MEGA::Chapters 5 & 6 (Fan Creations)

by Ragashingo , Official DBO Cryptarch, Monday, September 07, 2015, 15:30 (3363 days ago) @ INSANEdrive

Nice posts (referring to the entire mega thread), well researched, very linked, much content. Not sure how much I'm going to respond to as I've been in a crappy almost anti-DBO mood for forty days now and haven't been posting much but you said some interesting things and I like responding when people put in real effort, so here it goes...

I don't think there ever was a third Raid.

I said as much back when it was announced that there would be no House of Wolves Raid. True, the leaks of the past listed a raid, but there were never any details. I did my own search and couldn't find any more info than what you linked to. As an added bonus I seem to recall digging around in the data mining sites and seeing Prison of Elders listed as a Raid. We do know that the Prison of Elders still has some remnants of Raid coding, for instance!

Here's what I think happened:

- Vault of Glass was developed in secret (even within Bungie!), was finished late (there was a recent video or article I can't find now where Bungie said that they weren't even sure that the Raid would ship, etc) and turned out awesome. Not just because of its challenging mission elements but because of its size and mystery and feeling.

- Crota's End was developed with the lessons of Vault of Glass, was developed a bit more openly, but was also developed a good bit more quickly. Like Vault of Glass it was a sort of journey through a series of mysterious spaces and interesting challenges. It turned out decent but most agree it's lacking a bit of something when compared to the Vault of Glass.

- I think the original plan was for every expansion to have a Raid but not for every Raid to be the same kind of thing. My guess is that the Prison of Elders, the three man arena mode we all know and love was going to be the next Raid. Originally. But after the huge success of the first two Raids, Bungie at some point decided that while some Prison of Elders modes can be quite challenging, it's three man, no journey, no mysterious spaces, fewer teamwork challenges nature meant it would never meet fan expectations of what a Raid is. And that it no longer met Bungie's own expectations of what a Raid is.

It's just what a Raid is was not nailed down when Bungie input the placeholder info that was dug up by fans. And the definition of a Raid was solidified and changed in a way that maybe Bungie did not fully expect when they first made the Director map. So, they made a hard, but correct, decision to not name the Prison of Elders a Raid (because it no longer fit the initial definition) and promised us a new Raid in the Fall.

So to your point, the lack of a third Raid wasn't because Bungie did not realize how important Raids were. Rather, it is because they realized it that they didn't name Prison of Elders as the third Raid.

Yes, Bungie probably didn't tell us about no third Raid soon enough. If my theory about PoE being the third raid is true then they also probably didn't explain why there was no third Raid anywhere near well enough. But, at the same time, I simply cannot understand getting so angry at not receiving a feature that you were never promised. Written and then scathing posts? Headache inducing facepalms? Last straws? Based merely on incomplete, out of date leaked info and unsupported expectation? I am of the opinion that a lot of the scathing criticism that is held against Bungie should really be turned back on players and fans who overreacted and blew this issue way out of proportion.

So again, nice post, good read, lost of interesting points and perspectives, but I think you are wrong to be and to have gotten so angry over the lack of a third Raid. I think what little facts we have show that the Prison of Elder (and not some completely scrapped content we never saw or heard of) was going to be the third Raid until Bungie basically changed its name to maintain the sanctity of what a Raid had become post Vault of Glass and Crota's End. But that's just my cranky opinion...