggravating?

For me, it’s this part:

Also, I’ve gotta call you out (in a friendly way) on saying “the best Destiny cutscene ever” as if that holds any weight. I don’t say that as a criticism of the work done by the people who create the cutscenes, it’s just that Destiny’s story is such a lost cause at this point. Even when we have a very cool cutscene, like the one about Zavala, it’s about freaking Zavala; a character too lame and dull and uninteresting to care about.

For me, the Zavala cutscene is the best Destiny cutscene ever because it is what every single piece of Destiny should be like. Yes, it is unfortunately, tragic and disgusting really, that its one of the few standouts, but hating on it like you did here and have done in the past says to me that you are completely unwilling to give any piece of Destiny’s story a chance no matter what happens and no matter how good it is. And THAT is unacceptable on a fan forum. At least to me.

Really, it comes down to this:

If you shit on even the good bits because of things that happened in the past, then what the hell is the point of Bungie even trying to do better?

I think you need to temper your disappointment with hope more than you do. You need to point out the bad, but not at the expense of the truly great. And you need to drop phrases like “lost cause” because nothing is ever a lost cause. No one is saying you have to reset your expectations each expansion and game. But I think we are saying that coming at this from a “it’s a lost cause and I don’t and won’t care at all” perspective is not good for posting at some place like DBO.

And remember, this is coming from someone who went on record last week (in the Starside Lounge) with significant concerns that the story will not do justice to Rasputin and the many connections he has literally all throughout the 1st & 2nd game and the Grimoire and Lore in each. I’m not here defending Destiny’s story as a whole by any means. There’s a lot of areas where Destiny doesn’t live up to what I wish it was. A whole lot of them, really. But there is one small part that I truly love and that I really do believe is both the best thing in Destiny and what I wish all of Destiny was like. And to see you state in what appears to be a closed minded fashion that you didn’t like it and that dislike had nothing to do with its quality... yeah, that’s aggravating, to say the least. :(

As for Claude complaining about people shitting on me? I think he’s right, at least in part. Korny’s post going line by line in a completely negative fashion when I was just discussing the trailer separate from everything else? I see it as an asshole/troll-y move. And then you +1-ed it without comment and without qualification. I did not like that at all. Not one bit. From either of you. It made me feel like you two won’t allow me to say anything good... at you know... Destiny.Bungie.Org. :/

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I’m not saying that you can’t, or shouldn’t. I’m not judging you or your reactions to the trailer at all. I’m just showing my agreement with Korny’s assessment. I am not, nor will I ever, put someone down for liking or enjoying something that I don’t like myself. This is a forum for people to discuss their thoughts and opinions on a game we all care about. We’re not all going to agree on everything all the time.

All Korny did was say “I think your questions will be answered like this, and here’s why”, and then he showed his reasoning. He even ended by saying “let’s see how it turns out!”. There’s no reason to get defensive about any of this.

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Knowing Bungie, and their track record over the past four years, I already know all of the answers to your questions.

Wrong. Clearly, you did not.

- Will we hear more about how Guardians aren’t supposed to investigate their past.

Nope. It'll be a throwaway line that has little do do with what happens in the DLC.
(See: Osiris getting exiled)

Well... it wasn’t heavily touched upon, but it also wasn’t a throwaway line either. Ana investigating her past looks like it will have consequences of which we don’t know the full extent of yet.

- Ana’s full name being Anastasia. I hope we learn more about her and more how she even found out who she was.

We'll talk to Lakshmi to get some quick backstory on Ana Bray, and she'll probably say it during the first direct interaction with her, then it'll never be brought up again. (See: Eris, Petra Venj, and anyone with a remotely interesting backstory).

Wrong. Instead, it looks like we’ll be getting a few if not several lore packets detailing what Ana did before the collapse. The first one I’ve gotten talks a little about how it was Ana who programmed Rasputin how to speak / use language to understand.

- There’s a Hive army, including Tombships?!, trapped under the ice. How did that happen? Did the Traveler freeze them? Or Rasputin / Clovis Bray?

No explanation as to exactly how, just that X did it as "a last resort" to stop Y threat. Probably through radio chatter with Ghost. (See: SIVA, Skolas' escape and the Wolves rebellion)

There hasn’t been a lot yet. As always, I hope for more. And, since I’m not even close to being out of lore to find I can’t yet rule out the freezing won’t be something revealed in time.

- It was confirmed that those are Warsats crashing from the skies. You can even see one not crash but hit in the distance and skip across the ground/skybox in the gameplay Bungie showed. Are they crashing deliberately? Are they helping thaw the ice?

Yes, Rasputin is crashing them deliberately, as he always has. Except this time, it's because something vague is wrong, and we are being sent to investigate the mysterious circumstances (See: Every other DLC)

Wrong. Rasputin and Ana reveal why Warsats have been crashing since Destiny 1. As Rasputin has been waking up, he has been crashing old Warsats and replacing them with new ones that only he has control of. He said he is doing so to protect humanity, but reading between the lores paints his actions as far far more self serving than he let on when he spoke to us.

- It appears what Ana climbs is a launch door for something. Could in be some awesome Human ship or a badass doomsday device? Or maybe it’s a Hive ship.

Probably just Rasputin-related tech, which will be an alternate path to the Warmind (through Hive tunnels, no doubt). Expect the story missions to take place underground. (See: Rise of Iron, CoO)

Wrong. What we were actually seeing was Xol rise up in front of Ana. And while a couple of missions did in fact take place underground, other missions took place high up in the Clovis Bray facility and on the surface of Mars.

So yeah, character implications, implications on what happened during the collapse, and possibly big implications about the future of the fight for our solar system.

Nah, just monster-of-the-week stuff involving Rasputin, a reskinned Hive, and possibly a fight against corrupted machines (SIVA-related business?). Calus is the focus of the main story moving forward, so I don't see them tying Rasputin to him for anything significant leading up to the September DLC. (See: Anything non-Hive-related in the past four years.)

Wrong. Rasputin is beginning to (attempt to) reassert his control over the solar system. He appears to have massive automated manufacturing and launch capabilities. There’s no way this won’t have significant implications going forward.

That said, Xol did feel a bit monster of the week. Really, I was hoping Rasputin would launch an orbital strike on Xol... or at least land a Warsat on it.

Let's see how much of this holds up come launch day!

You were about 2 for 7. Better luck next time.

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I didn't watch the Ana Bray video because I don't want to be spoiled, but I'm looking forward to seeing it!

For me, there’s a bunch of cool stuff packed in:

- Will we hear more about how Guardians aren’t supposed to investigate their past.

I've always wondered about that as well as the Exo's.

- Ana’s full name being Anastasia. I hope we learn more about her and more how she even found out who she was.
- There’s a Hive army, including Tombships?!, trapped under the ice. How did that happen? Did the Traveler freeze them? Or Rasputin / Clovis Bray?

I'm sure this will be brought up. I'm wondering if the hive did it on purpose? maybe they were waiting to pop out in the future sometime when called upon? Maybe we accidentally "YOU"VE WOKEN THE HIVE!!" It would be funny if there is an ode back to that moment :D

- It was confirmed that those are Warsats crashing from the skies. You can even see one not crash but hit in the distance and skip across the ground/skybox in the gameplay Bungie showed. Are they crashing deliberately? Are they helping thaw the ice?

Maybe Something happens to Rasputin such that he loses control of them? That might sets off a chain reaction that thaws the ice and wakes the hive?

- It appears what Ana climbs is a launch door for something. Could in be some awesome Human ship or a badass doomsday device? Or maybe it’s a Hive ship.

Oh! The possibilities!

So yeah, character implications, implications on what happened during the collapse, and possibly big implications about the future of the fight for our solar system.

We shall see! so close yet so far away!

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For me, there’s a bunch of cool stuff packed in:

- Will we hear more about how Guardians aren’t supposed to investigate their past.
- Ana’s full name being Anastasia. I hope we learn more about her and more how she even found out who she was.
- There’s a Hive army, including Tombships?!, trapped under the ice. How did that happen? Did the Traveler freeze them? Or Rasputin / Clovis Bray?
- It was confirmed that those are Warsats crashing from the skies. You can even see one not crash but hit in the distance and skip across the ground/skybox in the gameplay Bungie showed. Are they crashing deliberately? Are they helping thaw the ice?
- It appears what Ana climbs is a launch door for something. Could in be some awesome Human ship or a badass doomsday device? Or maybe it’s a Hive ship.

So yeah, character implications, implications on what happened during the collapse, and possibly big implications about the future of the fight for our solar system.

I'm actually pretty interested just in why the Hive are on Mars in general. They've obviously been there awhile (what with the whole frozen in ice thing) so are they even connected to a Hive leader we know?

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I'm actually pretty interested just in why the Hive are on Mars in general. They've obviously been there awhile (what with the whole frozen in ice thing) so are they even connected to a Hive leader we know?

I envision Raga diving into a giant pool of lore books, like Scrooge McDuck does his money, whenever a question like this is asked.

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- Ana’s full name being Anastasia.

Anastasia Bray sounds a lot like Anastasia Grey… 50 Shades of Red - coming soon to a Martian theatre near you
#notmychristian

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- Ana’s full name being Anastasia. I hope we learn more about her and more how she even found out who she was.

I was more intrigued by the "M.D." after her name.

And her HUD contacts...or maybe robo eyes, I dunno. I don't know anything about her character or what's been released. Around the time we see her robo eyes she mentions Bray technology.

Is this the first we've heard of guardians ruled against looking into their past? It would be cool to learn that Ana Bray was kind of a Halsey character, doing experiments with guardians, technology and the light.

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I'm intrigued by the robo eyes, too. First I've heard of any non-exo guardians being synthetic (or having synthetic parts).

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I'm intrigued by the robo eyes, too. First I've heard of any non-exo guardians being synthetic (or having synthetic parts).

Asher Mir has a Vex arm! I know that’s different, but still. (:

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I'm intrigued by the robo eyes, too. First I've heard of any non-exo guardians being synthetic (or having synthetic parts).

Asher Mir has a Vex arm! I know that’s different, but still. (:

He’s also got a cold shoulder.

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Clovis Bray was doing a lot of human experimentation along side the SIVA development. Remember all the pretty tech mites that infected the Guardians around the Rise of Iron? The Grimoire associated with that detailed human testing of things like Brilliance 3.2 and the others.

That could be where being an MD came from?

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Clovis Bray was doing a lot of human experimentation along side the SIVA development. Remember all the pretty tech mites that infected the Guardians around the Rise of Iron? The Grimoire associated with that detailed human testing of things like Radiance and the others.

That could be where being an MD came from?

So, based on the Zavala trailer it said that every time they are revived they have no memory of their previous self? So could Ana have no memory of Siva? Clovis Bray?

How would they even know they are guardians, or that they are at war. That whole idea really bumped me. It seems like they would all need to be covered in reminder tattoos telling them to "Remember Sammy Jankis"

I reckon, with the two trailers saying "we don't remember our previous life" and "the rule is to not look into your previous life" it gives the impression that secret deviance is afoot.

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Nah. Guardians obviously remember who they are after their Ghosts revives them from the 2nd time on. There are examples all over the place of that. Off the top of my head, when the three Iron Lords faced down that one guy who was coming to burn a town they revived several times during the fight. Rezyl Azzir let himself be killed near a Fallen Ketch so he could get close to and then Fist of Havoc the Kell there. Heck, the entire Crucible is possible because Guardians remember who they are. The one Iron Lord who kept trying to build secure places only to have the Fallen tear them down remembered who he was after he was revived. Etc.

They just don't remember their Golden Age life before their first death.

In Ana Bray's case... maybe she was revived wearing or close to that Anastasia Bray M.D. security badge? It would be really cool if that badge has let her poke around in Clovis Bray facilities that other Guardians haven't been able to get in to.

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In Ana Bray's case... maybe she was revived wearing or close to that Anastasia Bray M.D. security badge? It would be really cool if that badge has let her poke around in Clovis Bray facilities that other Guardians haven't been able to get in to.

So are you suggesting the possibility that the lady in this trailer isn't the guardian form of Ana Bray but has assumed her role? Or is just some random guardian looking into Clovis Bray? Perhaps she was one of the test subjects and the M.D. badge is just a clue she has obtained that led her to this trailer?

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In Ana Bray's case... maybe she was revived wearing or close to that Anastasia Bray M.D. security badge? It would be really cool if that badge has let her poke around in Clovis Bray facilities that other Guardians haven't been able to get in to.

So are you suggesting the possibility that the lady in this trailer isn't the guardian form of Ana Bray but has assumed her role? Or is just some random guardian looking into Clovis Bray? Perhaps she was one of the test subjects and the M.D. badge is just a clue she has obtained that led her to this trailer?

My guess is that she is Ana Bray, but unlike most Guardians who were people fleeing the Collapse (our Guardian was found at the entrance to the Cosmodrome, for instance) maybe she died in a secure Clovis Bray bunker or some place where her ID Badge and identity were readily apparent when her Ghost first found her.

We don’t have a lot of examples of what, precisely, Guardians know about themselves when they are first revived. There’s one reference to know knowing their pre-death age, but I don’t know that they even know their name. We do have that one mysterious reference to the Exo we know as Felwinter assuming that false identity that has not yet been touched on again.

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Can't it just be that? Sheeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeesh.

I mean, it can be. If you like it, that’s cool! My little pet peeve comment aside, I just didn’t enjoy it. No big deal. Different opinions and all <3

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I thought the setting was intriguing and I was happy to see guardians doing things my character does in my head (gameplay shouldn't determine the possibilities of a world IMO).

My only critique came as I remembered Cody's edit of the end of Halo 4 where he cut out the Master Chief's portion of the dialogue. Less is more with a lot of the dialogue and I'd rather they go the "show, don't tell" route. Here's the scene we got:

"Guardians aren't supposed to investigate their past. That's the rule."
"But I'm not good with rules, not when there's this much at stake."
[Ana's eye implants are shown]
"The Clovis Bray tech in that building allowed us to colonize the system during the golden age."
[Zoom in on Ana's ID badge]

The second line is totally unnecessary. "But I'm not good with rules" is shown to us by the ID badge she's wearing later in the cut-scene. There's no need to have it called out in a way that feels really awkward when spoken. The other half of the second line ("not when there's this much at stake") isn't needed because the last line tells us about the tech and why there is so much at stake. If I were to redo this, I'd remove the second line and change the scenes to align with the dialogue.

"Guardians aren't supposed to investigate their past. That's the rule."
[Zoom in on Ana's ID badge]
"The Clovis Bray tech in that building allowed us to colonize the system during the golden age."
[Ana's eye implants are shown]

Anyways, it's a slight change, but I think it avoids the cheesiness of presentation.

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Yeah. I like that better. But... maybe sometimes even that change would make it too subtle for some?

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Yeah. I like that better. But... maybe sometimes even that change would make it too subtle for some?

Perhaps. Though I would argue that by even stating the rule, without any other queues, it puts the idea in the mind of the viewer that this rule is about to be broken. Sure, some executives at Activision wouldn't get it it and would want it spelled out, but I think most people would figure it out.

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Yeah. I like that better. But... maybe sometimes even that change would make it too subtle for some?

Nah, he's right. The ID badge tells us she investigated her past. Use it as counterpoint to the first line of narration. The second line is redundant. Audiences are actually smarter than they are often given credit for.

It's one of those things where I am sure the line made sense on the page, but when put to the screen it's no longer necessary.

P.S. If you liked the Halo 4 ending recut, ask me about my Blade Runner 2049 recut!

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P.S. If you liked the Halo 4 ending recut, ask me about my Blade Runner 2049 recut!

Crap, totally forgot to watch that! I'll set some time for it today

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I thought the setting was intriguing and I was happy to see guardians doing things my character does in my head (gameplay shouldn't determine the possibilities of a world IMO).

My only critique came as I remembered Cody's edit of the end of Halo 4 where he cut out the Master Chief's portion of the dialogue. Less is more with a lot of the dialogue and I'd rather they go the "show, don't tell" route.

Dude, let us know you're linking to a movie! I downloaded three copies before I figured out why a second tab wouldn't open.

I love Cody's edit. I campaigned for his fix before he made it.

I didn't really have any complaints about the voice over. Maybe some of those lines would've worked a little better as a dialogue between Ana and her ghost? The "I'm not good with rules" was a bit silly and the same gist could have been communicated with a smirk, and eyes narrowing as she mentions the stakes.

To the extent it works it works because it's a voice over. It is Ana's thoughts. And we don't know Ana very well yet. If I knew Ana Bray as well as I know Master Chief, I might have more issues with it. I think voice overs can be kind of cheap, but Bungie has used them often. (I'm glad we never heard them with Master Chief--it doesn't fit his character for us to know his inner thought.)

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I thought the setting was intriguing and I was happy to see guardians doing things my character does in my head (gameplay shouldn't determine the possibilities of a world IMO).

My only critique came as I remembered Cody's edit of the end of Halo 4 where he cut out the Master Chief's portion of the dialogue. Less is more with a lot of the dialogue and I'd rather they go the "show, don't tell" route. Here's the scene we got:

"Guardians aren't supposed to investigate their past. That's the rule."
"But I'm not good with rules, not when there's this much at stake."
[Ana's eye implants are shown]
"The Clovis Bray tech in that building allowed us to colonize the system during the golden age."
[Zoom in on Ana's ID badge]

The second line is totally unnecessary. "But I'm not good with rules" is shown to us by the ID badge she's wearing later in the cut-scene. There's no need to have it called out in a way that feels really awkward when spoken. The other half of the second line ("not when there's this much at stake") isn't needed because the last line tells us about the tech and why there is so much at stake. If I were to redo this, I'd remove the second line and change the scenes to align with the dialogue.

"Guardians aren't supposed to investigate their past. That's the rule."
[Zoom in on Ana's ID badge]
"The Clovis Bray tech in that building allowed us to colonize the system during the golden age."
[Ana's eye implants are shown]

Anyways, it's a slight change, but I think it avoids the cheesiness of presentation.

A balanced middle ground could be:

"Guardians aren't supposed to investigate their past. At least, that's supposed to be the rule."

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Destiny 2 Exp II Prologue (Destiny)

A pet peeve of mine

^ This

Relevent Observation.

A pet peeve of mine

A pet peeve of mine

A pet peeve of mine

A pet peeve of mine

A pet peeve of mine

A pet peeve of mine

OMG! WHY IS IT SO GOOD! 10 years later and it's still gold.

OMG! WHY IS IT SO GOOD! 10 years later and it's still gold.

hilariously

hilariously

hilariously

A pet peeve of mine

A pet peeve of mine

A pet peeve of mine

A pet peeve of mine

A pet peeve of mine

A pet peeve of mine

A pet peeve of mine

A pet peeve of mine

A pet peeve of mine

A pet peeve of mine

A pet peeve of mine

A pet peeve of mine

A pet peeve of mine

A pet peeve of mine

Yeah, she stays at the top

Sure, but she's got to come down at some point.

inb4 she's still there in-game

inb4 she's still there in-game

If that is the case I will pre order everything.

Like you ate that sock or actually do it?

I'd probably choke from laughing so hard

Destiny 2 Exp II Prologue

Destiny 2 Exp II Prologue

Hey, that was a pretty cool video.

yep

Hey, that was a pretty cool video.

Hey, that was a pretty cool video.

+1

+1

+1

Logging out for a bit.

Logging out for a bit.

Logging out for a bit.

Logging out for a bit.

Logging out for a bit.

My post wasn't about criticism.

It's DMFanella all over again!

It's DMFanella all over again!

It's DMFanella all over again!

It's DMFanella all over again!

Logging out for a bit.

+1

Hey, that was a pretty cool video.

I hope!

Hey, that was a pretty cool video.

Hey, that was a pretty cool video.

50 Shades of Red

Paging Dr. Bray

Paging Dr. Bray

Paging Dr. Bray

Paging Dr. Bray

Paging Dr. Bray

Paging Dr. Bray

Paging Dr. Bray

Paging Dr. Bray

Paging Dr. Bray

Hey, that was a pretty cool video.

Yep, I enjoyed it too

Loved it. I have one critique.

Loved it. I have one critique.

Loved it. I have one critique.

Loved it. I have one critique.

Loved it. I have one critique.

I'd love to see it if you're inclined to share.