The new Battlegrounds activity is... fine, I guess. But boy does it feel like a misuse of resources in a way. After completing the intro quest (which involves running a couple Battleground activities), I jumped into a fireteam with a couple clan mates who had started playing about an hour earlier than me, and they both commented on how sick of the battlegrounds they already were. Later that night, I was playing with Korny and Claude, and they too both commented on how uninterested they were on doing more of this activity. It’s the first day, and this activity is already feeling worn out after a handful of completions. I think it’s fine as a little diversion to jump into on occasion with friends, but as the primary activity of the season it really falls flat IMO. There just isn’t enough to it.

That’s been the case since day one with the seasonal model. Vex Offensive was boring after three runs. So was the Sundial. I’m not sure I even did three runs of Warmind basketball. The Public Event from two seasons ago was surprisingly fun, but that might just be because it had been like six months since I’d really played Destiny at that point. The Wrathborn Hunts were boring the first time, I can’t even imagine playing enough to do all those Triumphs.

Even going back to Black Armory or Menagerie . . . they’re miles better than the current offerings, but even they’re not strong enough to base an entire season around.

I would like to interject that the Sundial was very underrated. Not as solid as Menagerie, but I do recall having a real blast with it. Note here too that both modes were 6 man activities.

I saw a thread on twitter the other day. One of the UI guys at Bungie said he thought it was funny that he keeps seeing people online theorizing that the game is being supported by a skeleton crew because there’s more people on it now than there has been for a long time. I was confused, because he said that proudly, whereas it actually seems like that would be fucking embarrassing, given the state of the game. For me, it encapsulated the entire relationship between Bungie, the game, and the players. It feels like they fundamentally misunderstand just about everything about the game they’re making and what the players of that game actually want.

I would like to see that thread. As based on your description it's alarmingly (but indeed not surprisingly) blind. It's like... why are all these people claiming the earth is round? It's so funny, look at that horizon, it's so obviously flat.

Granted, the folks online theorizing that the game is being supported by a skeleton crew might not be the most business minded in their observations but I guess we're all fools at something. All in all a rather sad disconnect if as stated.

Anyway, sorry for coming in here and taking a big dump. A new season is usually enough to get me to at least jump back on and see what’s new. Instead I uninstalled the game when I realized I was looking at weeks of playing the same old shit so I could level up enough to maybe do whatever cool new mission they might drop later in the season. It’s a bummer to not want to play Destiny, but I’m just so tired of not actually being able to play the game in a way that’s enjoyable.

So my thought on the new season is that Apex Legends sure is fun!

I recently found myself playing Titanfall 2 again. Not sure how, but their "Frontier Defense" mode is so much fun. Like lose track of time, oh-crap-how-it-suddenly-2am-fun. And I don't know how, when I've played this thing over and over again how it keeps it's fun factor the same as it was the first time.

The new Battlegrounds activity is... fine, I guess. But boy does it feel like a misuse of resources in a way. After completing the intro quest (which involves running a couple Battleground activities), I jumped into a fireteam with a couple clan mates who had started playing about an hour earlier than me, and they both commented on how sick of the battlegrounds they already were. Later that night, I was playing with Korny and Claude, and they too both commented on how uninterested they were on doing more of this activity. It’s the first day, and this activity is already feeling worn out after a handful of completions. I think it’s fine as a little diversion to jump into on occasion with friends, but as the primary activity of the season it really falls flat IMO. There just isn’t enough to it.

That’s been the case since day one with the seasonal model. Vex Offensive was boring after three runs. So was the Sundial. I’m not sure I even did three runs of Warmind basketball. The Public Event from two seasons ago was surprisingly fun, but that might just be because it had been like six months since I’d really played Destiny at that point. The Wrathborn Hunts were boring the first time, I can’t even imagine playing enough to do all those Triumphs.

Even going back to Black Armory or Menagerie . . . they’re miles better than the current offerings, but even they’re not strong enough to base an entire season around.

Yeah, I agree. I think for me the big difference back then was that the Forges, Reckoning, and Menagerie were never the primary endgame activities for me. They were fun diversions that I did in between the stuff I was really invested in.

Unlike you, I loved Beyond Light. It was a really fun loop. I look forward to playing the new expansion in the fall and doing it again with some real new content instead of these three month grinds for no reason. I understand why they are doing the seasonal thing, and I don’t hate them for it. It just sucks all of the fun out of the game. Turning off the power grind would make all of the other faults with the game not matter for me, and I’d jump right back in. I should not have to decide between playing whatever activity my friends are currently doing or playing the activity Bungie has dictated I need to do that I can power up. Until they fix that, the seasonal model is fundamentally broken.

I should clarify that there is stuff within Beyond Light that I really enjoy. It’s just that for me, the parts it got right are narrow in scale or singular activities (I love the Raid, for example). But IMO, the problems that were introduced alongside Beyond Light are the kind of sweeping, ever-present issues that tarnish the entire game. Specifically Sunsetting, Stasis, and the DCV. The Beyond Light campaign was a kind of microcosm for that overall trend for me. There were plenty of little things I really liked, but that stuff was largely overshadowed by big, sweeping downsides, such as the fact that a huge portion of the “campaign” is really just completing patrol bounty objectives, or the fact that the majority of my playtime was spent travelling from the landing zone to my next objective way up north.

IMO, this is a continuation of poor high-level decision making that has been consistently in the forefront since Shadowkeep. That expansion included a change to PvE damage scaling which immediately impacted all PvE combat in a negative way (again, IMO). The implementation of the artifact mods and champions made gear selection for endgame content feel overly restrictive, rather than empowering the “build your personal monster-killing machine the way you want” idea which Bungie claims to care about (and sunsetting has only made this issue worse). The pattern of nerfing any and all gear that sees lots of usage, without properly understanding WHY that gear is being used so often, really kicked into gear during Season of Opulance and has not slowed down since then. And so on.

Long story short, I’m not going to get worked up about a seasonal activity which I don’t enjoy (EG wrathborn hunts) because that stuff is inconsequential enough that I can simply ignore it if I don’t like it. But I do feel a bit starved for content I can really sink my teeth into. It exists, but it is either a non-trivial task to arrange (like putting together a raid group) or the activities have been artificially buried into obscurity thanks to sunsetting and reward power issues. According to DungeonReport, I’ve completed the Hawkmoon mission 72 times in the past 3 weeks. I love that mission, but not so much that I’d run it 72 times in a vacuum. I keep running it because I keep wanting to play Destiny, staring at the director for 5 minutes, then deciding the Harbinger mission is just about my only option if I want something that is still exciting and challenging but relatively easy to get a group together, and is nicely rewarding on top of that.

I saw a thread on twitter the other day. One of the UI guys at Bungie said he thought it was funny that he keeps seeing people online theorizing that the game is being supported by a skeleton crew because there’s more people on it now than there has been for a long time. I was confused, because he said that proudly, whereas it actually seems like that would be fucking embarrassing, given the state of the game. For me, it encapsulated the entire relationship between Bungie, the game, and the players. It feels like they fundamentally misunderstand just about everything about the game they’re making and what the players of that game actually want.

Now this is absolutely shocking to me. I’m blown away. If this is accurate, then Claude should be laughing out loud at me, because I was just saying to him last week that Bungie is CLEARLY trying to keep Destiny running with the smallest team they can get away with, while the true focus of the studio is shifted towards future projects. To be fair, I wasn’t exactly saying that the team working on Destiny is “small”, just that it seems obvious to me that Bungie wants to have as few people working on D2 as they can get away with while maintaining its profitability. But the idea that Bungie has more people working on Destiny right now than ever before just blows me away (and yes, I do realize that whoever said so was probably not factoring in the support teams that used to work on D2 through activision, VV, and High Moon). I completely agree with your comment about how off-the-mark Bungie appears to be when it comes to judging the relationship players have with their game at the moment.

I saw a thread on twitter the other day. One of the UI guys at Bungie said he thought it was funny that he keeps seeing people online theorizing that the game is being supported by a skeleton crew because there’s more people on it now than there has been for a long time. I was confused, because he said that proudly, whereas it actually seems like that would be fucking embarrassing, given the state of the game. For me, it encapsulated the entire relationship between Bungie, the game, and the players. It feels like they fundamentally misunderstand just about everything about the game they’re making and what the players of that game actually want.

(The following is all Cody's opinion)

The real problem is the decision to make a game that's supposed to be played daily or at least often over a long period of time. That's it. They could have 10,000 people working on the game and it would still be a problem. The issue isn't manpower. It's big picture decision making.

(Cody's opinion ends)

Someone who plays FF14 will have to confirm this, but the game director apparently said "We have content drops every 4 months. So play the new content, and when you're done, just go play another game until the next content drop happens". And apparently FF14 is an awesome game.

I really love the new bow. It reminds me of Malfeasance, in that it really comes to life in situations where multiple teammates are all running with it together. The “tag an enemy with a homing hipfire shot and then make them explode with an ADS shot” mechanic works in team-fire situations. I went into crucible with a clanmate, and we worked together; I’d tag every enemy I could with the hip-fire homing arrows, while he fired precision shots. Together, we were setting off explosions non-stop. It was great!

Oh my goodness! It STACKS?! I've not played with anyone yet, so news to me! Oh wow, if the damage loop this thing has holds (see, isn't nerfed) this thing might replace Wish Ender as my preferred competitive Bow.

I wonder what kind of maddness a 6 man could do?

The new Battlegrounds activity is... fine, I guess. But boy does it feel like a misuse of resources in a way. After completing the intro quest (which involves running a couple Battleground activities), I jumped into a fireteam with a couple clan mates who had started playing about an hour earlier than me, and they both commented on how sick of the battlegrounds they already were. Later that night, I was playing with Korny and Claude, and they too both commented on how uninterested they were on doing more of this activity. It’s the first day, and this activity is already feeling worn out after a handful of completions. I think it’s fine as a little diversion to jump into on occasion with friends, but as the primary activity of the season it really falls flat IMO. There just isn’t enough to it.

I would like to add here, has anyone here played in the updated rendition of "The Devils' Lair"? Since I started the season at 1260 on my main, I was able to jump into a 1270 night fall immediately, and as it turns out this week said strike is the Nightfall this week. WOW! Does that strike outdo the Battlegrounds activity. The so called Battlegrounds are just poorly made strikes. "The Devils' Lair" is a BATTLEFIELD end-to-end. It's actually fantastic. And yes, all the "problem spots" (where everyone is likely to get downed and restart) have returned. I don't think sniping the tank works as well as it once did, but that's ok because it's more fun not to now. It's really interesting.

Was an amazing way to drop back into it. So good.

I would like to add here, has anyone here played in the updated rendition of "The Devils' Lair"? Since I started the season at 1260 on my main, I was able to jump into a 1270 night fall immediately, and as it turns out this week said strike is the Nightfall this week. WOW! Does that strike outdo the Battlegrounds activity. The so called Battlegrounds are just poorly made strikes. "The Devils' Lair" is a BATTLEFIELD end-to-end. It's actually fantastic. And yes, all the "problem spots" (where everyone is likely to get downed and restart) have returned. I don't think sniping the tank works as well as it once did, but that's ok because it's more fun not to now. It's really interesting.

The Brigs there certainly caught me off-guard! Had a blast

Oh man I forgot about Dungeon's now drop powerful rewards! Gotta get back in those!

Gambit and strikes as quick palate cleansers between other activities. Getting the weekly challenge pinnacles? That's a strike/gambit game per day max to get that. And there's so many pinnacle sources that who really cares if you're not getting both of those.

I’ve still never done a GM Nightfall, despite really wanting to, mostly because I’m burned out on the grind before getting anywhere close to appropriately leveled. If you don’t get every Pinnacle available, getting to the required power level is basically impossible in a timely manner. The Artifact scales in such a way that I can’t use that to make up the difference, because I also refuse to spend my time doing the chores Bungie calls bounties.

The cool new mission they just added was almost 10 points above my total power level. I shouldn’t have to decide between going in under leveled or spending another two weeks grinding out Pinnacles to be appropriately leveled because I had the audacity to play something else for a while, or because I played Destiny in a way that isn’t exactly as Bungie prescribed. It’s infuriating to see new stuff in the game that actually looks really fun, but I can’t do it because Bungie expects me to play Destiny like it’s my fucking job. It’s honestly insulting.

I’ve been highly critical of Beyond Light, but I’m starting to think that I may have underestimated how much damage Bungie has done to this game over the past ~16 months, especially with Beyond Light. It just feels like there’s nothing left in this game, which is crazy because there is technically tons of stuff to do. But I think the core pillars of the game, the bread-and-butter activities like strikes, crucible, and gambit are either boring (strikes), tedious (gambit), or a complete fucking disaster (crucible). Sunsetting has largely killed my investment in my gear, and I don’t see how the PvP side of the game will ever recover from the addition of Stasis.

While
A. I certainly think there's plenty Bungie can do better
B. I'm anti-power level

I think this season is pretty solid.

• Gambit and strikes as quick palate cleansers between other activities. Getting the weekly challenge pinnacles? That's a strike/gambit game per day max to get that. And there's so many pinnacle sources that who really cares if you're not getting both of those.
  
• I feel like in the past 16 months they've really upped their game with Nightfall strikes. There's a wide variety of difficulty levels, cool loot, and matchmaking at the lower levels.
  
• Legendary lost sectors, Empire Hunts, and Exo Challenge provide me the solo difficult content that I've always wanted out of Destiny but rarely got. And the cool thing is it doesn't even have to be solo!
  
• re: stasis and PvP, I feel like their recent nerfs have made it much more manageable and at the end of the day, I'm playing a wacky space wizard shooter, not a hard as nails military shooter, I like the wackiness... I'd also like to see the data on how Stasis is currently faring in PvP
  
• Love that they're giving some attention to Dungeons, some of the best content they've put into this game

I think they've done a better job of balancing where you feel compelled to go lately. For example, I've done most of the things that I want to do in battlegrounds for this week, and don't really need to dive back into them unless I'm having friendship time with someone else.

I just really appreciate that it feels like I can do whatever I want to level up and unless I"m truly trying to min/max my leveling, that I don't have to do everything if I don't want to. Don't feel like gambit this week? cool (and god knows I don't feel like gambit ever since I got the Reckoner title). I remember when Destiny had me running the strike playlist non-stop to struggly bus my way up the power curve, and this feels so damn far away from that.

Ultimately I take issue with people saying Bungie is out of touch with it's audience, in part because I feel like they've been nailing a lot things lately and these comments make me wonder "am I not their audience?". Where are the metrics, where's the proper analysis of player's time? Of public opinion?

All fair points, and I agree with much of what you’ve said. But I don’t think anything you’re saying contradicts my initial concerns. Like you, I appreciate that I can bounce around from activity to activity and level-up while doing whatever I want to do, but that doesn’t change the fact that most of the activities I may want to do have been negatively impacted by other decisions Bungie has made. For example, I think the crucible sandbox is in a fantastic place right now... except for Stasis. None of the light-based subclasses are drastically dominant over the others, and the breadth of competitively viable primary weapons is just wonderful. Just about every primary weapon type has a place and play style where it can excel right now. The crucible should be in the best shape it’s ever been, but Bungie went and upper-decked the whole experience with Stasis.
Nightfalls are another example for me. I have always enjoyed the Nightfalls. But ever since Shadowkeep, the combination of Champions and Artifact mods have made the whole experience feel increasingly restrictive. Every season, Bungie basically tells me which weapon types I’m going to be using for every single Nightfall for the next ~3 months. Between all the restrictive measures at play (choice of anti-champion mods, power levels, elemental types, costs of resetting the artifact, cost of juggling/replacing armour mods), the end result is that iI’m cornered into using variations of the same 1 or 2 loadouts for all end-game activities that feature champions. It is possible to experiment with a wide range of build diversity, but there are so many annoying or tedious points of friction along that path that the ends no longer justify the means for me. Once again, the stuff in the game that I really like is buried under stuff that feels unnecessary or even counter-productive.

I guess what I’m getting at is that yes, it’s nice that I’m not really forced into activities I don’t want to do anymore, but I’m also being driven out of activities I DO want to do because they’ve been underdeveloped, neglected, or flat-out ruined by relatively recent changes/additions to the game. I look back at the D1 Age of Triumph era, and what a blast it was to have such a wide breadth of great PvE and PvP content to play, and so much exciting end-game loot to chase. D2 at this point should feel even wider, and yet to me the game has felt progressively smaller and smaller since somewhere around Season of Opulance.

Yeah, I know. I honestly hate that. I have to wonder how much that ability contributes to these sorts of poor decisions.

- No text -