Weapon sunsetting in action (Destiny)

by MacAddictXIV @, Seattle WA, Wednesday, June 10, 2020, 12:48 (417 days ago) @ Cody Miller

Okay, so you keep taking this to a personal level. Meaning singular gamer. You can't do that when talking about metrics and a massively multiplayer game. Destiny (the thing we are talking about) uses metrics because it's one of the few tools you can use to rationally figure out how much people are having fun in a game…

This is not true. You cannot measure fun. A metric can only measure something tangible like "Players use this weapon most" or "tons of people are dying here". There is no "fun had" stat that can be collected.

Exactly, that's why you use metrics to point out those rough edges and then see if it's fun. If it is, you might have to balance out the rest of the game. If it's fun, but only for a select amount of people? Then you might need to change it. Metrics is a tool, not a be all fixer. Metrics just helps you identify may or may not need to be fixed.

Metrics do not measure fun.

I agree, they don't. But metrics are the best way to figure out if something is working out and thus giving your players the most amount of fun.

Think about a weapon in Destiny. The weapon is overrepresented in the metrics. What would you do? Bungie would nerf. But if people presumably want to have fun, doesn't that mean that more people choosing the weapon indicates they find the weapon most fun? So if you nerf, you remove fun. Is it overpowered? The metric can't really even tell you that. You have to play it and find out what makes the weapon fun to use. And that is entirely experiential.

Okay, here is an example. The bug for shackle shot? I am actually forgetting the name now. The hunter ultimate that pins people. Metrics showed that it was broken, because everyone who could use it was using it. It broke PvP in Destiny. Was it fun? Yeah, for those who had the ability to use it. But for everyone else it literally ruined PvP. Should Bungie not have noticed those metrics that showed that people were exclusively using it? No, they used the metrics to weigh what would be fun for everyone who plays this game. Yes, it's about fun, but fun for everyone, or at least the most people they can make happy. Cause, you can't make everyone happy.

The games that interest me the most, that entertain me, that wow me, that make me remember them, all have a personal touch. Designing by metrics rounds that out to mediocrity. The best games have personality, not consensus. We value art for it's originality. For what's unexpected and unusual in a pleasurable way.

Yep! And I partially agree with that based on what games we are talking about. But to not use a useful tool like metrics would be foolhardy. I'm not saying you should use a hammer to cut a piece of wood in half. I'm saying that Metrics are useful, don't just ignore it.

Complete thread:

 RSS Feed of thread