So I got Hard Light from one of the Nightfall strikes this week, but didn't get a chance to use it until today.

Oh. My. God.

Why do I not hear people talking about how amazing this gun is for PvE? Without any upgrades, it staggers level 20 cabal with every single hit. With such a high rate of fire, enemies looked like they were being electrocuted as my rounds hit them. We're talking full-body seizures. It looks hilarious, and they're completely neutralized as long as I'm connecting my shots.

Most fun I've had using an AR in this game by a mile. If Xur ever sells this thing, jump in it :)

I like the gun, but I think it's not all that powerful for an Exotic. It's fun to use, but not optimal for when you need everything to be dead, like now.

Then again, I am a Titan.....

Just got it from VoG and started using it this morning. Firefly? Explosive rounds? Arc damage? Medium range?

I'll be in my bunk.

- No text -

Just got it from VoG and started using it this morning. Firefly? Explosive rounds? Arc damage? Medium range?

I'll be in my bunk.

But if you have both a Hawkmoon and a Fatebringer, you really don't need much else to get you through life...

Just got it from VoG and started using it this morning. Firefly? Explosive rounds? Arc damage? Medium range?

I'll be in my bunk.

But if you have both a Hawkmoon and a Fatebringer, you really don't need much else to get you through life...

Fatebringer has quickly become my default primary weapon. I unlocked my 3rd Fatebringer last night, so now I can just leave one equipped on each character. I also have Thorn and 2 Last Words (all 331s) but I have a hard time justifying the time and energy to upgrade them. I'd much rather use Fatebringer and Icebreaker or Gjallarhorn.

- No text -

It's insane to need 3 weapons to avoid vault swapping.

The metaphor of the vault as a place is bullshit. It does nothing useful for the player and only makes their life more difficult.

It has two benefits for Bungie:

• drives people to the Tower
  
• encourages them to level up 3 copies of the same weapon (so they expend more time in the game doing make-work)

So I got Hard Light from one of the Nightfall strikes this week, but didn't get a chance to use it until today.

Oh. My. God.

Why do I not hear people talking about how amazing this gun is for PvE?

Because while good, it's very situational. With your Cabal example, it's just easier to shoot them once in the face with a handcannon and watch their head explode. It's great when you have to kill lots of bunched thrall quickly, but so is fatebringer. I find it's a decently fun weapon to use, but never really optimal. Unless you need to shoot through a bubble.

Because while good, it's very situational. With your Cabal example, it's just easier to shoot them once in the face with a handcannon and watch their head explode. It's great when you have to kill lots of bunched thrall quickly, but so is fatebringer. I find it's a decently fun weapon to use, but never really optimal. Unless you need to shoot through a bubble.

Does it actually shoot through bubbles? It seems like I've tried this before, but it proved untrue.

- CC

Because while good, it's very situational. With your Cabal example, it's just easier to shoot them once in the face with a handcannon and watch their head explode. It's great when you have to kill lots of bunched thrall quickly, but so is fatebringer. I find it's a decently fun weapon to use, but never really optimal. Unless you need to shoot through a bubble.

Does it actually shoot through bubbles? It seems like I've tried this before, but it proved untrue.

- CC

It shoots through one side. So it can shoot into a bubble, but it won't go out as that's 2 sides.

Because while good, it's very situational. With your Cabal example, it's just easier to shoot them once in the face with a handcannon and watch their head explode. It's great when you have to kill lots of bunched thrall quickly, but so is fatebringer. I find it's a decently fun weapon to use, but never really optimal. Unless you need to shoot through a bubble.

Does it actually shoot through bubbles? It seems like I've tried this before, but it proved untrue.

- CC

It shoots through one side. So it can shoot into a bubble, but it won't go out as that's 2 sides.

Cool. Thanks!

- CC

It's insane to need 3 weapons to avoid vault swapping.

The metaphor of the vault as a place is bullshit. It does nothing useful for the player and only makes their life more difficult.

Not everyone is running 3 characters, dude.

It stores things that I don't need at the moment, so that my inventory is cluttered.

I treat my vault like a bank (and like my bank it has a great interest rate of 0% on my savings there, heyoooooooo): During my play through, I store all my cryptarc consumables there, for when I need them. I'm sitting on like 50 silken codexes- I'll cash them in in an emergency.

I also like to keep my Ascendant materials there, so I don't accidentally use them in the field, or delete them etc.

The vault doesn't make my life hard at all, it keeps it clean, so, you have no argument here.

It has two benefits for Bungie:

• drives people to the Tower
  
• encourages them to level up 3 copies of the same weapon (so they expend more time in the game doing make-work)

I think you're just a wet blanket here.

The Vault drives people to the tower, does it? So does turning in bounties. Or buying new gear. Or seeing Xur. Or cashing in a ship blue print. Or wanting to buy a new shader. Or decoding an engram. Or getting a package from the postmaster that I missed picking up.

So, a lot of things make make going to the tower necessary. I typically don't go to the tower every time I need to do one little thing. I try to make it so that I can do many things in one trip. Sounds like you might be inefficient in managing your travels.

The Vault encourages me to level up 3 copies of the same weapon? Sir, I've not done that a single time, and I come here and complain about the areas where Destiny is a grind like lots of other folks. I only made one extra character, and I did that just to see what it was like. I hardly ever touch my hunter, but I don't want to delete it because of the time I spent on it.

I don't think there are legions of players who are playing this game and farming 3 characters. Does it exist? Oh I bet. But people that play that way aren't playing Destiny for fun, at that point.

Lastly, did you consider that, perhaps, since Destiny is an expansive game, and Bungie is regularly introducing new items (Jack-o-lyte, anyone?) that it may be a way to store things that are added? That you might not need, save for a specific moment? Or what if you are a shotgun connoisseur and you have 10 different kinds that you like, for various encounters?

Yep. Gonna need that vault.

Not everyone is running 3 characters, dude.

I get it: other peoples' problems are not your problem.

Yep. Gonna need that vault.

???????? Did you think I was suggesting that there should be no vault at all?

Not everyone is running 3 characters, dude.

I get it: other peoples' problems are not your problem.

Yep. Gonna need that vault.

???????? Did you think I was suggesting that there should be no vault at all?

Yes actually.

Destiny has a grind, for sure. And the grind is more pronounced for more than others, and in different areas from persons to person... but the fact that the vault exists at all is not some nefarious plot to make you grind.

Not everyone is running 3 characters, dude.

I get it: other peoples' problems are not your problem.

Yep. Gonna need that vault.

???????? Did you think I was suggesting that there should be no vault at all?

Yes actually.

In my original post I meant that when you equipped a weapon (or anything) in the vault then it would remain in the vault. The vault wouldn't be a physical place that you reach into and take things from.

Bungie should replace the vault as a place metaphor with the vault as an inventory system "metaphor". Well, OK, just have it be an inventory that you equip from. We don't need a metaphor for an inventory, we all understand the concept just fine.

Destiny has a grind, for sure. And the grind is more pronounced for more than others, and in different areas from persons to person... but the fact that the vault exists at all is not some nefarious plot to make you grind.

I'm not talking about the vault's existence, I'm talking about its poor implementation, the vault as a place metaphor makes it much more of a chore to use and we see people working round its suckiness by having multiple copies of the same weapon. Nobody would do that if the UI was pleasant and easy to use. The UI should do work for the user. The user shouldn't be asked to do work for the UI. That is the tail wagging the dog.

The current vault implementation is appallingly bad when you have > 1 character and it can certainly be improved.

Honestly I'm pretty sure it was just Bungie expecting people to run with different weapons on different characters, just as they would run different abilities on them.

I'm not talking about the vault's existence, I'm talking about its poor implementation, the vault as a place metaphor makes it much more of a chore to use and we see people working round its suckiness by having multiple copies of the same weapon. Nobody would do that if the UI was pleasant and easy to use. The UI should do work for the user. The user shouldn't be asked to do work for the UI. That is the tail wagging the dog.

The current vault implementation is appallingly bad when you have > 1 character and it can certainly be improved.

You're letting you notion of what you think it should be color your appraisal of what it is. If the Vault was never intended to be an always accessible extended inventory then it doesn't make sense to call its implementation appalling when it doesn't achieve the goal it wasn't built for. Calling the coke bottle beside me appalling for not fulfilling its role as a high temperature laboratory test tube makes about as much sense.

I don't think there are legions of players who are playing this game and farming 3 characters. Does it exist? Oh I bet. But people that play that way aren't playing Destiny for fun, at that point.

I have 3 characters, all level 31, and I'm playing for fun. I have fun leveling. I like setting goals and working towards them.

I also don't have these complaints on the vault. Each character has its own weapon specialty, so there is very little weapon sharing. The vault is very handy for me to share materials and currencies. Pick up what I need, make a purchase or upgrade, then put the remainder back. If they made any improvement, I would like to be able to pick up or place one item at a time rather than the entire stack.

It's insane to need 3 weapons to avoid vault swapping.

Not everyone is running 3 characters, dude.

It has two benefits for Bungie:

• drives people to the Tower
  
• encourages them to level up 3 copies of the same weapon (so they expend more time in the game doing make-work)

The Vault encourages me to level up 3 copies of the same weapon? Sir, I've not done that a single time, and I come here and complain about the areas where Destiny is a grind like lots of other folks. I only made one extra character, and I did that just to see what it was like. I hardly ever touch my hunter, but I don't want to delete it because of the time I spent on it.

I don't think there are legions of players who are playing this game and farming 3 characters. Does it exist? Oh I bet. But people that play that way aren't playing Destiny for fun, at that point.

I'm one of those guys that's running 3 characters and levels 3 of the same weapon if I can to avoid going to the vault. I'm still having a blast playing the game because #1 it's extremely fun to play and #2 I have a great group of friends that I game with and we are all still enjoying it.

It may seem silly, but I have my Main warlock, Alt Hunter and Alt Warlock. I would LOVE to have 3 versions of the main exotics (Vex Mythoclast, Suros, MIDA, Ice Breaker, Gjallarhorn) and Legendaries (Vision of Confluence, Fatebringer, Atheon's Epilogue, Preadyth's Revenge, Black Hammer, Hunger of Crota) to use. On a typical Tuesday night I will end up spending 30-45 minutes minimum flying to and from the tower because I need to switch weapons over for whatever the burn might be that week, or to get Gjallarhorn & Ice Breaker switched. Sure, I could do the Nightfall, Weekly Heroic or Raids without switching weapons, but I would rather go to the tower and switch stuff over then be stuck with inferior weapons.

The simple solution would be to let us use the Destiny App (or overhaul the vault system) to quickly switch weapons around.

Instead we are stuck with the following order to switch a single weapon over after using it.

• go to orbit
  
• go to the tower
  
• equip other weapon if item is already equipped
  
• go to the vault
  
• back out of the vault
  
• log out of character
  
• log into other character
  
• go to the tower
  
• go to the vault
  
• back out of the vault
  
• equip weapon
  
• go to orbit
  
• go to new activity

It's a complete waste of time

I don't think there are legions of players who are playing this game and farming 3 characters. Does it exist? Oh I bet. But people that play that way aren't playing Destiny for fun, at that point.

I'm not talking about farming characters. I'm talking about the mechanics of switching stuff between characters. Simply playing the game with more than one character and wanting to share weapons between them.

I have 3 characters, all level 31, and I'm playing for fun. I have fun leveling. I like setting goals and working towards them.

I also don't have these complaints on the vault. Each character has its own weapon specialty, so there is very little weapon sharing. The vault is very handy for me to share materials and currencies. Pick up what I need, make a purchase or upgrade, then put the remainder back. If they made any improvement, I would like to be able to pick up or place one item at a time rather than the entire stack.

You do know that I am specifically talking about weapon switching right?

You mention moving currencies and mats which are a separate issue. The vault sucks at that too and maybe I'll address that but not in this post.

You don't suffer from the vault's shortcomings in weapon switching because you rarely switch weapons. Clumsy interfaces are rarely a problem if you rarely use them ;-)

There are two effective strategies to avoid the vault's weapon swapping shortcommings:

• keep multiple copies of the same weapon
  
• don't swap weapons

Instead we are stuck with the following order to switch a single weapon over after using it.

• go to orbit
  
• go to the tower
  
• equip other weapon if item is already equipped
  
• go to the vault
  
• back out of the vault
  
• log out of character
  
• log into other character
  
• go to the tower
  
• go to the vault
  
• back out of the vault
  
• equip weapon
  
• go to orbit
  
• go to new activity

It's a complete waste of time

It is a massive waste of time.

If weapons stay in the vault then there is more stuff in there to scroll through, but (and it's the world's most ginourmous butt)... you avoid all that character shuffling, destination setting and traveling, playing guess-which-alt-has-the-weapon, and the other mini-game you play when space is limited in vault and character.

Ever thought that your Alt Warlock had that rocket launcher and when you switched to it you realized that the Hunter had it?

Ever been invited to a raid or a nightfall and been in an under-leveled character and been barraged with msgs whilst you frantically tried to equip your main so you could contribute fully?

Imagine if all weapons were available in the vault at all times. You wouldn't have to remember where they where, which alt had them equipped. You wouldn't have to swap characters just to get hold of a weapon that another alt had.

Imagine if the vault was available in orbit.

I outlined a suggested in-game UI for the vault here. Maybe I'd rename it from Vault to Gear.

To just shortly summarize and clarify a point I put elsewhere: It's not a clunky means of weapon swapping, you're just not supposed to share weapons between characters like that.

To just shortly summarize and clarify a point I put elsewhere: It's not a clunky means of weapon swapping, you're just not supposed to share weapons between characters like that.

I assume that you don't mean that there is a better way to share weapons between characters.

I take it that you literally mean you're just not supposed to share weapons between characters via the vault.

If we weren't supposed to then the UI would prevent it. Each character would have a separate vault. A character could still store unused stuff but it wouldn't be possible to swap weapons between characters.

- No text -

The current vault implementation is appallingly bad when you have > 1 character and it can certainly be improved.

You're letting you notion of what you think it should be color your appraisal of what it is. If the Vault was never intended to be an always accessible extended inventory then it doesn't make sense to call its implementation appalling when it doesn't achieve the goal it wasn't built for.

I think that it is a way of storing unused gear and swapping gear between characters.

What is your definition of what the vault is?

Would you like to make the strong claim that the vault was never intended to swap gear between characters?

Calling the coke bottle beside me appalling for not fulfilling its role as a high temperature laboratory test tube makes about as much sense.

I don't believe that I have done that.

I never claimed that the vault should be always accessible.

let's look at your sentence,

If the Vault was never intended to be an always accessible extended inventory then it doesn't make sense to call its implementation appalling when it doesn't achieve the goal it wasn't built for.

and remove the claim that I didn't make...

If the Vault was never intended to be an [snip] extended inventory then it doesn't make sense to call its implementation appalling when it doesn't achieve the goal it wasn't built for.

Again, would you like to claim that the vault was never intended for swapping gear between characters? You do realize that gear swapping can be stopped by having separate vaults for each character?

Please tell me your definition of what the vault is.

Please tell me what you think my definition is.

- No text -

I meant that I don't think Bungie is intending to cater to people who use the same weapons with each character.

I think that Bungie was picturing more "I got Bad Juju with my Warlock, and I'm giving it to my Hunter" than "I use this Gjallarhorn with every character."

If I didnt do the gear shuffle raids would be way more painful and nightfalls would be a nightmare - got the gear you need but it's on another character? Tough. Not got the right element on this character's guns for this week's burn? Tough.

Not to mention that I'd be SOL as a handcannon lover who's only ever had one Legendary handcannon drop. Or do you think I was supposed to buy 3 identical Devil You Know with my hard-earned marks?

I very much doubt that Bungie didn't anticipate that people would find good gear and stick with it, rather than go with whatever gear they find lying around.

or anything that is simply a type and a number...

have those things per player (not per character).

That way all alts have access to them without needing any number swapping UI.

No work is the least possible work. If I had 23 Spirit Bloom and my Hunter needed 16 then my Hunter would have immediate access to that bloom without me having do anything.

I'm not counting the work I did to collect the bloom. I'm talking about any UI overhead that would be involved if it was per character but swappable via the vault.

As a general principle: if something is possible then it should be easy unless there is an overriding need to make it difficult. But you really need to justify why you'd want to make something hard to do.

I never claimed that the vault should be always accessible.

I'm hesitant to even get into this, but did you not previously say that weapons should stay in the vault, and be always accessible regardless of where you are? That seems to be the same as saying "always accessible."

I think they would imagine different characters would have different weapons, like Bluerunner said.

If you got a gun that would go better with your Warlock from a Raid you did with a Hunter, than yeah by all means go ahead and swap it over. But I don't think they envisioned just having one set of weapons for all your characters, or having three characters who were functionally identical.

I think that Bungie was picturing more "I got Bad Juju with my Warlock, and I'm giving it to my Hunter" than "I use this Gjallarhorn with every character."

Maybe they did play testing in a grind free environment. Perhaps with easy drops and cheat codes.

And they said that they got used to throwing away characters as builds changed.

If you stare at something long enough then you stop seeing it. maybe they just couldn't see the life of the ordinary Joes playing the released game, people who don't see Gjallarhorns very often and can't quickly get amazing builds for every character.

Nightfalls and Raids weren't done every week to grind gear and mats: they were play tested. They couldn't wait for luck to equip a character for a play test. They probably had a matrix of characters and gear and tested every combination in order (repeatedly). Or they used cheat codes.

That's great for people with a wide range of weapons, and I'd love to have enough good gear to kit out all 3 characters, but I dont. My options are essentially
- Buy guns I dont like from the vendors (at max 2 every 3 weeks per character IF I max my vanguard marks), just to have legendaries
- Attempt to raid/nightfall/whatever with blue guns
- Swap weapons using the vault

They know their own game - they can't have thought people would prefer options 1 and/or 2.

between the accessibility of the vault (can you access it in combat zones?)

and the accessibility of an item in the vault.

But you are right, Ragashingo's statement could be read as always accessible items: limited to those circumstances were you can access the vault.

If the design spec stated that an alt must not be able to access gear held by another alt without without having to:

• goto settings tab
  
• select logout character
  
• wait for select character screen to load
  
• select character
  
• wait for character to load
  
• select Tower
  
• launch
  
• watch spacecraft for a bit
  
• wait in darkness for Tower to res properly
  
• run to vault
  
• enter vault
  
• goto character gear screen
  
• select weapon category and weapon to place in vault
  
• return to vault
  
• pick up other weapon
  
• quit vault
  
• goto orbit

then the spec was a bad spec.

If all that wasn't in the spec then the implementation of swapping weapons between characters was poor.

or anything that is simply a type and a number...

have those things per player (not per character).

That way all alts have access to them without needing any number swapping UI.

No work is the least possible work. If I had 23 Spirit Bloom and my Hunter needed 16 then my Hunter would have immediate access to that bloom without me having do anything.

I'm not counting the work I did to collect the bloom. I'm talking about any UI overhead that would be involved if it was per character but swappable via the vault.

As a general principle: if something is possible then it should be easy unless there is an overriding need to make it difficult. But you really need to justify why you'd want to make something hard to do.

Yeah, but you're applying UI principles for apps generally. This is a game, and in a certain sense it's a world simulator. That means that some (not all, of course) of real world logistics are recreated in the game, and is justified in the name of realism.

I fully agree that switching characters and all the travel to orbit and back is too much, and you could maintain realism with much less (or a different, less time consuming mechanism). I also agree that the UI for handling weapons at the vault could use some work, but your immediate access idea, that starts breaking down the aspects that make it realistic.

I think that the vault has two roles.

1) store for unused gear

2) means of swapping gear between alts

There are many ways to achieve those roles. There are many possible implementations.

Bungie decided to implement a bank - a place where alts can put stuff in and take stuff out.

I am suggesting that they use an inventory instead.

Given the unfortunate consequences of the bank paradigm... I believe that the inventory is by far the better implementation.

As a means of achieving the two roles mentioned above - the vault IS an appalling implementation.

1. Expand the vault to 4x its size. Just make 4 tabs to cycle through.
2. The vault can be accessed from orbit or in the tower by tabbing over between inventory and settings screens. It cannot be accessed outside of these places.
3. On the vault page, you can open the inventories of other characters, and move those items to your vault.

Ez Pz.

To me the Destiny world is very unreal.

Where do I carry the 50+ things (weapons, armor pieces, sparrows, space ships) that I equip?

What are those dodecahedrons that we pickup? How do they turn into weapons?

Where does our ghost go?

Does our ghost store all our equipped spaceships?

I imagine that there is some sort of space magic involved.

So I can imagine that when in orbit I can use space magic radio to download space magic dodecahedrons to my ghost. My ghost has limited memory to hold items so each type is capped to ten.

To me that seems to fit the Destiny world fairly well. To me, nothing in Destiny totally makes sense but the above seems OK.

-PS and sharing money is done with a shared bank account with parental control.

Honestly, I read your posts and tried to make a fair conclusion about what you wanted. Here, let me show you my thought process:

Your three stated problems with the current Vault were:

It does nothing useful for the player and only makes their life more difficult.

(Presumably because of the logout/login/tower/logout/login shuffle)

(It) drives people to the Tower

(Presumably because you see it as a waste of time having to, at the very least, leave your mission and return to the Tower)

(It) encourages them to level up 3 copies of the same weapon (so they expend more time in the game doing make-work)

(Presumably you only want to level up one weapon and easily use it with all three of your characters)

Later, you said that the Vault:

...wouldn't be a physical place that you reach into and take things from.

And that:

Bungie should replace the vault as a place metaphor with the vault as an inventory system...

So, by my reading your idea of the Vault was an inventory system that lets the player store a weapon and easily transfer it between characters without having to travel to a location like The Tower. It seemed logical to me that if there is no physical in-game Vault to press X on and it is thus not located in a in-game location like The Tower it would be an "always accessible extended inventory." Your post below here mentions not having the "vault" accessible in a combat zone something I admittedly didn't think of, but beyond that was my thought process so unreasonable?

Imagine if all weapons were available in the vault at all times.

Oh for crying out loud! You just got done snipping up my sentences to claim that not what you intended! I know you don't like me, but is a little consistency and honesty too much to ask for!?

Your subject says to me that you miss my point.

The current vault implementation is appallingly bad when you have > 1 character and it can certainly be improved.

And here is the impasse, with you: when I call you out, now you're talking in "metaphors" while I talk as it is actually.

The vault IS an inventory system, and how it is used is going to vary from person to person, especially if they run multiple characters.

The vault is implemented just fine.

It's the way we chase objects, items, things and put them into the vault that is a concern.

There is no one way to play Destiny and manager your characters\items. This is naturally going to cause frustrations for some and not others.

For me, intentionally playing the game in a way that I have to have 3 characters (different or same, it doesn't matter), and each of them has to have the same loadout if you will, to maximize chasing coins and loot does not sound fun

All this talk of efficiency vs fun is draining. If I wanted to play an efficiency simulator, I'd buy something from the Germans or, I don't know, actually go to my job or something.

Your argument is that it "sucks" because there are lots of people who feel they must have 3 of the same gun to use with multiple characters-

OK- where are these players? Are you one of them? I don't see hundereds of threads on B.net about people complaining that the need 3 icebreakers etc. I think your opinion is clouded because of some of the more high level players we have here on DBO- Your Cody Millers, Cruel Legacys, Korny Munkys and CyberKNs might have a beef with it, but then again, they ARE the type of players that are constantly switching characters (for fun, mind you).

I feel as if you are proposing some ludicrously large ingame inventory with tons and tons of items to sort through. Who has the time for that?! I'm too busy playing the game! I don't spend much time in the menus of Destiny. Perhaps I'm playing more efficient than these people you describe. Then again, I only run one main character, and a second when the mood strikes me.

Look, I'm done with this with you, because you've already hit that point with me where I can't read things you write in a non-complainy voice.

I'd love to see some official stats from Bungie about how many players are running 3 characters, how many of those characters have 3 of the same weapon, or how often people are moving stuff between them. Show me these "masses". Show me their plight.

Until they do that, I think the vault is working exactly as intended, and needs no changes other than maybe, MAYBE adding a few extra slots, if possible, as more content comes out.

I don't think there are legions of players who are playing this game and farming 3 characters. Does it exist? Oh I bet. But people that play that way aren't playing Destiny for fun, at that point.

I have 3 characters, all level 31, and I'm playing for fun. I have fun leveling. I like setting goals and working towards them.

I also don't have these complaints on the vault. Each character has its own weapon specialty, so there is very little weapon sharing. The vault is very handy for me to share materials and currencies. Pick up what I need, make a purchase or upgrade, then put the remainder back. If they made any improvement, I would like to be able to pick up or place one item at a time rather than the entire stack.

Exactly, another player that doesn't fit the mold of these complaints.

You play a lot like Korny does with us.

I don't think there is anything weird or problematic about moving a few key weapons\armor to your characters from time to time, like say the nightfall or when the mood strikes you.

RNG bless you with two or more of your favorite gun? Hey, that's awesome. But trying to do something like buying three of the same gun from Xur every week seems pretty dumb to me.

I've got a hunter that I occasionally switch to if the mood strikes, but it's not even leveled up all the way.

I remember how you said early on you wanted to have a Titan for PvE and a Hunter for PvP, or the other way around maybe and I thought about doing that, as I like some of the perks a hunter has (and it rewards my Scout Rifle preference) but I just prefer my Titan more.

I think it's cool Bungie gave us 3 slots so we could do each character, and a channel via the vault to share our favorite gear with them.

If someone wants to grind 3 of the same gun, more power to them, but to feel as if you HAVE to is wrong.

I thought I would do titan for PvP, hunter for PvE, and ignore the warlock, but the more I've played, the more I like all 3 in every game mode. I really love the variety. It makes playing the same missions less grindy. Plus all 3 are the same character. He just suits up in different gear depending on his mood. Wanna snipe today? Hunter. Wanna smash? Titan. Wanna float around and throw pocket sand? Warlock.

I think if people are limiting themselves to just a small number of weapons that they switch around, then they're missing out on the fun variety Destiny has in its arsenal. If it's just from lack of weapons, then that's understandable. I wish legendary weapons were a little cheaper.

If someone wants to grind 3 of the same gun, more power to them, but to feel as if you HAVE to is wrong.

Yes, very much so. Which is why I suggest that Bungie make weapons stay in the vault so that people only have to grind one copy.

Remember it takes time for people to have enough exotics and legendaries that all characters can be equipped with a wide variety of them, all fully upgraded.

An ability to easily swap weapons would make these people's lives easier:

• people who don't have many great weapons - not enough to equip all characters without swapping
  
• people who do have many great weapons and want to try them all out on each character, whenever they want to
  
• people who only want to grind one of each type of weapon

1. Expand the vault to 4x its size. Just make 4 tabs to cycle through.

Yes to bigger but cycling through tabs is an unnecessary task. (see my reply to point 3)

2. The vault can be accessed from orbit or in the tower by tabbing over between inventory and settings screens. It cannot be accessed outside of these places.

I could live with it only being accessible in non-combat areas.

Though, given that you can already have ten of each type of item to choose between in combat areas... I don't think that there is much strategy left in loadout selections, especially given the known nature of all encounters. In the strike playlist you can be selecting your loadout whilst dinklebot narrates.

There is no NEED for vault access in combat areas but I'm fairly laissez faire about these things. If there is no strong need to stop a consenting adult from doing something then I'm inclined to let them do it.

Maybe this would me more of an issue to PvP players. Would it be a problem for you if anyone could pick between all their weapons? I'm not suggesting that the current character page be removed. I'm just suggesting that vaults could be accessible anywhere.

3. On the vault page, you can open the inventories of other characters, and move those items to your vault.

Ez Pz.

Have a quick gander at this.

I was initially thinking, "how do you make it easier to find stuff that other characters hold?" But then I thought, "who cares who is holding it? I just want to see the stuff"

If you filter by gear category then the middle grid shouldn't get too big. I took two 1080p images of a character page and an inventory page and copied a 5x3 grid from the inventory image and pasted it over the character screen.

You can fit a 7x7 grid without scrolling into the middle but I think that a 6x7 grid would be less cramped. That's room for 42 primaries or specials or whatever before you even need to scroll. I suspect that a 6x10 grid would not be too cumbersome to scroll. 60 helmets, 60 gloves, space ships, etc.

If you want to filter out armour that the current character can't wear then you would have room for 60 Hunter helmets and not need to worry about the 57 Warlock and 30 Titan helmets you own ;-)

And remember, if items stay in the grid when selected then you get to know where in the grid they live so they are easier to find (they don't shuffle around as you equip and un-equip items).

There are three categories of vault users (though two are very similar):

• people who have no alts therefore never need to share weapons
  
• people who have alts but rarely share
  
• people who share regularly

Making it easy to share weapons does not have a massive impact on people who rarely or never share.

I think that the suggestions made here make life easier even for people who rarely or never share but just use the vault as storage.

Under that scheme any weapon picked up is in the vault. If no other alt equips it from the vault and you delete the weapon in your character page then the weapon is deleted and is gone from your vault.

Note that you put stuff into and took stuff out of your vault without having to even access the vault.

Imagine you pick up some greens during a strike and delete them in a lull between fights or in orbit. You haven't needed to see your vault, you don't need to care, and the stuff is now gone.

If you pick up a legendary or exotic then it is immediately in your vault without you having to do anything. If you hate the exotic then just delete it in your character screen. It will be gone and it will never bother you again.

If you want to share it with an alt then, when you decide to play as that alt: just equip it from the vault and both characters are now sharing it.

If you want to give it to an alt (say you feel that it doesn't suit your current alt) then just enter the vault and un-equip it. Notes:

• it is already in the vault without you doing anything - the other alt can pick it up when you start playing as that alt
  
• the un-equip just frees up a slot in your current alt's equipped gear slots - this can be done before the other alt picks it up or after (the order doesn't matter)