Kotaku splitscreen interview: Including very honest history

Today's split screen has an extended interview with Luke smith that I recommend listening to. He has some very honest conversations about lore and struggles with the game.

http://kotaku.com/e3-day-four-podcast-destiny-2s-luke-smith-days-gone-1796111658

A few notable things:

At one point Bungie didn't have a clear conception of the darkness. You can see that in d1 tooltips where enemies are called minions of the darkness, and that's not true anymore.

They Like where story has gone but don't like the lack of forward progress of the global story

New feature is discussed: flash points are open world area that bungie highlights for a week. They will have new enemies, challenges, and loot to focus player energy on a single place.

Lots of talk of internal structure, and high level conflict, seemed like he was obliquely referencing that history article from last wee

Great interview and very honest, give it a listen

EDIT: Changed the title because I realized it was more controversial than I intended.

locked

4149 views

http://destiny.bungie.org/forum/index.php?id=120862

locked

3270 views

121160

That's not what you said, though. You said they are (in the present tense) making things up as they go, and that they did not (in the present tense) have a plan, and that was reflected in what we are currently seeing. In the same post you say you don't know if things have changed, but that didn't stop you from saying how things ARE. As usual, it's your grand broad-brush...

Just saying. Luke's words still don't back up your assertion. That being said, it's good to hear they are moving past that ambiguity and have a clearer picture of the story they want to tell.

locked

3175 views

I was?
[image]

locked

3220 views

- No text -

locked

3054 views

"we planned it all out from the beginning" [/make it up as you go and hope no one notices]

in the end, we'll find out that the traveler and the darkness are brothers and all the guardians were test subjects to replace the traveler.

locked

3123 views

"we planned it all out from the beginning" [/make it up as you go and hope no one notices]

in the end, we'll find out that the traveler and the darkness are brothers and all the guardians were test subjects to replace the traveler.

It's probably a Babylon 5 story line. Older races just messing with the younger races. Having a good old laugh about it later.

locked

3081 views

- No text -

locked

3169 views

Shit wrong forum.

locked

3147 views

I just came here to post this, too.

I typed out the first question and answer, because I thought it was interesting.

Jason: You said you will not be talking about the Darkness in the game . . . Tell me the truth, is it because none of you have any idea what the Darkness actually means?

Luke: I think that at a point, just totally candidly, we had no idea what it was—straight up we had no clue. For a period, we decided we were going to lump all the races . . . and you see this in the tools tips in the game: “minions of the Darkness,” and we had taken all the races and just said, “Ah, they’ll just be the Darkness.” But that’s not what the IP deserves, it’s literally not. So what we’re doing with Destiny 2 is we are deliberately telling a story about the Light and what it means to be chosen. And as such we’re in the process of removing the term Darkness from the game, because when we are going to talk about Darkness next, we need to know what it is and have and plan for it . . . and we do.

I honestly think that's awesome, and the pitch of first telling a story about the Light is compelling for me. I really hope they deliver.

Later in the interview, Luke specifically calls out Jason Jones and the leadership surrounding him during the development of Destiny 1 as problematic. After TTK he was asked what he wanted to work on next and he said he was game for anything, as long as he got to keep his leadership team together. That's good news, I think, both from just an attitude perspective, and for the fact that that team became the leadership for Destiny 2.

Overall, it's a great interview. Luke sounds genuinely excited for what they're making, as for as much as a show as Bungie put on in the lead up to Destiny 1, this feels legitimately different, and I think that's a good sign.

locked

3202 views

Just the fact that they feel comfortable airing their dirty laundry like this gives me much more confidence in the quality of Destiny 2. This time in Destiny 1's cycle was all smoke and mirrors and marketing lines.

locked

3200 views

Just the fact that they feel comfortable airing their dirty laundry like this gives me much more confidence in the quality of Destiny 2. This time in Destiny 1's cycle was all smoke and mirrors and marketing lines.

Yes, this. There always seemed to be something gumming up the mix. We learned about the technical (dependencies) issues they battled and I think resolved for D2. Perhaps there was also a vision issue as well.

To me, it seems Luke has the clearest, most coherent, and most literal idea of what the game should be. Gives us a good reason to believe D2 has the potential for solid improvement.

locked

3151 views

Just the fact that they feel comfortable airing their dirty laundry like this gives me much more confidence in the quality of Destiny 2. This time in Destiny 1's cycle was all smoke and mirrors and marketing lines.

Yes, this. There always seemed to be something gumming up the mix. We learned about the technical (dependencies) issues they battled and I think resolved for D2. Perhaps there was also a vision issue as well.

To me, it seems Luke has the clearest, most coherent, and most literal idea of what the game should be. Gives us a good reason to believe D2 has the potential for solid improvement.

I fully agree!

Destiny 1: "What is this game?" Bungie: "It's a shared world shooter where you become legend!" "What does 'become legend mean?" Bungie: "You know, your gear will tell your story!" "What does that mean?" Bungie: "Epic loot!" "how does epic loot make us legend? What does any of this mean?" Bungie: "Forge your own destiny!" "WHAT?"

Destiny 2: "What is this game?" Bungie: "We've realized there were mistakes in D1. Gaps in plot, characterization, backstory. The fundamentals of narrative structure. So we're rebuilding everything from the ground up. We're starting with the basic structure of the world, like 'what is your light, where does it come from, and why is it important to you.' The gameplay is the same sort of Destiny action you've come to love, but we've tuned it to keep you in the action more, rather than having you take cover instead. We've also moved all of the OHK weapons into the same slot to aid in balancing, and we've put in these great action moments in the story where you get to see the other characters, interact with them, and really take part in the narrative we're telling."

It's night and day and I love it.

locked

3131 views

Just the fact that they feel comfortable airing their dirty laundry like this gives me much more confidence in the quality of Destiny 2. This time in Destiny 1's cycle was all smoke and mirrors and marketing lines.

But it's always like this.

It's been like this since Halo 2.

There's a brave face about everything up until the release, then afterwards the story about how everything was totally messed up, barely came together at the last minute, and how it'll be better next time.

The story of Halo 3 was that everybody got their s*** together and made the game on time, on budget, and on target-- except now the story about that game is that they were already bored with Halo, ready to work on something else, and studio leadership was essentially AWOL.

This is probably unavoidable, but still...

locked

3123 views

Just the fact that they feel comfortable airing their dirty laundry like this gives me much more confidence in the quality of Destiny 2. This time in Destiny 1's cycle was all smoke and mirrors and marketing lines.

But it's always like this.

It's been like this since Halo 2.

There's a brave face about everything up until the release, then afterwards the story about how everything was totally messed up, barely came together at the last minute, and how it'll be better next time.

The extent to which things were messed up for both Destiny and Halo 2 has never been fully owned up to publicly.

locked

3099 views

Just the fact that they feel comfortable airing their dirty laundry like this gives me much more confidence in the quality of Destiny 2. This time in Destiny 1's cycle was all smoke and mirrors and marketing lines.

But it's always like this.

It's been like this since Halo 2.

There's a brave face about everything up until the release, then afterwards the story about how everything was totally messed up, barely came together at the last minute, and how it'll be better next time.

The extent to which things were messed up for both Destiny and Halo 2 has never been fully owned up to publicly.

Okay, I'm not going to tell you to shut up, but would you just write your damn book instead of commenting obliquely that you have secret knowledge. Seriously.

locked

3181 views

Just the fact that they feel comfortable airing their dirty laundry like this gives me much more confidence in the quality of Destiny 2. This time in Destiny 1's cycle was all smoke and mirrors and marketing lines.

But it's always like this.

It's been like this since Halo 2.

There's a brave face about everything up until the release, then afterwards the story about how everything was totally messed up, barely came together at the last minute, and how it'll be better next time.

The extent to which things were messed up for both Destiny and Halo 2 has never been fully owned up to publicly.

Okay, I'm not going to tell you to shut up, but would you just write your damn book instead of commenting obliquely that you have secret knowledge. Seriously.

Again, not about the book. It's not being written to document drama. Did you read the Oral History of Halo? Lots alluded to but never fully explained. Has someone like Jamie or Paul or Marcus ever said (honestly) publicly why they departed Bungie? No? Oh well then, I guess I can say nobody has the full story, even if I might not know the answer myself.

At this point the only 'secret' knowledge I have is the true origin of the name Bungie, and who the Webmaster actually was.

locked

3169 views

At this point the only 'secret' knowledge I have is the true origin of the name Bungie, and who the Webmaster actually was.

I'd like to pre-order the book.

locked

3151 views

- No text -

locked

3077 views

- No text -

locked

3113 views

At this point the only 'secret' knowledge I have is the true origin of the name Bungie, and who the Webmaster actually was.

I'd like to pre-order the book.

I know this is several days late, but this post won the day for me. :D

locked

3028 views

I feel like Destiny 1 was very different from a marketing standpoint. They had all kinds of catchphrases they were throwing around without ever actually explaining anything. It was pure hype. D2 has taken a different approach, and it's one I appreciate a lot more. It feels like there's more substance, and a lot fewer subjective terms being thrown around.

locked

3108 views

I feel like Destiny 1 was very different from a marketing standpoint. They had all kinds of catchphrases they were throwing around without ever actually explaining anything. It was pure hype. D2 has taken a different approach, and it's one I appreciate a lot more. It feels like there's more substance, and a lot fewer subjective terms being thrown around.

And a lot more admitting things that aren't going to happen in Destiny 2 instead of finding out on day 1.

locked

3074 views

On the other hand, having the executive meddling taken out, and leaders pushing things down to the lower levels, can give better results if you have good minions that can hash things out themselves and clearly understand their parts of the overall plan.

locked

3096 views

One of my biggest disappointments about Destiny 1, by far was that Bungie didn't talk about it all that much before launch. Like sure there were interviews and the big gameplay reveals, but mostly those were covered with a nice layer of soft, squishy marketing speech.

Here, we have the Destiny 2 leader admitting to mistakes and talkingly openly about how things will be better but how he is sure they'll make new, different mistakes. It was such a fun interview to listen to!

locked

3128 views

One of my biggest disappointments about Destiny 1, by far was that Bungie didn't talk about it all that much before launch. Like sure there were interviews and the big gameplay reveals, but mostly those were covered with a nice layer of soft, squishy marketing speech.

Here, we have the Destiny 2 leader admitting to mistakes and talkingly openly about how things will be better but how he is sure they'll make new, different mistakes. It was such a fun interview to listen to!

This pretty much spells out why I like Luke. I'm sure there are times when he has to withhold information, but he at least makes an effort to not throw out empty bullshit answers.

locked

3143 views

Sheesh, make up your minds about the Darkness Bungie. Cody was right. (insert acid reflux here.)

Luke whined like a bitch to keep his little team together. Do you think he's genius enough to get it right?

Private matches not arriving at release and not a hint to when. How could this happen with everything they've already learned in D1? Disappointing.

Luke only recently found out Ward of Dawn was added back in. Sounds more reactionary than planned to me.

So, to me it already smacks of the same marketing scheme as D1. They have cool stuff in hand but they probably have it assigned a release date on a white board in a secret room.

It reminds me of ... Give customers certain goto Exotics, take them away with a dumb explanation, wait till the customers are dying to get them back and then give/sell those same Exotics back in dribs and drabs. Assign a date to each epoch before full release.

I know what I'd like to say to Bungie ... but I like their dumb game. For now that is.

I think Ghaul looks stupid too.

locked

3196 views

It reminds me of ... Give customers certain goto Exotics, take them away with a dumb explanation, wait till the customers are dying to get them back and then give/sell those same Exotics back in dribs and drabs. Assign a date to each epoch before full release.

Can't complain too much if all the teasing ends with that.

That being said, the tone of this marketing feels more honest and the product looks good from my perspective. I hope it lives up to Luke's vision.

locked

3128 views

I know what I'd like to say to Bungie ... but I like their dumb game. For now that is.

I think Ghaul looks stupid too.

It seems pretty obvious that Bungie is aware of the flops that Destiny had and is addressing them. Not by fixing what was broken but by completely rebuilding from scratch. So yeah, we don't get to carry over our character, we aren't going to get some existing features. It happens. Multi-game carry-over is not a standard thing. When you consider what D1 was, it was SUPER ambitious. Think of it as an experiment. Just because you don't get the result you were expecting doesn't mean it failed. You learn from the result and make another attempt. That's what they are doing, and it seems they are pretty excited about it this time.

And Ghaul is totally rad. So far, he is pure villain cheese and that is great. Why does everything have to be so serious and deep all the time? He is basically the Prophet of Truth but can carry out orders himself! I'm just waiting for him to say:

"You are, all of you, vermin. Cowering in the dirt, thinking... what, I wonder? That you might escape the coming fire? No. Your world will burn until its surface is but glass! And not even your [SPEAKER] will live to creep, blackened, from its hole to mar the reflection of [MY] passage; the culmination of [MY] Journey. For your destruction is the will of the gods! And I...I am their instrument!"

locked

3150 views

"You are, all of you, vermin. Cowering in the dirt, thinking... what, I wonder? That you might escape the coming fire? No. Your world will burn until its surface is but glass! And not even your [SPEAKER] will live to creep, blackened, from its hole to mar the reflection of [MY] passage; the culmination of [MY] Journey. For your destruction is the will of the gods! And I...I am their instrument!"

Haha! I love (Halo 2) Truth! :)

locked

3142 views

"You are, all of you, vermin. Cowering in the dirt, thinking... what, I wonder? That you might escape the coming fire? No. Your world will burn until its surface is but glass! And not even your [SPEAKER] will live to creep, blackened, from its hole to mar the reflection of [MY] passage; the culmination of [MY] Journey. For your destruction is the will of the gods! And I...I am their instrument!"

Haha! I love (Halo 2) Truth! :)

Me too! But wasn't that Halo 3 Truth there?

locked

3142 views

"You are, all of you, vermin. Cowering in the dirt, thinking... what, I wonder? That you might escape the coming fire? No. Your world will burn until its surface is but glass! And not even your [SPEAKER] will live to creep, blackened, from its hole to mar the reflection of [MY] passage; the culmination of [MY] Journey. For your destruction is the will of the gods! And I...I am their instrument!"

Haha! I love (Halo 2) Truth! :)

Me too! But wasn't that Halo 3 Truth there?

Yes, and it was that game's cringiest cutscene.

locked

3136 views

"You are, all of you, vermin. Cowering in the dirt, thinking... what, I wonder? That you might escape the coming fire? No. Your world will burn until its surface is but glass! And not even your [SPEAKER] will live to creep, blackened, from its hole to mar the reflection of [MY] passage; the culmination of [MY] Journey. For your destruction is the will of the gods! And I...I am their instrument!"

Haha! I love (Halo 2) Truth! :)

Me too! But wasn't that Halo 3 Truth there?

Yes, and it was that game's cringiest cutscene.

It was the worst cut-scene, but not because of that line. That honor goes to "to war."

locked

3187 views

It was the worst cut-scene, but not because of that line. That honor goes to "to war."

^Correct^

locked

3095 views

"You are, all of you, vermin. Cowering in the dirt, thinking... what, I wonder? That you might escape the coming fire? No. Your world will burn until its surface is but glass! And not even your [SPEAKER] will live to creep, blackened, from its hole to mar the reflection of [MY] passage; the culmination of [MY] Journey. For your destruction is the will of the gods! And I...I am their instrument!"

Haha! I love (Halo 2) Truth! :)

Me too! But wasn't that Halo 3 Truth there?

Yes, and it was that game's cringiest cutscene.

It was the worst cut-scene, but not because of that line. That honor goes to "to war."

Yeah, but we love that line the same way we like "You're tearing me apart Lisa!".

locked

3128 views

"You are, all of you, vermin. Cowering in the dirt, thinking... what, I wonder? That you might escape the coming fire? No. Your world will burn until its surface is but glass! And not even your [SPEAKER] will live to creep, blackened, from its hole to mar the reflection of [MY] passage; the culmination of [MY] Journey. For your destruction is the will of the gods! And I...I am their instrument!"

Haha! I love (Halo 2) Truth! :)

Me too! But wasn't that Halo 3 Truth there?

Yes, and it was that game's cringiest cutscene.

It was the worst cut-scene, but not because of that line. That honor goes to "to war."

Yeah, but we love that line the same way we like "You're tearing me apart Lisa!".

Whatever Cody. Why don't you keep your stupid comments in your pocket.

locked

3114 views

"'Neath the halo of a street lamp
I turned my collar to the cold and damp
When my eyes were stabbed by
The flash of a neon light
That split the night"

"And the people bowed and prayed
To the neon god they made
And the sign flashed out its warning
In the words that it was forming
And the sign said:
"The words of the prophets are
Written on the subway walls
And tenement halls""

locked

3179 views

- No text -

locked

3064 views

https://bungiestore.com/collections/featured/products/d2-spicy-ramen-shop-t-shirt

locked

3100 views

I haven't finished listening, but that tidbit stood out. For me that means essentially no guided games feature in practice, considering that 90% of the raids I've ever played have been heroic.

On the one hand, this is smart. People needing guided games are likely to seek out doing normal, and in the process of learning the raid one hopes they establish relationships with players and can move on with those players to heroic mode.

On the other hand, I'd guess the people involved in clans would be pretty hardcore and almost exclusively interested in playing only heroic raids once they ranked up, so I'm wondering what the population of clans playing normal raids will be over time.

locked

3090 views

According to Lars...

I seriously couldn't find any other thread where this was relevant.

locked

3155 views

According to Lars...

I seriously couldn't find any other thread where this was relevant.

If ever there was a piece of information worth posting to the front page...

locked

3107 views

- No text -

locked

3082 views

I had a similar thought process. Then again, Destiny sherpas are a thing. Hopefully there are enough of them to meet demand.

locked

3124 views

I had a similar thought process. Then again, Destiny sherpas are a thing. Hopefully there are enough of them to meet demand.

Yeah I bet Guided Games will become a popular system for streamers who are looking for fun ways to fill time on their channels.

locked

3082 views

I can see people just setting up searches for fill-ins for normal mode and then switching to heroic. It may turn into people looking for normal and then getting booted if they don't want to do heroic, or people joining and dropping until they find a group that wants to run heroic.

locked

3112 views

I had another thought since I wrote that. This could work well for clan building. Once you got a few people you could hold "auditions" in normal mode every week to find more.

locked

3089 views

Wait do I have to audition for the DBO clan?

Damnit, it's been fun guys, I guess I'll see you around . . .

locked

3052 views

Wait do I have to audition for the DBO clan?

Damnit, it's been fun guys, I guess I'll see you around . . .

Don't worry. They let me in even though I never kill all the shanks on Aksis.

locked

3102 views

- No text -

locked

3081 views

Back to the forum index

RSS Feed of thread

DBO Forums

Kotaku splitscreen interview: Including very honest history (Destiny)

#codywasright

#kermitwasright

#kermitwasright

YOU DID IT! *Sparkle Star Sticker*

Destiny = LOST

Destiny = LOST

The Darkness was inside of us all along!

OMG WE ARE THE FORERUNNERS