Let's Talk Golgoroth *Raid Sp* (Destiny)

by someotherguy, Hertfordshire, England, Thursday, October 08, 2015, 18:10 (3430 days ago)

or: How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Love the Gaze

First things first - Golgoroth is a dick. Not the encounter, that's actually pretty cool once you've got it down. But golgoroth is a dick. He's got Cursed Thrall, a Tablet of Ruin, Venom Balls, Surprise Taken, Venom Balls, Adepts, and Venom Balls all just itching (heh) to ruin your day. He's arguably the hardest part of the Raid (at least in terms of getting your tactics straight) and was the quitting point of a lot of teams over that first weekend.

So it's understandable why people might be looking for an easy way out. The last three Raids I've run have all had someone stop us at Golgoroth while deciding gaze-holders and say "Hey have you heard about the one-gaze method? It's way better!".

For those who don't know, the "one-gaze" method involves killing all the adds in the room, dropping a single Puddle of Reclaimed Light, having one person grab the Gaze, and then resetting after just a single DpS Phase. It's about as simple as it sounds, and executed perfectly, it will allow you to kill Golgoroth just before he enrages.

It's also slower, riskier and (most importantly) much less likely to work in the Hard Raid than any other approach. It involves fighting more adds, getting shot at by Golgoroth more frequently, and the poor gaze-holder running laps around the room all for a maximum of 15 seconds of DpS per phase. It's terrible.

So how should you do it? Well, there's two methods I like a lot, and which you choose depends on whether you want to do it safe or fast. It's worth noting though that both methods are still safer and faster than the one-gaze approach.

The Simple/Safe Approach: Front and Back
This method is probably my favourite, just because it's so simple, and is the method I'd recommend if you dont' have a very confident pair of Gaze-holders. This is what the one-gaze method wishes it was.

Start by picking two gaze-holders. They don't have to be experts, as they won't have to do much in the way of multitasking. Defenders are a good choice for clutch health-regen, but any class is perfectly good. They definitely want a primary that holds at least 15 rounds though, or at least has a fast reload.

The least confident gaze-holder (Gaze-A) needs to head to the back of the room, into the cave above the exit. This is where you'll live for the rest of the fight. The other gaze-holder (Gaze-B) will stay around the entrance to the room.

At the start of the fight, split into two groups to kill all the adds while taking care not to get laser-faced by Golgoroth. Gaze-A will have to be careful as a number of Acolytes spawn from doors towards the back of the room. Once the adds are dead, everyone should position themselves at the front of the room while Gaze-A takes the Gaze.

Gaze-A's job is very simple - don't die. You don't need to keep track of the countdown timer or even changing your position, just focus on destroying Venom Balls. The best way to do this is stand right in the open, in line of sight of Golgoroth. This way the balls will come at you in a straight line, whereas if you're behind cover they'll bounce around and give you a hard time.

As soon as Golgoroth's back is turned, Gaze-B and the others should drop the front-left Orb suspended from the ceiling. Gaze-B then takes the Gaze and the Puddle Team jump into the puddle. Don't forget to have someone take care of the Cursed Thralls.

Use Tethers and Melting Point liberally, but not both at once. They don't stack. They do stack with Weapons of Light though

Gaze-B has a slightly harder job than Gaze-A, but only in that he should be keeping an eye on the countdown timer. The easiest place to stand at this point is right up against the doorway you first come in through. Once the countdown reaches 10 start counting out loud, and when you reach 2, Gaze-A should take the gaze again and everyone should jump out of the pit.

Next, drop the front-right Orb, and repeat the process.

Once Gaze-A has the Gaze again (after the second Puddle), destroy the mid-right Orb. Gaze-B will have to move to the right a little (past the cover so Golgoroth is in clear Line of Sight) so that the Puddle Team can get a good shot on Golgoroth's stomach.

This time, Golgoroth's back will be closed, so Gaze-A won't be able to take the gaze. Once the countdown reaches 0 Golgoroth will become hostile, so it's important to get everyone out of the pit and into cover before then.

For increased DpS, Gaze-A can join the Puddle Team for this third Puddle

From here, kill the adds and repeat until victory. At some point (when Golgoroth's health reaches half?) Taken Thrall will start teleporting in. This is actually quite convenient, as it means you don't need to kill a wave of Acolytes between phases any more, you can just start another phase as soon as Golgoroth's back reopens.

The Intended/Fast Approach: Side to Side
This method is a little more complicated for the Puddle Team, and requires more multitasking from the Gaze-holders, but is definitely the fastest, cleanest way to clear the encounter. Unless the enrage Timer is shortened substantially for the Hard Raid this method shouldn't be necessary, but we have no idea what to expect so practicing probably isn't a bad idea. It's also very satisfying when it all comes together and you blast Golgoroth in just a couple of minutes. Otherwise though, I'd suggest sticking to the Front-to-Back method.

Again, we'll start by picking two Gaze-holders (Gaze-L and Gaze-R). They need to be confident in in dealing with Venom Balls on the move, and have enough firepower to destroy the Orbs on their own. An LMG is ideal.

For this example I'll be starting from the left, but the process can be reversed with no problems.

Split into two teams of three and kill the adds, then have Gaze-L get Golgoroth's attention but not his gaze! by shooting him in the body. While he's distracted, the other 5 should position themselves by the Back-Right Orb and destroy it.

As soon as the Orb lands, Gaze-R should take the Gaze and start counting down, while the Puddle Team starts burning Golgoroth. Don't forget about the Cursed Thralls

While this is happening, Gaze-L should destroy the Back-Left Orb. The puddle lasts longer than 20 seconds, so it doesn't matter if it breaks a little early. Try and drop it for around the 5-second mark.

Once the countdown reaches two, Gaze-L should take the Gaze and the puddle team should immediately move to the new puddle.

Now Gaze-R needs to destroy the Mid-Right Orb while Golgoroth is occupied with Gaze-L. Then Gaze-L will destroy the Mid-Left Orb, then Gaze-R the Front-Right, then finally the Front-Left. The Gaze-holders will need to move into position in front of each of the puddles so that the Puddle Team can get a good shot on Golgoroth, while the Puddle Team move from puddle to puddle.

Callouts are key so everyone knows how much time is left on each Gaze.

During Gaze-L's final Gaze, Gaze-R can jump into the pit to help DpS

Once the countdown reaches 0 on the Front-Left Orb Golgoroth will become hostile, so it's important to get everyone out of the pit and into cover before then.

The adds will spawn again, so kill them and take a moment to find ammo, as you're likely to need it. Then repeat the process until Golgoroth is dead. My group has killed him before with just 7 orbs on an almost-perfect run, so it's probably possible to beat him in just one phase with high enough DpS. Maybe you'll get a secret chest for it? Who knows.

TL;DR
Friends don't let friends One-Gaze. Use the Front-to-Back method for safety and convenience, or the Side-to-Side method for Speed and bragging rights.

Let's Talk Golgoroth *Raid Sp*

by TheeChaos @, Thursday, October 08, 2015, 18:17 (3430 days ago) @ someotherguy

I don't recalling saying its EASIER, but SIMPLER.

twisting my words boy!

Edit: I was not attacking him before this blows up, im always busting his balls (hehe).


Good write up though. Good information for virgin raiders to have.

Never said you did.

by someotherguy, Hertfordshire, England, Thursday, October 08, 2015, 18:19 (3430 days ago) @ TheeChaos

I'm just saying it's not easier. Or faster. Or safer. Or better in any way :p

Never said you did.

by ChrisTheeCrappy, Thursday, October 08, 2015, 18:40 (3430 days ago) @ someotherguy

I would actually beg to differ, we did it on Tuesday and got him down very quickly (4 times I believe). Granted we were all 293+ or so. But it worked 1st time, and allowed us to have errors. Don't think we saw the Enrage message.

4 times?!

by someotherguy, Hertfordshire, England, Thursday, October 08, 2015, 18:51 (3430 days ago) @ ChrisTheeCrappy
edited by someotherguy, Thursday, October 08, 2015, 18:56

If that's accurate I'm very impressed.

That said, it would still be safer, faster and require less work from your Gaze-holder to do it Front-to-Back.

Let's Talk Golgoroth *Raid Sp*

by TheeChaos @, Thursday, October 08, 2015, 18:22 (3430 days ago) @ someotherguy

Gaze-B has a slightly harder job than Gaze-A, but only in that he should be keeping an eye on the countdown timer. The easiest place to stand at this point is right up against the doorway you first come in through. Once the countdown reaches 10 start counting out loud, and when you reach 2, Gaze-A should take the gaze again and everyone should jump out of the pit.


Why do you jump out of the bit after the back person has the second gaze?

Let's Talk Golgoroth *Raid Sp*

by someotherguy, Hertfordshire, England, Thursday, October 08, 2015, 18:52 (3430 days ago) @ TheeChaos

It's not necessary, but it just means you're out of the way of Cursed Thrall while you destroy the next Orb.

You could totally stay in the pit though.

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One Gaze works fine, especially with a high dps group

by Kahzgul, Thursday, October 08, 2015, 18:26 (3430 days ago) @ someotherguy

we downed him in 4 total gazes with a strong DPS team. Very, very easy.

In hardmode I expect the following changes:

- Orbs which drop pools of light don't respawn once broken.

- Players who have held the gaze get a debuff which prevents them from holding the gaze again.

- more adds, who are also stronger.

- The tablet fills in 3 deaths (or instantly if anyone dies, but I hate insta-wipes, so I'm hoping that's not the case).

- Chance for an extra mouldering shard!!!

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One Gaze works fine, especially with a high dps group

by Cody Miller @, Music of the Spheres - Never Forgot, Thursday, October 08, 2015, 18:39 (3430 days ago) @ Kahzgul

- Players who have held the gaze get a debuff which prevents them from holding the gaze again.

I like this idea, that way people have to rotate in and out of the pit.

Also the best way to kill him is to nuke him from orbit. It's the only way to be sure.

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One Gaze works fine, especially with a high dps group

by Beorn @, <End of Failed Timeline>, Thursday, October 08, 2015, 18:41 (3430 days ago) @ Kahzgul

- The tablet fills in 3 deaths (or instantly if anyone dies, but I hate insta-wipes, so I'm hoping that's not the case).

I was thinking that losing his gaze would activate a tablet rune...

But yeah, we had a high-DPS team do the one-gaze method and it worked exceptionally well.

One Gaze works fine, especially with a high dps group

by someotherguy, Hertfordshire, England, Thursday, October 08, 2015, 18:55 (3430 days ago) @ Kahzgul

we downed him in 4 total gazes with a strong DPS team. Very, very easy.

Then it should be even easier doing it Front-to-Back.

One-gaze might work well for you, but there's no advantage to it over Front-to-Back.

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One Gaze works fine, especially with a high dps group

by Kahzgul, Thursday, October 08, 2015, 19:09 (3430 days ago) @ someotherguy

we downed him in 4 total gazes with a strong DPS team. Very, very easy.


Then it should be even easier doing it Front-to-Back.

One-gaze might work well for you, but there's no advantage to it over Front-to-Back.

The advantage is I raid with three (THREE) guys who are just awful at anything more complicated than "shoot that guy." Even "Shoot that guy in the belly took several hours before one of them announced, proudly "Guys, I do way more damage if I shoot him in the glowing spot on his belly!" cue the /picardfacepalm ascii art.

it took these guys 3 hours to clear the first jumping puzzle.

So for us, the simplest strategy is always the best. We can have, at most, 3 guys doing anything remotely involved in understanding fight mechanics, and then the other 3 guys just stand around shooting stuff. Our oryx fight strategy is to take so long with endless wipes that the three Tacos sign off to sleep, and then we go on LFG and down Oryx on the very next try.

Ha, his may be the one exception

by someotherguy, Hertfordshire, England, Thursday, October 08, 2015, 19:10 (3430 days ago) @ Kahzgul

Though technically you only need 2 people who know what they're doing.

But yeah, you've mentioned these guys before. They sound... fun?

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Ha, his may be the one exception

by Kahzgul, Thursday, October 08, 2015, 19:16 (3430 days ago) @ someotherguy

They're really good, nice, funny guys. They just suck at video games. As explained to me by the guy who deleted his sword by accident: "I have a hard, stressful job. I come home to kill things and not think. If you want me to think, I'll go play something else where I don't have to think."

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Let's Talk Golgoroth *Raid Sp*

by cheapLEY @, Thursday, October 08, 2015, 19:18 (3430 days ago) @ someotherguy

I haven't tried the one gaze method, and I'm not inclined to. It doesn't sound all the much fun.

We did the Left and Right method for both times I've done it, and it works well. The first time we were obviously still figuring out the encounter, but the second time went really smoothly.

We only used three damage dealers in the pit. Our extra man stayed up on the platform with the gaze holders to help pop bubbles and to keep overwatch on Cursed Thrall for the damage dealers. It allowed the three of us to stay in the pit for all six bubbles with only occasionally having to divert focus from Golgoroth to kill a thrall. Granted two of us had 310 Black Spindles which helps immensely.

That encounter was a real bitch for us to figure out, but when we faced him the next week, it is an incredibly fun encounter.

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Can confirm, worked great

by ZackDark @, Not behind you. NO! Don't look., Thursday, October 08, 2015, 21:03 (3430 days ago) @ cheapLEY

Gaze-runners don't even have to blow up the Axion Bolts. You can run right past them and back multiple times without being hurt. Just be careful about where Golgoroth is facing, since you could potentially make the chest harder to hit.

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This remains the best strategy I've seen, by far

by CruelLEGACEY @, Toronto, Thursday, October 08, 2015, 19:30 (3430 days ago) @ someotherguy


This method rules because:

1) The players in the pit can focus 100% of their attention on damaging the boss and managing thrall. No need to worry about hitting the orbs as they rotate around.

2) The 2 players up top rotate in such a way that they are already in position when they take Golgoroth's gaze, meaning the players down low don't need to wait for the gaze holder to steer the boss towards the puddle.


This really is so much smoother and more effective than any other method I've seen so far :)

Yep, this is essentially the Side-to-Side method

by someotherguy, Hertfordshire, England, Thursday, October 08, 2015, 19:35 (3430 days ago) @ CruelLEGACEY

This is how we do it too, but with the "Support" player in the pit.

I mainly recommend the Front-to-Back just because this puts a lot of responsibility on the gaze-holders. If they're good enough though this is definitely the fastest, cleanest way to beat him.

I think this is the strategy that we came up with

by Monochron, Thursday, October 08, 2015, 19:44 (3430 days ago) @ CruelLEGACEY

Though I can't watch the video right now :) I'm guessing both gazers alternate from shooting venom balls and knocking down the orb puddles, and the other 4 are in the pit doing damage. We also called out one person in the pit to work on Cursed Thralls when they show up. It seems to utilize everyone most effectively so that no one has any down time.
Takes a lot of concentration and communication but once we got the rhythm down it was easily one of my favorite Raid experiences.

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yep, that's it :)

by CruelLEGACEY @, Toronto, Thursday, October 08, 2015, 19:45 (3430 days ago) @ Monochron

- No text -

Us last-geners done be smart!

by Monochron, Thursday, October 08, 2015, 19:46 (3430 days ago) @ CruelLEGACEY

- No text -

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This remains the best strategy I've seen, by far

by slycrel ⌂, Thursday, October 08, 2015, 20:46 (3430 days ago) @ CruelLEGACEY

Agreed.

Note for the support guy in the pit. Stormcaller is fantastic during the taken phase. Chaining and extending the stormcaller length helps a lot here.

Also note that the armor abilities that pick up orbs to regen your grenades or melee work against you here as you want to hit stormcaller and still have a lot of orbs available for pickup from the guys DPSing the boss down hard. Otherwise the taken can be harder to deal with and interrupt the DPSers.

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+1

by CruelLEGACEY @, Toronto, Thursday, October 08, 2015, 21:13 (3430 days ago) @ slycrel

Agreed.

Note for the support guy in the pit. Stormcaller is fantastic during the taken phase. Chaining and extending the stormcaller length helps a lot here.

The idea of fighting that boss without having you running around the pit electrocuting everything makes me scared :D

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This remains the best strategy I've seen, by far

by Kahzgul, Thursday, October 08, 2015, 20:57 (3430 days ago) @ CruelLEGACEY

I imagine this is the "as intended" strategy. Also that guy's vids are excellent (and he put this one up *quickly* after the initial raid came out, which is even more impressive).

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+1

by dogcow @, Hiding from Bob, in the vent core., Friday, October 09, 2015, 12:42 (3429 days ago) @ someotherguy

I ran some numbers on it the other week & decided that the best method is likely a few (3?) globes/gazes, but not the full 6 as people start to run out of ammo and supers toward the end of all 6 globes.

Speaking of Ammo

by someotherguy, Hertfordshire, England, Friday, October 09, 2015, 13:17 (3429 days ago) @ dogcow

I showed Chaos, Destroyo and Yapok this method yesterday and they found another benefit - You can take 10-15 seconds between Orbs to forage for ammo or pop a synth if necessary, without worrying about adds or being shot by Big G. Keeps your DpS up without slowing you down.

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