While pinnacle rewards absolutely need some tweaking (there should be heavy weighting towards getting a pinnacle in a slot with the lowest power so that it has a solid upwards progression), I did notice something about the new Powerful vs Pinnacle system.

In the previous year's system, we had the soft and hard cap, and only Powerfuls would advance your Light Level between the soft cap and hard cap. But in order to maximize your gains, you had to do every single powerful drop every week, even below cap, so the gameplay loop never really changed from when you hit the soft cap. It was the same chore list.

In the new Pinnacle system, only Pinnacles advance you from 950 to 960 base light. While Pinnacles are definitely a help BEFORE 950, I did notice something: once you hit 950, your chore list drops, because Powerfuls (and Primes) max out at 950. It's now safe to ignore the Powerfuls outside of wanting some infusion fuel. The tradeoff is that your smaller chore list is definitely more difficult activities, but it's finally more of a true endgame for non-raiders.

And of course, the artifact power increases prevent "forever 29" by slowly pushing you up even past 960 even if you don't persue pinnacles. Pinnacles just get you higher power, faster, and will leave you sitting at max base light when the next season rolls around.

This combined with the fact that the season pass leveling actually has a DOWNWARDS curve from the XP boosters means the farther into the season you go you start leveling faster, and it feels like they're zeroing in on something that rewards early grinding but eases up on the gas pedal as you put more time into it.

I have mixed feelings about it.

Because of how slow it is, 950 to 960 feels like even more of a chore, not less. On the other hand, it’s also basically meaningless. With the Artifact, I’m in the low 960s anyway, so I don’t have to care about that extra power, which seems like a decent solution. The grind is there for those who want it, but it’s not necessary to complete any end game content.

I was pleasantly surprised to discover that powerful rewards are not hard-capped at 950. As I got my base light level up over 950 via pinnacle rewards, powerful rewards started dropping above 950 as well. This, combined with the adjustment to pinnacle drops (so they now fall at +2 instead of +1) has made the process of levelling up a fair bit smoother. By the end of the day yesterday, my pinnacle rewards were dropping at 956, and my powerful rewards at 954. As you say, it’s largely meaningless, but at least it doesn’t feel like pulling teeth anymore.

I have mixed feelings about it.

Because of how slow it is, 950 to 960 feels like even more of a chore, not less. On the other hand, it’s also basically meaningless. With the Artifact, I’m in the low 960s anyway, so I don’t have to care about that extra power, which seems like a decent solution. The grind is there for those who want it, but it’s not necessary to complete any end game content.

Actually, I just checked today and the hardest nightmare hunts are suggested light level 980... So if I ever want to do them without them kicking my ass I would prefer 960 + Artifact level. I would also love to know what the light level is of the final enemies in the raid. Ever since they changed how they show the who you were killed by and the recommended light level. It's been not at all consistent.

I have mixed feelings about it.

Because of how slow it is, 950 to 960 feels like even more of a chore, not less. On the other hand, it’s also basically meaningless. With the Artifact, I’m in the low 960s anyway, so I don’t have to care about that extra power, which seems like a decent solution. The grind is there for those who want it, but it’s not necessary to complete any end game content.

Actually, I just checked today and the hardest nightmare hunts are suggested light level 980... So if I ever want to do them without them kicking my ass I would prefer 960 + Artifact level. I would also love to know what the light level is of the final enemies in the raid. Ever since they changed how they show the who you were killed by and the recommended light level. It's been not at all consistent.

Yeah the 980 Nightfalls and 980 Nightmare Hunts are probably the most light-level demanding activities in the game right now. I finally managed to finish a 980 nightfall last week (I was at ~970). I’ve been doing master nightmare hunts since I was ~965, but some of those missions are a bit more dangerous than others.

I guess that’s a fair point.

I haven’t done a Master Nightfall yet, but I’ve done a few Master Nightmare Hunts. And the Pit of Heresy, and you and I two-manned that Xenophage boss. I think I max out at 962 with the Artifact at +12. Everything in the game is totally doable at that point, from my experience.

You know, light level aside :D

That’s also a fair point. (:

Chasing Pinnacles just isn’t something I care about. I’m happy to get them, but that extra 10 power level I could take or leave at the end of the day.

Lots of people were complaining that the 960 cap wasn’t even possible to obtain even with perfect drops in the slots you need. I guess I’m actually okay with the game having a sort of theoretical cap that might not actually be attainable, with the Artifact filling in the gaps.

That grind is there for folks to chase if they want it, but it’s not strictly necessarily the way getting to the cap used to feel like it was.

That’s also a fair point. (:

Chasing Pinnacles just isn’t something I care about. I’m happy to get them, but that extra 10 power level I could take or leave at the end of the day.

Lots of people were complaining that the 960 cap wasn’t even possible to obtain even with perfect drops in the slots you need. I guess I’m actually okay with the game having a sort of theoretical cap that might not actually be attainable, with the Artifact filling in the gaps.

That grind is there for folks to chase if they want it, but it’s not strictly necessarily the way getting to the cap used to feel like it was.

The one point of friction that jumps out at me is that some of these high-level activities (Nightfalls in particular) are pretty much the only source of ascendant shards, other than purchasing them (and we’ve already covered how obscenely expensive that is). So if you want to really dig into maximizing the RPG side of character building, you kinda have to get your light level up into the 970s at least, unless you’re an exceptionally skilled player.

That’s also a fair point. (:

Chasing Pinnacles just isn’t something I care about. I’m happy to get them, but that extra 10 power level I could take or leave at the end of the day.

Lots of people were complaining that the 960 cap wasn’t even possible to obtain even with perfect drops in the slots you need. I guess I’m actually okay with the game having a sort of theoretical cap that might not actually be attainable, with the Artifact filling in the gaps.

That grind is there for folks to chase if they want it, but it’s not strictly necessarily the way getting to the cap used to feel like it was.

The one point of friction that jumps out at me is that some of these high-level activities (Nightfalls in particular) are pretty much the only source of ascendant shards, other than purchasing them (and we’ve already covered how obscenely expensive that is). So if you want to really dig into maximizing the RPG side of character building, you kinda have to get your light level up into the 970s at least, unless you’re an exceptionally skilled player.

Where I agree with this, I also lump that maximizing RPG side with maximizing your light level to 960. Getting your armor to the point of not quite needing the ascendant shards is basically the same place as being at 950 in my book. Now, if you weren't able to use those spiffy new seasonal mods until you leveled something up with an ascendant shard, then that would be a whole other story.

I basically haven't touched mods really until I got to the raid and was dying to void, so I equipped void resistance. Then when I needed to do DPS I equipped the void grenade mod that increases damage. Well, also the new seasonal weapon mods, but I don't think those really count :D

Basically, I haven't needed any of the mods (except for the weapon mods) but they are fun at least. I'm sure they might be really powerful if I have the right build but I just haven't needed to get into that.

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The Ascendant Shards aren’t for getting up to maximizing mod slots. A lot of solid builds only cost 6-8 energy and most people will get by without that. However, if you masterwork your armor you now have +8 to every stat. That will increase any stat that ends in a 2-9, meaning you could increase a tier on every stat.

At the moment that would increase 5/6 stats on my Titan if ai were to MW. And I would open up a mod slot and retain Tier 10 Discipline. And the only slot I don’t gain is Resilience, which I already have at 5 which is pretty much the sweet-spot (for me) when it comes to crucible. So for people who are number crunching and seeking the highest efficiency for their build then they need Ascendant Shards for that 48 point stat increase (it’s basically having another piece of armor) across the board.

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Because your class item doesn't have a "roll" other than its affinity, you should go ahead and masterwork that first with an ascendant shard you get from the season pass. That alone will give you +2 to every category, which for me was enough to improve my tiers for several combinations of armor I have. Those 9s were driving me nuts!

I'm just around 940 currently and haven't been putting a lit of thought into my armour choices. I definitely haven't even begun to think about mods.

But each piece of armour gains +8 in every stat when you masterwork it?

What are the thresholds/energy levels at which you see stat gains? I should take that into account when comparing natiral drops with differing levels I guess. Hadn't realised that.

Check out this topic in an earlier thread for other similar advice from DBO

When you look at the armor, it has a "Total" in the bottom. With no mods applied, this is generally in the low-50s. Some activities drop armor that has higher stats (Iron Banner for sure, I've read that the raid does, probably other Pinnacle content but I'm not sure). 60 seems to be on the high end. I think I may have gotten a 61 piece before. Exotics also often have a high total stat.

When you masterwork, every single stat gets a boost. I didn't realize it was 8 pts--that's pretty substantial.

I think ability boosts happen every ten points in a stat, but I may be wrong.

2 per stat per armor piece. I was pretty sure class items didn’t count but a reply below says otherwise.

So if the class item also adds, that’s 10 in every stat. So +60, which is a solid roll. Highest I have seen is 64. So that means MW + a mod coupd bring you up to 86.

That lines up with what I remember, my 60 base stat piece going up to 80 after MW'ing and applying a mod.