Favorite Bungie story and why? (Off-Topic)

by Fuertisimo, Monday, May 18, 2015, 19:55 (2640 days ago)

I was going over some things over at Marathon's Story earlier and it reminded me just how much I appreciated the complexity of Marathon Infinity's story, and how much story actually informed my love of games in general.

Despite that though, I think the TFL's story is still my favorite... Not because it was especially complex, or even terribly original, but because of the gravitas with which it was told. There was an emotional resonance, enhanced through excellent voice work and music, that really stuck with me over time. I can still go dial up the journal entries on youtube and soak it in.

I'm curious where other people stand with that though, since there are plenty of good choices (even Pathways! Which was remarkable in that era just for having a story past shoot the demons).

So what's your fave? Gotta be a lot of people on here who love a good story.

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Round-Thingie: Combat Devolved.

by Funkmon @, Monday, May 18, 2015, 20:12 (2640 days ago) @ Fuertisimo

http://halo.bungie.org/fanfic/a/anderson.roundthingie.html

Or did you mean official Bungie story?

Definitely Matt Soell's interview with Jen Taylor.

http://halo.bungie.net/news/content.aspx?type=topnews&cid=10

Or did you mean video game?

Probably the Halo Universe from 2009 and earlier.

Or did you mean one single game?

Marathon 2.

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Ditto. Ditto. Ditto. Ditto.

by Kahzgul, Monday, May 18, 2015, 22:54 (2640 days ago) @ Funkmon

GET OUT OF MY HEAD!

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I love that someone else loves Round-Thingie.

by Funkmon @, Tuesday, May 19, 2015, 00:20 (2639 days ago) @ Kahzgul

- No text -

Round-Thingie: Combat Devolved.

by Matt, Tuesday, May 19, 2015, 17:32 (2639 days ago) @ Funkmon

Definitely Matt Soell's interview with Jen Taylor.

Aw, shucks. You are too kind.

–Matt

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Favorite Bungie story and why?

by Cody Miller @, Music of the Spheres - Never Forgot, Monday, May 18, 2015, 20:44 (2640 days ago) @ Fuertisimo

So what's your fave? Gotta be a lot of people on here who love a good story.

First of all, I'm putting the finishing touches on a huge storytelling essay, which covers Bungie specifically. Stay Tuned.

When it's done, you'll find out why answering your question is really tough :-p

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So is it Halo: Reach?

by Funkmon @, Monday, May 18, 2015, 21:22 (2640 days ago) @ Cody Miller

- No text -

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Favorite Bungie story and why?

by narcogen ⌂ @, Andover, Massachusetts, Tuesday, May 19, 2015, 00:46 (2639 days ago) @ Cody Miller

So what's your fave? Gotta be a lot of people on here who love a good story.


First of all, I'm putting the finishing touches on a huge storytelling essay, which covers Bungie specifically. Stay Tuned.

When it's done, you'll find out why answering your question is really tough :-p

What's tough about it? Someone already said "Marathon 2".

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Probably the why part.

by Funkmon @, Tuesday, May 19, 2015, 01:38 (2639 days ago) @ narcogen

- No text -

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Halo 2

by CyberKN ⌂ @, Oh no, Destiny 2 seems complicated, Monday, May 18, 2015, 20:57 (2640 days ago) @ Fuertisimo

I really like how they handled telling the story from two different perspectives, as opposed to Halo 1 where the covenant are just alien bad guys.

That's part of why I'm so disappointed in Destiny's storytelling: The bad guys' motivations are really nebulous.

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Why I'm excited for House of Wolves

by kidtsunami @, Atlanta, GA, Monday, May 18, 2015, 21:01 (2640 days ago) @ CyberKN

I really like how they handled telling the story from two different perspectives, as opposed to Halo 1 where the covenant are just alien bad guys.

That's part of why I'm so disappointed in Destiny's storytelling: The bad guys' motivations are really nebulous.

Looking forward to working with a friendly fallen

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Halo 2

by Ragashingo ⌂ @, Official DBO Cryptarch, Monday, May 18, 2015, 21:03 (2640 days ago) @ CyberKN

Clearly you haven't yet read the House of Wolves Grimoire cards. Lots of good stuff on Fallen motivations. Not quite the same as having fancy cutscenes binding gameplay together, to be sure, but I enjoyed gaining some Fallen perspective even if it was only in disconnected text form.

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Halo 2

by stabbim @, Des Moines, IA, USA, Monday, May 18, 2015, 21:08 (2640 days ago) @ Ragashingo

Also, it's my opinion that part of why Halo 2's Covenant exposition worked so well was because we had so little information about them all through Halo 1. I don't think it would have been nearly so interesting if they'd just laid it all on the table right away.

Halo 2

by Fuertisimo, Tuesday, May 19, 2015, 01:05 (2639 days ago) @ stabbim

I agree, really Halo 2 catches more crap than it should because of the ending...

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Halo 2

by CyberKN ⌂ @, Oh no, Destiny 2 seems complicated, Monday, May 18, 2015, 21:22 (2640 days ago) @ Ragashingo

Clearly you haven't yet read the House of Wolves Grimoire cards. Lots of good stuff on Fallen motivations. Not quite the same as having fancy cutscenes binding gameplay together, to be sure, but I enjoyed gaining some Fallen perspective even if it was only in disconnected text form.

I've read it all, actually. None of it hints as to why they're attacking us or even why they're here.

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Halo 2

by Xenos @, Shores of Time, Monday, May 18, 2015, 21:52 (2640 days ago) @ CyberKN

Clearly you haven't yet read the House of Wolves Grimoire cards. Lots of good stuff on Fallen motivations. Not quite the same as having fancy cutscenes binding gameplay together, to be sure, but I enjoyed gaining some Fallen perspective even if it was only in disconnected text form.


I've read it all, actually. None of it hints as to why they're attacking us or even why they're here.

I think the line: "The dead soldiers that hoard the Great Machine and come out crusading to wipe all hope away," hints pretty heavily at why they are attacking us, and to why they're here (you know, to get to the "Great Machine").

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Halo 2

by Ragashingo ⌂ @, Official DBO Cryptarch, Monday, May 18, 2015, 22:04 (2640 days ago) @ Xenos

There is also stuff about them coming to our star and seeking The Great Machine because they think it could save them. But yeah, I love the perspective of humanity being the unkillable bad guys seizing The Traveler of their own. And beyond it all is still the actual Darkness... I'm liking where this is going, I just hope it gets there someday...

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Destiny

by Kahzgul, Monday, May 18, 2015, 22:53 (2640 days ago) @ Ragashingo

Everything in the grimoire is great. I really enjoy reading those cards. But, honestly, zero of that translates into the actual game. If Destiny was a novel based on the lore and grimoire, it would be a bestseller. But based on the actual game, it would be relegated to tween pulp trash. There's a huge disconnect between storytelling in the game and the supporting materials, and it's really tragic for the players. We know the potential is there. It's obvious that loads of thought went into the world of Destiny. And yet... nothing has materialized in the real game.

HoW... the last great hope.

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Destiny

by Ragashingo ⌂ @, Official DBO Cryptarch, Monday, May 18, 2015, 23:04 (2640 days ago) @ Kahzgul

HoW... the last great hope.

Yeah, no. It's not even the last piece of Destiny 1 content so how can it possibly be the last hope unless you're trying to be sensationally pessimistic.

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+1

by kidtsunami @, Atlanta, GA, Monday, May 18, 2015, 23:28 (2640 days ago) @ Ragashingo

- No text -

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Destiny

by stabbim @, Des Moines, IA, USA, Tuesday, May 19, 2015, 11:43 (2639 days ago) @ Ragashingo

Yeah, it's really more like the next hope.

Destiny

by Fuertisimo, Tuesday, May 19, 2015, 01:00 (2639 days ago) @ Kahzgul

Just a conjecture, but I feel like the grimoire cards are what's left over from the story before it got overhauled... Probably remnants of what Staten was working on all that time.

It is a shame that a great story wasn't delivered, because the pieces are there. It just didn't happen for whatever reason.

Destiny

by General Battuta, Tuesday, May 19, 2015, 01:36 (2639 days ago) @ Fuertisimo
edited by General Battuta, Tuesday, May 19, 2015, 01:57

Just a conjecture, but I feel like the grimoire cards are what's left over from the story before it got overhauled... Probably remnants of what Staten was working on all that time.

It is a shame that a great story wasn't delivered, because the pieces are there. It just didn't happen for whatever reason.

I have to admit it rubs me the wrong way to see this time and again. We worked our asses off on those cards - I worked too hard, and it cost me a serious chunk of my mental health.

I wasn't cribbing from anyone's outline. We did the work.

e: I'm sorry if I sound snappy, I don't mean to be a grouch. I'm glad you appreciate them!

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Heh

by ZackDark @, Not behind you. NO! Don't look., Tuesday, May 19, 2015, 01:46 (2639 days ago) @ General Battuta

It's so good it feels the other way around. Keep up the good work, Battuta. Just don't stress yourself too thin.

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I feel kind of the same way.

by Funkmon @, Tuesday, May 19, 2015, 03:36 (2639 days ago) @ ZackDark

Yeah, a serious lack of story in game, but the CARDS are like a free novel. It really is a better story experience...but delivered badly.

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Destiny

by Ragashingo ⌂ @, Official DBO Cryptarch, Tuesday, May 19, 2015, 02:26 (2639 days ago) @ General Battuta

I don't think any of us mean to dismiss those who did the work. We just don't know who to credit when looking in from the outside! :)

mea culpa

by Fuertisimo, Tuesday, May 19, 2015, 03:24 (2639 days ago) @ General Battuta

Apologies Battuta, your work deserves to be recognized.

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Destiny

by Xenos @, Shores of Time, Tuesday, May 19, 2015, 04:27 (2639 days ago) @ General Battuta

Honestly the world built in Destiny is one of my favorite sci-fi ones, and a very, very large chunk of that is thanks to the Grimoire cards, so keep up the good work! :)

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Destiny

by Chewbaccawakka @, The Great Green Pacific Northwest!, Tuesday, May 19, 2015, 04:56 (2639 days ago) @ General Battuta

I'm glad you said something. I loved the music of Halo and Destiny, and I knew that I could be grateful to Marty for having a hand in its creation. The Grimoire of Destiny is probably my favourite aspect of the game and now I have at least one name I can be grateful to for it!


You and your team did excellent work and I thank you for it.

(PS: Thorn 3 is one of the most perfect short-short-stories I've ever read, and I've read A LOT of stories)

Destiny

by General Battuta, Tuesday, May 19, 2015, 06:38 (2639 days ago) @ Chewbaccawakka

I can't take any credit for Thorn 3! I'm guessing that was Jon Goff, the virtuoso behind the whole Thorn/Last Word saga.

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Destiny

by Kermit @, Raleigh, NC, Tuesday, May 19, 2015, 16:14 (2639 days ago) @ General Battuta

Just a conjecture, but I feel like the grimoire cards are what's left over from the story before it got overhauled... Probably remnants of what Staten was working on all that time.

It is a shame that a great story wasn't delivered, because the pieces are there. It just didn't happen for whatever reason.


I have to admit it rubs me the wrong way to see this time and again. We worked our asses off on those cards - I worked too hard, and it cost me a serious chunk of my mental health.

I wasn't cribbing from anyone's outline. We did the work.

e: I'm sorry if I sound snappy, I don't mean to be a grouch. I'm glad you appreciate them!

I think I'd be at least as snappy if I were you. I've said before that I don't care for this kind of conjecture, but I've also never been one to make the assumption that Staten was the fountainhead of all good storytelling from Bungie--what Ken Levine was to Irrational.* His ambition for Halo 2 almost wrecked the development of that game (not his fault alone, but Halo 2 is a flawed game). I might even say that the best writing from Bungie came before and after Staten's tenure.** I think writing for big games these days is much more akin to screenwriting--it's collaborative.

I hope you're in a good place now, Battuta.

Kermit

*Even Ken Levine delegated a lot at Irrational. I had a one-minute interaction with him at PAX, and I asked him about the nod to Frederick Law Olmsted at the beginning of BioShock Infinite. (Olmsted is considered the father of American landscape design, and was a primary character in THE DEVIL IN WHITE CITY, the non-fiction book about the Chicago World's Fair that Levine often cited as one of his inspirations for Columbia--great book!) He said, "Oh, that must have been Joe Fielder! He wrote all that incidental conversational stuff."

**I love Staten. I think he's a good writer, was a good spokesman for Bungie, and Bungie's loss was Microsoft's gain. I've thoroughly enjoyed the panels I've seen when he was there.

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Halo 2

by Cody Miller @, Music of the Spheres - Never Forgot, Monday, May 18, 2015, 21:44 (2640 days ago) @ CyberKN

I really like how they handled telling the story from two different perspectives, as opposed to Halo 1 where the covenant are just alien bad guys.

That's part of why I'm so disappointed in Destiny's storytelling: The bad guys' motivations are really nebulous.

One of the problems with relying on the 'mystery' angle, as will be explained in my piece soon!

Halo 2

by Fuertisimo, Tuesday, May 19, 2015, 01:01 (2639 days ago) @ Cody Miller

I'm curious where you're going with that because I like a little mystery in my games. It allows the imagination to go to work.

Halo 2

by Avateur @, Tuesday, May 19, 2015, 03:34 (2639 days ago) @ Cody Miller
edited by Avateur, Tuesday, May 19, 2015, 03:39

I really like how they handled telling the story from two different perspectives, as opposed to Halo 1 where the covenant are just alien bad guys.

That's part of why I'm so disappointed in Destiny's storytelling: The bad guys' motivations are really nebulous.


One of the problems with relying on the 'mystery' angle, as will be explained in my piece soon!

To be fair, I don't think that Destiny is relying on any mystery angle. The game just failed hard on narrative and story, and so we flat out don't really have anything to go off of. I don't know if I can even call the enemies' motivations nebulous, primarily because there are no real motivations. They're just sort of around, doing bad things, and needing to be stopped by us because we're the gamers, they're the bad guys, and much like how plenty of the bounties direct/tell us, the bad guys are just targets that need to be killed because they're there being bad guys that need to be killed. No real motivations to explore or even speculate at as far as Destiny's in-game writing goes, really. :P

What are the good guys' motivations?

by scarab @, Tuesday, May 19, 2015, 14:58 (2639 days ago) @ CyberKN

Are we the good guys?

We rip the neural connector doo-dads out of our dead victims' skulls. We skin our victims and use it to fuel our ships. Our hangouts in the tower are decorated with skulls...

When the Queen wants some killing done she invites us across, well, to do some killing. She needed some cold blooded, steely eyed, merciless hit-men and opened her doors to us...

are we definitely the good guys?

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What are the good guys' motivations?

by CyberKN ⌂ @, Oh no, Destiny 2 seems complicated, Tuesday, May 19, 2015, 15:05 (2639 days ago) @ scarab

Are we the good guys?

We rip the neural connector doo-dads out of our dead victims' skulls. We skin our victims and use it to fuel our ships. Our hangouts in the tower are decorated with skulls...

When the Queen wants some killing done she invites us across, well, to do some killing. She needed some cold blooded, steely eyed, merciless hit-men and opened her doors to us...

are we definitely the good guys?

Last time I checked, this solar system was our home turf. So, Yes.

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You're assuming that

by ZackDark @, Not behind you. NO! Don't look., Tuesday, May 19, 2015, 23:20 (2639 days ago) @ CyberKN

There's no telling how deep the rabbit hole goes.

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Favorite Bungie story and why?

by slycrel ⌂, Tuesday, May 19, 2015, 01:33 (2639 days ago) @ Fuertisimo

Marathon 2. I really really really liked all the rampancy stuff. And it was just sadistic enough to keep me coming back after so so many deaths. Good times.

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Durandal makes 343 Guilty Spark look like a poseur

by Durandal, Tuesday, May 19, 2015, 09:42 (2639 days ago) @ slycrel

I mean Guilty Spark spends all his time being sycophantic. Durandal is flat out ominous and Machiavellian all the time.

Durandal makes 343 Guilty Spark look like a poseur

by Earendil, Tuesday, May 19, 2015, 15:16 (2639 days ago) @ Durandal

I mean Guilty Spark spends all his time being sycophantic. Durandal is flat out ominous and Machiavellian all the time.

I loved Guilty Sparks all the same though. Durandal was certainly threatening, but I got the sense from Guilty Spark that he could accidentally kill us and not think much of it, not because he was clumsy but because we were so insignificant to him. At least Durandal saw value in us, and we were a key part of his plan. Following Guilty Sparks felt more like an Ant following an elephant around. Dangerous, and you never know when you might be stepped on and forgotten.

I still like Durandal more though :)

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