D1 PvP != D2 PvP (Destiny)

by MacAddictXIV , Seattle WA, Friday, October 20, 2017, 08:33 (2393 days ago) @ Kahzgul

seems like there is less team shotting in the casual playlist, which is probably due to there being more randos. I do think that going to 4v4 is bad, and it was especially noticeable in iron banner. once one team gets the upper hand, they can team shot all the spawn points.

Yep. And the relatively small map sizes (in part, because of the small team sizes) in general contribute to this.

I think the game skewing towards team tactics is exactly *one* of the changes that needed to be made. It's much more satisfying to me to be able to stick with a teammate and clean up just by virtue of combined fire, than to have one really skilled player run roughshod over the map killing my team while all his clueless blueberries bumble around and occasionally do some work on the objective.

~M

The flip side of this is that, no matter how good of a player you are, you feel mostly worthless if you can't coordinate with your teammates, which essentially ruins solo queue play. I think that is very problematic.

It’s strange... I don’t disagree with 90% of the criticisms leveled against Destiny 2’s PvP game, and yet I had more fun with last week’s Iron Banner than I ever had with IB in D1. Yes, Des2ny’s crucible is punishing as hell for solo players... but let’s not pretend that D1 was any better in this regard. This single biggest difference between the two games in my estimation is that I don’t die to random BS in Des2ny nearly as often as I did in D1. If I die in Des2ny, I almost always know exactly why, and I usually have an idea of what I could have done differently. It’s a far cry from the D1 days of getting killed through walls by opponents who were already dead, or spawning into a sniper lane, or getting obliterated by super after super after super.

Really, my takeaway is that D2 Crucible is much harder than D1, but also much better.

I agree with this. The prevalence of OHKs in D1 made it full of kills that happened (or didn't happen) because of milliseconds of lag. D2 seems far more forgiving in this regard, and it's harder to die to complete garbage. I apologize if it made it sound like I thought D1 was more fun. I think D1 had more depth and a much higher skill ceiling that D2 does, but overall D2 is a big improvement. That being said, it is also far from perfect, and where D1 gave you a chance, even when you were outgunned, D2 gives nothing. That is, perhaps, as it should be, but I feel as if there's a balance to be struck where a 1v2 scenario shouldn't always be a foregone conclusion.

I think this says a lot. D1 PvP was a veteran in what it was. It had been tweaked from a lot of use. But people have to understand that D2 PvP is a new beast entirely and thus it's also brand new. It's going to take bungie a little while to tweak it to best performance. Just like D1 PvP.

I understand it's hard for us to separate D1 vs D2 PvP. Most of us thinkg of D2 PvP as just an upgraded version of D1. But as I said before it's a completely different beast that has to go through it's own refinement process like D1.

Personally, as someone who does much better as a "team player" than going lone wolf, I'm really excited for what PvP is going to become. And this is coming from someone who really, really did not like D1 PvP in general