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Really putting their best foot forward with this one . . . (Destiny)

by cheapLEY @, Tuesday, November 28, 2023, 17:19 (91 days ago)

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Really putting their best foot forward with this one . . .

by ManKitten, The Stugotz is strong in me., Wednesday, November 29, 2023, 06:10 (91 days ago) @ cheapLEY

That article is a pretty sour rant coming from a webpage smacking me in the face with the most advertisements I've ever seen on one page.

I don't see anything wrong with them selling that pack. Buy it or don't.

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Really putting their best foot forward with this one . . .

by cheapLEY @, Wednesday, November 29, 2023, 07:09 (91 days ago) @ ManKitten
edited by cheapLEY, Wednesday, November 29, 2023, 07:20

I don't see anything wrong with them selling that pack. Buy it or don't.

And that’s the reason Destiny is the game it is. No one sees a problem with paying nearly 1/3 the price of a brand new video game for shit that just exists in the game you own.

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Really putting their best foot forward with this one . . .

by ManKitten, The Stugotz is strong in me., Wednesday, November 29, 2023, 08:00 (91 days ago) @ cheapLEY

I don't see anything wrong with them selling that pack. Buy it or don't.


And that’s the reason Destiny is the game it is. No one sees a problem with paying nearly 1/3 the price of a brand new video game for shit that just exists in the game you own.

This isn't a Destiny problem, it's a gaming problem. CoD has 10 bundles like this for sale at any given time. But CoD has always been like this. Destiny has become this. They are just catching up with the times.

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Really putting their best foot forward with this one . . .

by Korny @, Dalton, Ga. US. Earth, Sol System, Wednesday, November 29, 2023, 11:37 (90 days ago) @ ManKitten

I don't see anything wrong with them selling that pack. Buy it or don't.


And that’s the reason Destiny is the game it is. No one sees a problem with paying nearly 1/3 the price of a brand new video game for shit that just exists in the game you own.


This isn't a Destiny problem, it's a gaming problem. CoD has 10 bundles like this for sale at any given time. But CoD has always been like this. Destiny has become this. They are just catching up with the times.

Not all Microtransactions are created equal, though. CoD bundles are all exclusive gear, finishers, skins, customizables, unlocks, and currencies. You generally can't get them anywhere else. It's sometimes frustrating ("pay-to-win" packs have always divided the playerbase), but more often it's just another avenue for building on what you enjoy using, or expressing yourself (Seeing Sammy run around as Ash Williams, wielding a Hellsing-themed Primary and Nicki Minaj secondary that shoots pink tracer rounds is something else, but I've never seen more joy in bloodlust coming from her).

This Destiny bundle is exactly what you'd find in a Gacha game: An overpriced work skip that gives you a meager amount of in-game resources, and in this instance, three weapons that are already free with the Shadowkeep Ciphers.
I'm honestly surprised this bundle didn't include Sweet Business, Riskrunner, and Tractor Cannon instead, lol, and really screw over those New Lights.

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Really putting their best foot forward with this one . . .

by Cody Miller @, Music of the Spheres - Never Forgot, Wednesday, November 29, 2023, 07:30 (91 days ago) @ ManKitten

That article is a pretty sour rant coming from a webpage smacking me in the face with the most advertisements I've ever seen on one page.

Get. An. Ad. Blocker.

The internet is 10000x better with one.

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Really putting their best foot forward with this one . . .

by Coaxkez, Wednesday, November 29, 2023, 08:59 (91 days ago) @ Cody Miller

[image]

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Really putting their best foot forward with this one . . .

by Cody Miller @, Music of the Spheres - Never Forgot, Wednesday, November 29, 2023, 10:08 (90 days ago) @ Coaxkez
edited by Cody Miller, Wednesday, November 29, 2023, 10:50

[image]

Haven't seen that for weeks now that the ad blockers have caught on. Also… not Dark Mode! OWWWW MY EYES

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How do you even internet without...

by INSANEdrive, ಥ_ಥ | f(ಠ‿↼)z | ᕕ( ᐛ )ᕗ| ¯\_(ツ)_/¯, Wednesday, November 29, 2023, 17:19 (90 days ago) @ Coaxkez

Also, you're using anything other than Chrome, right? No idea if this effects other chromium browsers.

Blah blah, I miss the old internet. At least if I got a virus, it was because of taking a wrong turn in my academic pursuits on Kazaa, not because of some malvertising trash.

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How do you even internet without...

by kidtsunami @, Atlanta, GA, Wednesday, November 29, 2023, 17:20 (90 days ago) @ INSANEdrive

Also, you're using anything other than Chrome, right? No idea if this effects other chromium browsers.

Blah blah, I miss the old internet. At least if I got a virus, it was because of taking a wrong turn in my academic pursuits on Kazaa, not because of some malvertising trash.

This isn't a brag or anything, but I've never bothered with any of this.

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:O !

by INSANEdrive, ಥ_ಥ | f(ಠ‿↼)z | ᕕ( ᐛ )ᕗ| ¯\_(ツ)_/¯, Wednesday, November 29, 2023, 17:30 (90 days ago) @ kidtsunami

Also, you're using anything other than Chrome, right? No idea if this effects other chromium browsers.

Blah blah, I miss the old internet. At least if I got a virus, it was because of taking a wrong turn in my academic pursuits on Kazaa, not because of some malvertising trash.


This isn't a brag or anything, but I've never bothered with any of this.

You... you have all this power, and... and you don't use it?! *Confused Warlock Noises*

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I just don't notice them...

by kidtsunami @, Atlanta, GA, Wednesday, November 29, 2023, 18:57 (90 days ago) @ INSANEdrive

Also, you're using anything other than Chrome, right? No idea if this effects other chromium browsers.

Blah blah, I miss the old internet. At least if I got a virus, it was because of taking a wrong turn in my academic pursuits on Kazaa, not because of some malvertising trash.


This isn't a brag or anything, but I've never bothered with any of this.


You... you have all this power, and... and you don't use it?! *Confused Warlock Noises*

My dad would obnoxiously mute the TV during commercials and then fail to unmute when things turned back on. That lead to me carefully considering how much I wanted to thrash about shit that didn't really bother me.

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For the record

by kidtsunami @, Atlanta, GA, Wednesday, November 29, 2023, 19:39 (90 days ago) @ kidtsunami

Also, you're using anything other than Chrome, right? No idea if this effects other chromium browsers.

Blah blah, I miss the old internet. At least if I got a virus, it was because of taking a wrong turn in my academic pursuits on Kazaa, not because of some malvertising trash.


This isn't a brag or anything, but I've never bothered with any of this.


You... you have all this power, and... and you don't use it?! *Confused Warlock Noises*


My dad would obnoxiously mute the TV during commercials and then fail to unmute when things turned back on. That lead to me carefully considering how much I wanted to thrash about shit that didn't really bother me.

I care more about inefficiently built websites than I do about ads. If the ads are making them inefficient then sure ok.

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How do you even internet without...

by Coaxkez, Wednesday, November 29, 2023, 18:28 (90 days ago) @ INSANEdrive

I don’t mind ads and never venture into the sordid realm of sites like Xvideos anymore.

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Really putting their best foot forward with this one . . .

by cheapLEY @, Wednesday, November 29, 2023, 09:15 (91 days ago) @ Cody Miller

Ad block and reader mode is the only thing keeping the internet useable at all at this point.

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This is silly

by Robot Chickens, Wednesday, November 29, 2023, 09:35 (90 days ago) @ cheapLEY
edited by Robot Chickens, Wednesday, November 29, 2023, 09:58

Aren't all of these weapons that shipped in seasonal content? You can't get them through gameplay anymore so you would need to use expensive exotics kiosk? I'm not saying anybody should run out and buy it because it's a great deal or that these are essential weapons or anything. It just seems like this is an alternative way to get locked guns that may be cool if you're starting out (guns everyone else got for much more when they bought the season's they were associated with). These guns are relatively unique and fun without being over-powered (isn't that how exotics should be?) If they were "essential" guns, everyone would scream pay-to-win blah blah blah.

Eh, this just feels a bit like manufactured outrage over something that has existed for the entirety of Destiny.

Remember the Taken King preorder bonus with the vanguard arsenal. "Guardians will receive a Vanguard themed Auto Rifle, Pulse Rifle, and Side arm."

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This is silly

by Coaxkez, Thursday, November 30, 2023, 10:11 (89 days ago) @ Robot Chickens

You're fundamentally right. It's just really bad timing because of the optics.

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This is silly

by Robot Chickens, Friday, December 01, 2023, 07:40 (89 days ago) @ Coaxkez

You're fundamentally right. It's just really bad timing because of the optics.

That’s fair. I just think it’s weird people who should know better (ie not new people) are clutching their pearls, and therefore outraged by this. It’s more about clicks than legitimate surprise for this story. This game lets you pay to boost levels on the seasonal track ffs. I’m not saying that’s a good thing. It’s just what the game is, and has been for a long time.

If someone wants to do a deep dive into how these systems work together to cheapen an experience, I’d be all for it. On its own, this article is just bad play-acting by someone doing their best attempt at what an offended person might sound like.

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This is silly

by Cody Miller @, Music of the Spheres - Never Forgot, Thursday, November 30, 2023, 12:40 (89 days ago) @ Robot Chickens

Eh, this just feels a bit like manufactured outrage over something that has existed for the entirety of Destiny.

Huh. Remind me when expansions from the first year locked you out of old exotics. I can't seem to recall that.

This is silly

by Claude Errera @, Thursday, November 30, 2023, 13:23 (89 days ago) @ Cody Miller

Eh, this just feels a bit like manufactured outrage over something that has existed for the entirety of Destiny.


Huh. Remind me when expansions from the first year locked you out of old exotics. I can't seem to recall that.

Wait, what? There's nothing in this starter pack that locks you out of old exotics. There's nothing in the current Destiny that locks you out of those exotics; you can still get them the regular way. This is just a different way. What are you on about?

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This is silly

by Cody Miller @, Music of the Spheres - Never Forgot, Thursday, November 30, 2023, 13:38 (89 days ago) @ Claude Errera

Wait, what? There's nothing in this starter pack that locks you out of old exotics. There's nothing in the current Destiny that locks you out of those exotics; you can still get them the regular way. This is just a different way. What are you on about?

Aren't all of these weapons that shipped in seasonal content? You can't get them through gameplay anymore so you would need to use expensive exotics kiosk?

Is what he said untrue?

This is silly

by Claude Errera @, Thursday, November 30, 2023, 13:44 (89 days ago) @ Cody Miller

Wait, what? There's nothing in this starter pack that locks you out of old exotics. There's nothing in the current Destiny that locks you out of those exotics; you can still get them the regular way. This is just a different way. What are you on about?

Aren't all of these weapons that shipped in seasonal content? You can't get them through gameplay anymore so you would need to use expensive exotics kiosk?


Is what he said untrue?

No, it's not untrue, but it's irrelevant. There are MANY exotics that are only available through the exotics kiosk; it's been that way for a long time. (In fact, 2 days ago the prices on the kiosk dropped dramatically, so it's better now than it's been for many months.)

Before this pack was offered, the only way to get those exotics was through the kiosk (along with dozens of others). The starter pack provided a different path for these three exotics - but the old way (the old way from last week, not the old way from 5 years ago) is still perfectly valid.

All of this is moot, the starter pack is no longer available.

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This is silly

by Robot Chickens, Friday, December 01, 2023, 07:27 (89 days ago) @ Cody Miller
edited by Robot Chickens, Friday, December 01, 2023, 07:41

Eh, this just feels a bit like manufactured outrage over something that has existed for the entirety of Destiny.


Huh. Remind me when expansions from the first year locked you out of old exotics. I can't seem to recall that.

Snark only works if it fits the situation. I think you may be too far removed from the game and its systems to be able to parse my words well. This is not your fault because there are tons of systems in the game and there’s been a lot of history. It’s easy to get lost in it.

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This is silly

by Cody Miller @, Music of the Spheres - Never Forgot, Friday, December 01, 2023, 07:42 (89 days ago) @ Robot Chickens

Eh, this just feels a bit like manufactured outrage over something that has existed for the entirety of Destiny.


Huh. Remind me when expansions from the first year locked you out of old exotics. I can't seem to recall that.


Snark only works if it fits the situation. I think you may be too far removed from the game to be able to parse my words. Admittedly, this is not your fault because there are tons of systems in the game and there’s been a lot of history. It’s easy to get lost in it.

Someone explained it to me… and I still don't get it. So you're right.

But that itself is also a problem in terms of sheer complexity.

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This is silly

by Robot Chickens, Friday, December 01, 2023, 07:46 (89 days ago) @ Cody Miller

Eh, this just feels a bit like manufactured outrage over something that has existed for the entirety of Destiny.


Huh. Remind me when expansions from the first year locked you out of old exotics. I can't seem to recall that.


Snark only works if it fits the situation. I think you may be too far removed from the game to be able to parse my words. Admittedly, this is not your fault because there are tons of systems in the game and there’s been a lot of history. It’s easy to get lost in it.


Someone explained it to me… and I still don't get it. So you're right.

But that itself is also a problem in terms of sheer complexity.

The complexity is the liability of a long history. It’s almost as if telling a continuous story for 10 years on 2 engines may be a bad decision.

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This is silly

by Cody Miller @, Music of the Spheres - Never Forgot, Friday, December 01, 2023, 11:03 (88 days ago) @ Robot Chickens

Eh, this just feels a bit like manufactured outrage over something that has existed for the entirety of Destiny.


Huh. Remind me when expansions from the first year locked you out of old exotics. I can't seem to recall that.


Snark only works if it fits the situation. I think you may be too far removed from the game to be able to parse my words. Admittedly, this is not your fault because there are tons of systems in the game and there’s been a lot of history. It’s easy to get lost in it.


Someone explained it to me… and I still don't get it. So you're right.

But that itself is also a problem in terms of sheer complexity.


The complexity is the liability of a long history. It’s almost as if telling a continuous story for 10 years on 2 engines may be a bad decision.

The irony is, that there was more / better story in 9 years of Halo as traditional game releases, than 10 years of Destiny as live service.

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This is silly

by kidtsunami @, Atlanta, GA, Friday, December 01, 2023, 11:10 (88 days ago) @ Cody Miller

Eh, this just feels a bit like manufactured outrage over something that has existed for the entirety of Destiny.


Huh. Remind me when expansions from the first year locked you out of old exotics. I can't seem to recall that.


Snark only works if it fits the situation. I think you may be too far removed from the game to be able to parse my words. Admittedly, this is not your fault because there are tons of systems in the game and there’s been a lot of history. It’s easy to get lost in it.


Someone explained it to me… and I still don't get it. So you're right.

But that itself is also a problem in terms of sheer complexity.


The complexity is the liability of a long history. It’s almost as if telling a continuous story for 10 years on 2 engines may be a bad decision.


The irony is, that there was more / better story in 9 years of Halo as traditional game releases, than 10 years of Destiny as live service.

But... you don't know what the story has been for god knows how many years?

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This is silly

by Cody Miller @, Music of the Spheres - Never Forgot, Friday, December 01, 2023, 12:44 (88 days ago) @ kidtsunami

Eh, this just feels a bit like manufactured outrage over something that has existed for the entirety of Destiny.


Huh. Remind me when expansions from the first year locked you out of old exotics. I can't seem to recall that.


Snark only works if it fits the situation. I think you may be too far removed from the game to be able to parse my words. Admittedly, this is not your fault because there are tons of systems in the game and there’s been a lot of history. It’s easy to get lost in it.


Someone explained it to me… and I still don't get it. So you're right.

But that itself is also a problem in terms of sheer complexity.


The complexity is the liability of a long history. It’s almost as if telling a continuous story for 10 years on 2 engines may be a bad decision.


The irony is, that there was more / better story in 9 years of Halo as traditional game releases, than 10 years of Destiny as live service.


But... you don't know what the story has been for god knows how many years?

5 years to the day on December 23rd. Thank you for asking.

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My Theory

by Robot Chickens, Friday, December 01, 2023, 11:51 (88 days ago) @ Cody Miller

The complexity is the liability of a long history. It’s almost as if telling a continuous story for 10 years on 2 engines may be a bad decision.


The irony is, that there was more / better story in 9 years of Halo as traditional game releases, than 10 years of Destiny as live service.

I've got a whole diatribe I've been thinking about for a while now.

If you want to tell a long form story, the world of that story needs to change. Actions end up feeling meaningless if the world is static.

Traditional games like Halo never let you go back to places unless there was a narrative reason for it and when that happened, the environment changed to reflect the story. Halo CE is perfect at delivering this sense of narrative impact and environmental story-telling. RPGs often include different environment states depending on where you are in the story.

Always-on mmos? You can only change the state of the environment with a great amount of work. If you do, it's likely that old content is unplayable and you've cut off a portion of your fan-base who can't play the stuff the paid for. Everybody loved sunsetting right? Unfortunately, that is the only way for those environments to experience change when they come back. Thus, the narrative feels like you're resetting the stage every few months and none of the threats are real. Every emergency feels contrived. In Halo, the threat of the Covenant wiping out all life was a real potential option. The threat of the Red Legion? Nah, yet they still stalk the European Dead Zone.

Now let's also consider that the game-clock of Destiny's experienced timeline is tied to our own world's passage of time. This is a narrative shackle that robs story-tellers of the ability to jump forward to allow for significant context changes. Imagine if we wrapped up Destiny 1 having defeated the Taken King and put things right in the system for several years. How much more disruptive would the Red War have felt if that plot-line of the Cabal fleeing the Hive took a while to come to fruition as they stormed our system? As it stands, everything is on fire all the time and the pacing just feels off.

With the pairing of this time-line shackle and the inability to easily change the world easily, it is incredibly difficult to tell a story that has any stakes or costs.

Destiny could have been a 10-year story if every installment changed or had a realistic impact on previous game-spaces. Lately, they've been getting a little more clever in how they reference the past which is a good thing. They are still doing it with one arm tied behind their back though.

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Bingo

by Cody Miller @, Music of the Spheres - Never Forgot, Friday, December 01, 2023, 12:43 (88 days ago) @ Robot Chickens

- No text -

My Theory

by EffortlessFury @, Friday, December 01, 2023, 15:55 (88 days ago) @ Robot Chickens

The complexity is the liability of a long history. It’s almost as if telling a continuous story for 10 years on 2 engines may be a bad decision.


The irony is, that there was more / better story in 9 years of Halo as traditional game releases, than 10 years of Destiny as live service.


I've got a whole diatribe I've been thinking about for a while now.

If you want to tell a long form story, the world of that story needs to change. Actions end up feeling meaningless if the world is static.

Traditional games like Halo never let you go back to places unless there was a narrative reason for it and when that happened, the environment changed to reflect the story. Halo CE is perfect at delivering this sense of narrative impact and environmental story-telling. RPGs often include different environment states depending on where you are in the story.

Always-on mmos? You can only change the state of the environment with a great amount of work. If you do, it's likely that old content is unplayable and you've cut off a portion of your fan-base who can't play the stuff the paid for. Everybody loved sunsetting right? Unfortunately, that is the only way for those environments to experience change when they come back. Thus, the narrative feels like you're resetting the stage every few months and none of the threats are real. Every emergency feels contrived. In Halo, the threat of the Covenant wiping out all life was a real potential option. The threat of the Red Legion? Nah, yet they still stalk the European Dead Zone.

Now let's also consider that the game-clock of Destiny's experienced timeline is tied to our own world's passage of time. This is a narrative shackle that robs story-tellers of the ability to jump forward to allow for significant context changes. Imagine if we wrapped up Destiny 1 having defeated the Taken King and put things right in the system for several years. How much more disruptive would the Red War have felt if that plot-line of the Cabal fleeing the Hive took a while to come to fruition as they stormed our system? As it stands, everything is on fire all the time and the pacing just feels off.

With the pairing of this time-line shackle and the inability to easily change the world easily, it is incredibly difficult to tell a story that has any stakes or costs.

Destiny could have been a 10-year story if every installment changed or had a realistic impact on previous game-spaces. Lately, they've been getting a little more clever in how they reference the past which is a good thing. They are still doing it with one arm tied behind their back though.

Another example case along this line of thought is Genshin Impact. Genshin is a single player game, for all intents and purposes, so it doesn't have the problem Destiny and other MMOs have; I bring it up, however, as it is a regularly evolving game and does involve some form of these kinds of changes. They add new sections to the map, quests in these areas can permanently add or remove content in the world. Some quests do even more than that (change a bunch of in-game item text and dialogue to reflect a change in history). The game does have co-op, however, and any of those world changes would be reflected when people visit your instance.

So, like a classically styled single player game, the world can evolve and change as the narrative progresses without being hindered by other players' progress, while still being a "live service" that adds new content and story on a regular basis.

But as for the dream of having games that are shared spaces but that also evolve and change, you run into the idea of whether game content should be transient. This wouldn't be an issue if time you spend away is the same as time spent not participating in whatever conflict is on-going, and when you return you are brought up to speed. A cool concept, but at the same time, that means a bunch of content is inaccessible forever, and there's an argument that this isn't worth the experience it provides.

Genshin does dabble with this issue as well. It has events every patch that come and go, and do not (as of now) rerun. They have story, characters are involved and can have development, you might learn new information about the world that foreshadows what is to come. If you weren't playing at the time, you don't get to experience that content. That means everyone does these events together and experiences them as fixed points in time, but that also means a bunch of novel content is lost to time.

There's no good solution to emulating a shared experience that involves the passage of time without being willing to accept that the content, like the passing of time itself, must be transient.

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And therein lies the problem

by ZackDark @, Not behind you. NO! Don't look., Saturday, December 02, 2023, 17:55 (87 days ago) @ EffortlessFury

There's no good solution to emulating a shared experience that involves the passage of time without being willing to accept that the content, like the passing of time itself, must be transient.

That can only really be implemented in free-to-play games. Remember when Mercury, Mars and the Tangled Shore got vaulted? They were paid content. Specific DLC people could only access if bought. And they're gone. There's a very good reason for people to hate this, even if there was a lore reason for them to be gone.

This sour taste directly clashes with the vision of a "shared, evolving world". As long as Destiny ties destinations and activities to paid DLC, it will never be totally free to evolve the world. Either that or they'll piss off a lot of people REALLY fast (again).

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And therein lies the problem

by Cody Miller @, Music of the Spheres - Never Forgot, Sunday, December 03, 2023, 07:37 (87 days ago) @ ZackDark
edited by Cody Miller, Sunday, December 03, 2023, 07:41

There's no good solution to emulating a shared experience that involves the passage of time without being willing to accept that the content, like the passing of time itself, must be transient.


That can only really be implemented in free-to-play games. Remember when Mercury, Mars and the Tangled Shore got vaulted? They were paid content. Specific DLC people could only access if bought. And they're gone. There's a very good reason for people to hate this, even if there was a lore reason for them to be gone.

This sour taste directly clashes with the vision of a "shared, evolving world". As long as Destiny ties destinations and activities to paid DLC, it will never be totally free to evolve the world. Either that or they'll piss off a lot of people REALLY fast (again).

Hmmm. So hypothetically, if you had a game that was free to play, and all activities were freely accessible (and attainable, not locked behind technically-possible-but-only-reasonable-if-you-buy-a-booster grinds), and the things that you actually paid for were permanent, then you could actually do an evolving game with changing narrative stakes and situations?

[image]

(Pictured: Everyone else in the world except me)

And therein lies the problem

by EffortlessFury @, Sunday, December 03, 2023, 07:46 (87 days ago) @ Cody Miller

There's no good solution to emulating a shared experience that involves the passage of time without being willing to accept that the content, like the passing of time itself, must be transient.


That can only really be implemented in free-to-play games. Remember when Mercury, Mars and the Tangled Shore got vaulted? They were paid content. Specific DLC people could only access if bought. And they're gone. There's a very good reason for people to hate this, even if there was a lore reason for them to be gone.

This sour taste directly clashes with the vision of a "shared, evolving world". As long as Destiny ties destinations and activities to paid DLC, it will never be totally free to evolve the world. Either that or they'll piss off a lot of people REALLY fast (again).


Hmmm. So hypothetically, if you had a game that was free to play, and all activities were freely accessible (and attainable, not locked behind technically-possible-but-only-reasonable-if-you-buy-a-booster grinds), and the things that you actually paid for were permanent, then you could actually do an evolving game with changing narrative stakes and situations?

[image]

(Pictured: Everyone else in the world except me)

Yeah, I mean, I think that's a totally fair offering. Game preservation would obviously not be possible, and that may not be a worthwhile trade for some people (I know you're one such person), but I would argue that it's a fair proposition to make "actually free" content limited. That's every limited event in Genshin. Free story, free new minigames, gives you free currency and materials, sometimes free limited weapons or gifts a character for playing it, and the only thing stopping you is sometimes you need to be caught up with (at least some of) the story. Free content with rewards for consuming it, but it's all temporary.

Now, of course, this can create a sense of FOMO, and that has its own issues, but that is the nature of anything that evolves/changes over time. If you want an experience that emulates that nature, it will inherently involve FOMO.

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And therein lies the problem

by Joe Duplessie (SNIPE 316) ⌂ @, Detroit, Sunday, December 03, 2023, 09:10 (87 days ago) @ EffortlessFury

Game preservation would obviously not be possible...

I wouldn't bet on that. Look at Insignia (OG Xbox Live brought back online by fans) or Sunrise (Halo 3 server replacement). Even Destiny 1 was recently reverse-engineered.

Point being, even online titles are being preserved these days.

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How about all the versions of WoW?

by ZackDark @, Not behind you. NO! Don't look., Sunday, December 03, 2023, 16:56 (86 days ago) @ Joe Duplessie (SNIPE 316)

- No text -

And therein lies the problem

by EffortlessFury @, Tuesday, December 05, 2023, 16:52 (84 days ago) @ Joe Duplessie (SNIPE 316)

Game preservation would obviously not be possible...


I wouldn't bet on that. Look at Insignia (OG Xbox Live brought back online by fans) or Sunrise (Halo 3 server replacement). Even Destiny 1 was recently reverse-engineered.

Point being, even online titles are being preserved these days.

As hopeful as I am, event scripts aren't client side anymore, so it'd have to be manually reconstructed. Possible, but not perfect.

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My Theory

by cheapLEY @, Wednesday, December 06, 2023, 16:43 (83 days ago) @ EffortlessFury

Genshin does dabble with this issue as well. It has events every patch that come and go, and do not (as of now) rerun. They have story, characters are involved and can have development, you might learn new information about the world that foreshadows what is to come. If you weren't playing at the time, you don't get to experience that content. That means everyone does these events together and experiences them as fixed points in time, but that also means a bunch of novel content is lost to time.

It's only tangentially relevant, but Genshin benefits in this regard by being free. It doesn't ask for $100 a year to see all the content, so it's not quite the same kick in the teeth when the events go away.

That doesn't mean its perfect. I really love Genshin, but I haven't played since 4.0 because it's just another thing to keep up with, and being free doesn't really solve that. Missing some of the bigger story events still hurts and is a real killer of my motivation to continue playing.

My Theory

by EffortlessFury @, Thursday, December 07, 2023, 02:56 (83 days ago) @ cheapLEY

Genshin does dabble with this issue as well. It has events every patch that come and go, and do not (as of now) rerun. They have story, characters are involved and can have development, you might learn new information about the world that foreshadows what is to come. If you weren't playing at the time, you don't get to experience that content. That means everyone does these events together and experiences them as fixed points in time, but that also means a bunch of novel content is lost to time.


It's only tangentially relevant, but Genshin benefits in this regard by being free. It doesn't ask for $100 a year to see all the content, so it's not quite the same kick in the teeth when the events go away.

That doesn't mean its perfect. I really love Genshin, but I haven't played since 4.0 because it's just another thing to keep up with, and being free doesn't really solve that. Missing some of the bigger story events still hurts and is a real killer of my motivation to continue playing.

Understandable and I don't blame you. I don't think the event stories are necessary to the enjoyment of the permanent content but it is a shame to miss any of it as it is usually very good content.

That said, boy, the Fontaine AQ was the best story the game has put out yet. Much in the way that Halo ARGs and the overall story unfolded in the olden days, the experience of Genshin's unfolding mystery is something that (even if perfectly preserved in the future) can not be properly experienced without having been there; this isn't a defense of any of their content development decisions, but part of the reason why I am so attached to continuing to play it. It's the kind of experience I love and that very few things have ever managed to successfully offer.

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Bungie actually put their tail between their legs this time.

by Korny @, Dalton, Ga. US. Earth, Sol System, Wednesday, November 29, 2023, 16:03 (90 days ago) @ cheapLEY

Realizing that they couldn’t slink by quietly and get away with it, they’ve slowly pulled the bundle from all storefronts.

They’ve also put out a mea culpa tweet.

No refunds tho.

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Bungie actually put their tail between their legs this time.

by Cody Miller @, Music of the Spheres - Never Forgot, Wednesday, November 29, 2023, 16:11 (90 days ago) @ Korny

They’ve also put out a

.

[image]

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lol

by kidtsunami @, Atlanta, GA, Wednesday, November 29, 2023, 16:47 (90 days ago) @ Korny

lol

by Claude Errera @, Thursday, November 30, 2023, 08:03 (90 days ago) @ kidtsunami

Heh - I thought that was faked at first. It's not. It doesn't SEEM harder; it seems identical to when I stopped playing in it because it wasn't fun. It DOES drop new loot, though, and you can't avoid it in the story progression. So I'll go in when they make me. But they won't convince me it's more fun.

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lol

by cheapLEY @, Thursday, November 30, 2023, 09:32 (89 days ago) @ Claude Errera

Genuinely asking, and not trying to be snarky—is it actually new loot, or is it Dreaming City weapons reissued for the third or fourth time now?

lol

by Claude Errera @, Thursday, November 30, 2023, 13:20 (89 days ago) @ cheapLEY

Genuinely asking, and not trying to be snarky—is it actually new loot, or is it Dreaming City weapons reissued for the third or fourth time now?

It's reissued dreaming city weapons, again. The perks have not been available before.

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lol

by cheapLEY @, Thursday, November 30, 2023, 14:06 (89 days ago) @ Claude Errera

Genuinely asking, and not trying to be snarky—is it actually new loot, or is it Dreaming City weapons reissued for the third or fourth time now?


It's reissued dreaming city weapons, again. The perks have not been available before.

That’s something then. For the most part, I like the way they handled seasonal weapons. The new stuff was always cool, and even though I hate the decisions that made it necessary, each season also having a selection of reissued weapons worked for me. It always kinda sucked not really knowing where I could get any particular old weapon as they got filtered into different loot pools, though.

lol

by Claude Errera @, Thursday, November 30, 2023, 14:24 (89 days ago) @ cheapLEY

If I go to D2Foundry, it shows 2 Vouchsafes; one from season 13, and one from Season 23 (the current season). However, the perk pool for the Season 13 one has a whole bunch of perks that are no longer available... I guess they changed the way they reissued guns at some point. (That is: the first reissue of Vouchsafe, maybe last year? I dunno, added a bunch of perks to the pool, and removed a bunch... but internally it was the same gun. The new one did the same thing... but called it a new gun. (The base stats for both of them are identical.)

Weirdness.

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lol

by cheapLEY @, Thursday, November 30, 2023, 19:25 (89 days ago) @ Claude Errera

I thought they had always been doing that with reissued weapons. I can't recall another set of weapons that has been reissued twice, so this might be a new scenario. But they've always updated the perk pools with reissued weapons, I thought. Would you want an Arc gun that couldn't roll Voltshot, for instance (assuming that's even still as good as it was initially)?

D2Foundry doesn't seem to have the original Dreaming City guns in its database, so I can't see what those perks were.

I think that might be it

by Claude Errera @, Friday, December 01, 2023, 08:47 (89 days ago) @ cheapLEY

I thought they had always been doing that with reissued weapons. I can't recall another set of weapons that has been reissued twice, so this might be a new scenario. But they've always updated the perk pools with reissued weapons, I thought. Would you want an Arc gun that couldn't roll Voltshot, for instance (assuming that's even still as good as it was initially)?

D2Foundry doesn't seem to have the original Dreaming City guns in its database, so I can't see what those perks were.

I think the greyed-out perks on the S13 version are the original perks. So the first one shows what it replaced, the second one doesn't need to do that.

(And yes... I was all excited when I got voltshot on a Song of Ir Yut machine gun, until I realized that 1) you have to reload after the kill to proc it, which is rarely convenient on a machine gun, and 2) reload on that gun is just over 4.8 seconds, and voltshot requires a reload within 5.3 seconds of a kill to proc, so you've got less than half a second to make the decision. :)

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in all seriousness, good on them

by kidtsunami @, Atlanta, GA, Wednesday, November 29, 2023, 16:48 (90 days ago) @ Korny

- No text -

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Hey Cheap, do you agree with Datto?

by INSANEdrive, ಥ_ಥ | f(ಠ‿↼)z | ᕕ( ᐛ )ᕗ| ¯\_(ツ)_/¯, Wednesday, November 29, 2023, 17:28 (90 days ago) @ cheapLEY

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Hey Cheap, do you agree with Datto?

by Kermit @, Raleigh, NC, Thursday, November 30, 2023, 06:45 (90 days ago) @ INSANEdrive

Jeebus, someone give that dude a valium.

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Hey Cheap, do you agree with Datto?

by cheapLEY @, Thursday, November 30, 2023, 07:41 (90 days ago) @ Kermit

Jeebus, someone give that dude a valium.

Can you imagine covering Destiny as a job? I’d be an alcoholic by now at the very least. I’m not a huge fan of Datto (fucking obviously), but it’s amazing how level headed he is about the game after a decade. Lord knows it couldn’t be me.

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Hey Cheap, do you agree with Datto?

by INSANEdrive, ಥ_ಥ | f(ಠ‿↼)z | ᕕ( ᐛ )ᕗ| ¯\_(ツ)_/¯, Saturday, December 02, 2023, 11:29 (87 days ago) @ Kermit

Jeebus, someone give that dude a valium.

That's what makes this so interesting actually. Usually, Datto is more or less the "voice of reason" community YouTuber. For him to get so heated is, well... it's a first I've seen.

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